StealthP3D
Well-Known Member
True, and I trust you know they reversed their decision. But it does reflect poorly on management to not be able to see how much backlash there would be.
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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
- Start date
True, and I trust you know they reversed their decision. But it does reflect poorly on management to not be able to see how much backlash there would be.
Yup if you follow that lawsuit by that former employee, Rivian was fully aware that they couldn't sell their vehicles at the price they originally listed them at and were just trying to gain a higher reservation count to increase their valuation. I don't know which company is more a fraud at this point, Lucid or Rivian.
back when they first IPO’d and we’re already talking about building a second factory, I was calling out that they were doing everything they could to pump the valuation of the company. Made zero sense to start building a second factory when they hadn’t even started production. How this whole pricing thing has gone down combined with that lawsuit, seems pretty clear Rivian's management were doing everything they could do to pump the valuation.
Then when you consider who stood to benefit from a sky high Rivian valuation, namely Ford and Amazon, it's pretty clear. At least to me
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JRP3
Hyperactive Member
FWIW, one of my hard core "car guy" friends is a huge Ford fan. Owns a mustang, Ford signs all over his garage etc.
He just bought a used Model S. Why? I'm sure I rubbed off on him a little, though I don't preach much to friends because nobody likes that, but I think it was mostly about the cool factor and charging. He had almost no knowledge of the third party fast charger networks but knew that Tesla superchargers were everywhere. So far he loves it and has already started buying Tesla merch.
Don’t be too harsh. People buy car mostly due to the look, just look at the sales of ICE cars.
thesmokingman
Active Member
That is weird, lots/most of ICE cars are horrifically bad looking.
You don't have to preach. Just give lots of test drives. The car's performance is its own commentary.
mars_or_bust
Member
CLK350
Member
Elon in full feisty attack mode post POTUS SOTU slight, he also digs out this pearl of an interview by Andrew Sorkin (same newscaster in that CNBC Tesla positive segment) - in that interview Barra's answer to Sorkin's question "Don't Tesla employees have the highest compensation plan of all car factory workers" or sthg like that, Barra stumbles saying she'd have to verify that and compensation is not simple, you have to include benefits, insurance etc.
Sorkin lost the opportunity to mention that including stock options benefits Tesla workers definitely are on average way better paid than any other carmaker worker.
So do we put Sorkin in the "Tesla fan" category? ( I really don't watch mainstream things much these days)
[OT] I also didn't know where Jon Stewart had gone, he did a top job nailing Gary Gensler (GG) SEC's head .. getting GG to basically admit the SEC is useless because it has its hands tied, and the public is f.d and there is nothing he can do (does?) about it
No time, but somebody ought make a transcript of that discussion of GG being grilled mercilessly by Jon - epic
Some comments on Reddit
Honestly the first time I’ve seen the chair of the SEC being called out and ask what’s the use of this useless agency? Let’s be honest what’s there to expect from a former Goldman Sachs!
Either Gary just said he knows, or said all of us have always been ****ed and will continue being ****ed....
Even its chairperson agrees that SEC is useless.
Jon/GG pointed to the SEC being effectively neutered, not being able to do their job -- not enough staff and cash, and bound by regulation from the very people they're trying to regulate.
Dave said it best. Simplify. If the system is so corrupt and so complex that the current SEC can't fix it. Then you can either do 1) build up the SEC to fight fire with fire, or 2) tear down the system so the current SEC has the resources/bandwidth to regulate.
Using the analogy from the episode, he's the sheriff of the drug dealers (wall street) but the boss of his boss (congress) are the drug dealers (wall street/lobbying). They're a civil regulatory agency, they have no real power. All they can do is fine them. If they try to match the fine to the ill gotten gains then these major players will out spend them and drag it out in court for years, bleeding the SEC's resources. Imagine a system where the SEC got to put the money from these fines into their own budget.
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Definitely the Dos Equis guy.
dhrivnak
Active Member
I would give Rivian the benefit of the doubt. I still remember the $92,000 Roadster, the $49,990 Model S, and the $35,000 Model 3 none of which never really happened in any volume. Do you want to take a bet on the $35,000 CyberTruck?
thesmokingman
Active Member
Gdamn, Elon is such a badass.
You should probably go back and re-read the letter Musk sent out to Roadster customers and refamiliarize with the details because it wasn't that simple.
I don't know why the Model 3 is brought up as an example. It was available to both reservation holders and non-reservation holders (briefly), I very distinctly recall how I could have bought one at the time.
As for the single motor Cybertruck ($39k not $35k), it's hard to know what Tesla is going to do. They've already said it won't ship until after the more popular configurations ship, so about 4-5 years in the future. That's a generation or 2 of improvements and cost reductions in the future. Whether it ever sees the light of day remains to be seen. Most likely by the time it is due to ship there won't be anyone waiting for it.
$39,900 actually, but there is also this little thing called "inflation". By the time (several years from now I'm sure) that they actually produce a single-motor Cybertruck they would have a very good excuse to raise the price to adjust for inflation, IMO. Or, they could just keep pushing it off until battery costs come down, but with inflation still rising it may be a losing battle.
dhrivnak
Active Member
I never said it was simple or easy. And if Tesla wa really willing to sell a $35,000 Model 3 why not allow that on line? Rather than call a number that is rarely answered? All I really meant to say is Rivian is not the only company trying to raise prices and Tesla did similar. And I stand corrected on the CyberTruck but I still doubt we will see them for $39,900
TheTalkingMule
Distributed Energy Enthusiast
Sorry, I'm sure this has been asked.....
If I have a trimotor Cybertruck reservation from back in the day, do I have to do anything or is that now automagically a quad motor reservation?
If I have a trimotor Cybertruck reservation from back in the day, do I have to do anything or is that now automagically a quad motor reservation?
CLK350
Member
Not worth glorifying further Rogozin's words - actually Rogozin's record isn't great /s
And I see Elon already stuffed Rogozin's latest broomstick tantrum
Now if somebody can dig out the first insults Elon got from the Russians when they basically mock insulted him as he tried to buy a couple Russian ICBM's after his Paypal days, wanting to land a small demonstration habitat on Mars to re energize NASA and the US interest in space exploration..
Good thing to in hindsight they rebuffed him .. that got him thinking hard(er) and coming up with his resolve to try and build himself a reusable rocket.. and the rest (SpaceX) is history.
Yet somehow the Model 3 didn't see 60%+ cancellations.
Tesla's way of "raising prices" is generally to aggressively steer people to more profitable products. Often by simply delaying the less expensive product. If you wanted that $35k Model 3, you had to wait. Model Y was similar.
Also, common Tesla tactic:
Tesla: "Look at these amazing upgrades you are getting! A relative bargain for the $6000 extra you are paying."
Rivian: "We're bumping the prices you pay for your truck... but you can get this much crappier truck for the same price!"
Nobody really knows WTF is going on with Cybertruck reservations. It's very likely you will have the chance to move to the quad motor config. Solid chance the price will be higher. Lots of speculation people want to pass off as fact out there regarding this.
thesmokingman
Active Member
Here it comes, oil and gas prices surging. Just heard that San Fran has gone over $5 average, first US city to do so.
www.npr.org
Oil prices surge as fears about Russian crude supplies intensify
The global benchmark topped $115 briefly on Wednesday, just days after it crossed the triple-digit mark for the first time in seven years.
www.npr.org
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