Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[unk45]

My 2cents is that currently there is still a lot of misinformation and misunderstanding out there about EVs, which will persist for a while until greater adoption occurs and more people either own one or know someone who owns one. In the meantime, advertising could help bridge that gap in perception faster, and help speed up the process of public understanding catching up to reality (as well as boost sales).

It seems everyone who's never bought advertising thinks it is a good idea.
Everyone with actual experience knows it is a waste of time if one has excellent marketing.
As @Right_Said_Fred just pointed out there si no need fro advertising if free promotion and the rest of the P's are well dressed which they are.
Somehow people think there is an awareness problem, although among any conceivable prospects there is near total awareness, and unaided recall is nearly 100%. After all if anybody here knows anything about advertising, the best use is to advance unaided recall among prospects, with local print a useful way to advance local dealer visits.

I understand that everyone knows everything about marketing. My introductory Marketing course, when I taught one, had 100% knowledge until they were tested. when the sudden realization happened. FWIW, for regulated entities it is often popular to advertise in capitol cities to reach legislators who also know everything so some companies choose to give them what they want. That one is wildly popular among defense contractors with a single buyer who knows them well, but the approvers need reassurance./s

There is a reason why broadcast advertising is mostly for geriatrics and politicians. Excluding the Super Bowl of course, when the audience is almost entirely the company itself and shareholders plus advertising agencies. NOT /S ... this one is true.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

The only thing advertisement will do is informing the price...which MSM is already doing wonders for Tesla with a negative twist. Reliability and the finish of the products cannot be advertised through the media but are best advertised through word of mouth. Every brand new car is reliable. You never see car commercials talking about reliability or how well their cars are screwed together. Commercials now all follow the Apple style of advertising, which is to sell a lifestyle and what you stand for. Do a shot game whenever you see an SUV climbing a mountain..you'll be drunk within the hour.

Car commercials do talk about reliability, just indirectly and somewhat weaselly.

Subaru certainly push that their old vehicles are still on the road.

Commercials have long followed the vehicle-is-freedom model.

 

[SO16]

Very disappointing. Elon going further and further down the rabbit hole of the extreme right-wing it seems. I'm always amazed when otherwise brilliant, compassionate, and successful people are taken in by and subscribe to this world view. Does this all go back to the Fremont COVID shut-down drama or Biden’s refusal to recognize Tesla’s leading role in the EV transition? Whatever brought on this change in Elon it seems recent (last couple years). I’m guessing he always had libertarian tendencies, but it's frankly taken an ugly turn as of late. I’ve been an investor and holdler since 2013. I wouldn’t divest simply because I disagree with Elon’s political views, but some of what he putting out there has me questioning his judgement and ability to rationalize. Brillance is not an inoculation against propaganda and indoctrination unfortunately.

I’m willing to reserve judgment until AFTER I watch the interview.

 

[2daMoon]

I think we have to agree to disagree here. I believe there is space for educational marketing, based on my gut feelings and personal experience. I don't have data to back this up, and I don't think there are many precedents allowing us to make an educated guess on whether circumventing advertising would work - I can' think of a single well-known company that pulled this off, but I can't say for certain Tesla won't be able to. But I very much appreciate a logical argument.

The educational marketing would be effective in the way you say. I agree about that. It is just that this is a card Tesla can keep up the sleeve to be used when it is needed.

Right now, it isn't needed. There is a working balance between production and demand. If this ever becomes unbalanced enough to warrant it, they can play that card. It is a defensive move and Tesla is playing offense now.

For example: Some people look at increasing inventory and think this is a problem. It is only a problem if production is static, or falling. As long as the ratio of inventory to production is stable both will continue to rise together. Most of Tesla's "inventory" is on ships, trucks, trains, and at service centers being prepared for delivery to a customer.

Legacy OEM's inventory of ICE vehicles is piling up on dealer lots and on leased parking while production is going down. Yet, the MSM compare these, or, misrepresent Tesla's growing inventory as if it is a bad thing. Perhaps this is what leads some Tesla supporters to think that it is time to educate the masses.

If Tesla were to do so, it could extend delivery times considerably as production would not be able to ramp up fast enough to service the demand growth.

This is my concern with applying educational material designed specifically to counter FUD. It may result in fun new ways to generate more FUD.

 

[JRP3]

Think about it. If at hypothetical $60k a piece, a Model Y still has 2 million buyers a year, why would Tesla want to cut prices? The logical thing to do is to cut prices once production volume exceeds demand at the current price levels.

Think about this, Tesla is likely to be introducing a refreshed 3/Y in the near future, what do you think will happen to existing inventory when that happens? I think Tesla is moving the old designs slightly down market in preparation for the new, which will create all sorts of demand when they are released.

 

[M|S|M MYP]

Think about this, Tesla is likely to be introducing a refreshed 3/Y in the near future, what do you think will happen to existing inventory when that happens? I think Tesla is moving the old designs slightly down market in preparation for the new, which will create all sorts of demand when they are released.

There will always be buyers of the 3/Y, new and old. If the price difference is big enough, i would even opt for the non-refreshed model based on the fact that i personally do not need the latest/greatest, but just one of the safest and almost latest tech vehicles at a comfortable price point.

 

[JRP3]

There will always be buyers of the 3/Y, new and old. If the price difference is big enough, i would even opt for the non-refreshed model based on the fact that i personally do not need the latest/greatest, but just one of the safest and almost latest tech vehicles at a comfortable price point.

That's my point, there has to be a price differential, otherwise why pay the same for the old version unless you need a vehicle immediately and can't wait?

 

[Oveeus]

I read some of the members here discussing about supply, demand and price.

There’s an inherent correlation between the 3, but they are not completely relational. This is something people need to remember.

Supply is how much the supplier, Tesla in this case, can supply at any give supply and prices of it’s necessary parts.

Demand is how much willingness the market is willing to buy at any given price.

Price is just an arbitrary number that dictates the tam, margin and strategy.

The idea that ads can increase demand can be true. But it’s still limited by the amount of money people has. There’s a crazy demand for Rolex. Probably more so than the price Rolex can ask for their watches. But the pricing strategy is also in place to create a sense of exclusivity and branding of a luxury good.

Tesla has demand. Their products are desirable. And the strategy is to adjust it so that Tesla can grow with the nice 20% margin while shipping the volume it wants to achieve at current time.

What Tesla is doing right now is to lower the price to address its viable demand (price where people who wants them can pay for them). It will continue its path to lower the production cost, add production and achieve even higher tam.

It makes little to none sense to advertise now to add demand if there’s No viable demand as in people can’t afford them and Tesla cannot produce enough.

Tesla doesn’t sit With months worth of inventories in dealership like legacy makers do. This has huge effect on its profitability. So, by decreasing cost by being able to build more efficiently, it lowers the price, address the viable demand and use that margin to develop even lower cost vehicles, add more production and satisfy even more viable demands.

 

[Hiline]

Think about this, Tesla is likely to be introducing a refreshed 3/Y in the near future, what do you think will happen to existing inventory when that happens? I think Tesla is moving the old designs slightly down market in preparation for the new, which will create all sorts of demand when they are released.

Agreed. Again, nothing incompatible about what you said and what I said. If Tesla expects demand for the current lineup to come under production volume, cutting prices is an appropriate move.

 

[Webeevdrivers]

I wonder if these leaked videos of the model 3 remake will Osborne model 3 purchases at all.

When are they expected to make production line changes?

 

[NicoV]

Hmm, sorry guys, bad link which leads to an old page. Rumor seems legit though.

Here’s a different article about the same thing. Seems legit: Tesla creates new Model 3 for company car drivers

 

[Ogre]

Here in the US, Teslas are selling for more than what they sold for 2 years ago.

** Less than they were selling for during the 2021-2022 pricing bubble **

But more than what they were selling for 2 years ago. So in the US anyhow, the big question is what Teslas costs are relative to early 2021 when prices looked like they do now. IRA manufacturing credits will likely offset a lot of inflation.

Is this the case in Europe and China as well?

I'm just trying to frame this whole discussion over prices in my head. I find the US side of things a little farcical myself. With so-called analysts screaming about price cuts even as it is very clear costs are coming down and we're still selling at a premium to what we sold for not long ago.

 

[Ogre]

Here’s a different article about the same thing. Seems legit: Tesla creates new Model 3 for company car drivers

Good to see Tesla actively chasing the fleet market and developing tools for fleet owners.

I can see these features coming to the Cybertruck as well. Lots of pickups and vans in fleets.

 

[Featsbeyond50]

Removed amazing post.

 

[NicoV]

Good to see Tesla actively chasing the fleet market and developing tools for fleet owners.

I can see these features coming to the Cybertruck as well. Lots of pickups and vans in fleets.

Yes, it’s the first time I hear that Tesla has a dedicated B2B and fleet portal.

 

[WMTribe90]

Deleted

 

[Cal1]

Very disappointing. Elon going further and further down the rabbit hole of the extreme right-wing it seems. I'm always amazed when otherwise brilliant, compassionate, and successful people are taken in by and subscribe to this world view. Does this all go back to the Fremont COVID shut-down drama or Biden’s refusal to recognize Tesla’s leading role in the EV transition? Whatever brought on this change in Elon it seems recent (last couple years). I’m guessing he always had libertarian tendencies, but it's frankly taken an ugly turn as of late. I’ve been an investor and holdler since 2013. I wouldn’t divest simply because I disagree with Elon’s political views, but some of what he putting out there has me questioning his judgement and ability to rationalize. Brillance is not an inoculation against propaganda and indoctrination unfortunately.

You’re not alone. I’m in the same boat. Since 2012 I’ve purchased multiple MS’s, thousands of shares and completely bought into the visions. Then he takes this right turn and now I am seriously reconsidering my CT order. No adult conscious black man would just ride along. It will kill me to buy something else just because I feel so strongly about Musk. We’ll see where I‘m at later this summer when the CT starts production and all those over priced Lightnings really start to drop in value.

His personal actions and opinions do affect how is see my company and it’s future. Can’t tell you how many people I’ve talked to that hate Musk because of his actions and will not buy anything Tesla. His arrogance makes him think Tesla is immune to this but he is wrong. Kind of like when he sold billions of $ of Tesla shares and bought Twitter. Instead of hovering around $300 we’re struggling to get back above $200/share. But don’t worry Elon says he’ll make it right. I guess that‘ll happen in about two weeks.

 

[khill]

IMO, Tesla will soon be seen as "Best Value" automotive brand. Not advertising and specifically stating that dollars saved on advertising are put into increasing the value of the car will contribute heavily into solidifying that brand image.

Tesla already IS the “Best Value”. The only question we are debating is how many people actually know this.

 

[WMTribe90]

What specific views of Elon's do you not like?

It has nothing to do with my personal views of Elon or his political beliefs, which are all over the place. As an investor I care about the brand. Appearing on Tucker Carlson’s show is sure to piss off one if not both ends of the political spectrum needlessly. There are plenty of actual news platforms, including Fox News, Elon could engage to converse with the public. Elon is making a statement with this appearance wether he intends to or not. Tucker’s show is on the editorial/opinion/entertainment side of the Fox “news” network, politically charged and controversial. I simply see it as poor judgement and likely damaging to the brand and this opinion has nothing to do with Elon’s political beliefs or mine.

 

[Hiline]

Tesla already IS the “Best Value”. The only question we are debating is how many people actually know this.

Honestly I would not try to continue this debate, because all we have is anecdotes - there is no data showing what percentage of consumers perceive of Tesla as the best value. I'd love to see a survey with questions like: 'How much do you think the cheapest Tesla costs?', 'Do you think a Tesla is safer than a Toyota?', 'Do you think you can drive across the United States in a Tesla?', 'How many Tesla charging stations do you think there are in the US?' etc. Until then your guess is as good as mine, and there's no point in continuing this fruitless back-and-forth with posters who hold their opinions as strongly as you do yours.