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Trusting Tesla Autopolit

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#41
Westweb said:
One of the most common accidents, at least in my experience. Is when someone makes a left turn when it is not safe or clear, cutting off an oncoming car.
Why can't the sensor(s) detect that when you have your left turn signal on and you are accelerating, to check for oncoming car(s) and if not clean either stop the car or alert the driver.
Would seem simple to implement with the existing equipment built into the car already. Would sense the speed of the oncoming traffic along with distance.
Must be missing something.
Click to expand...

You are. From one of the other Autopilot threads...
Will Auto-Pilot (Steering) Be Delayed Due To Legal Restrictions? (NY Times Article) - Page 6
ecarfan said:
Elon has been very clear that the Auto Pilot isn't for surface streets, urban environments, or rural roads. It is for major freeways and highways. The S will be able to drive itself on those types of roads, including transitioning between different freeways and highways, in reasonably good weather (not in heavy rain, sleet, or snow).
Click to expand...
 
#42
This will be a most useful and advantageous addition... Cruise control on a non-TACC car is probably much more dangerous that having a sophisticated system watching and driving for you... will still need to be alert and attentive, but it will certainly eliminate a lot of driving fatigue on long boring stretches like HWY 5 in CA...
 
#43
I predict three days max after 7.0 before we hear the first news report about a Tesla being stopped by the police for going down the freeway at 70mph with the seat weight sensor bypassed, nobody at the wheel and the driver napping in the trunk.
 
#44
mhpr262 said:
I predict three days max after 7.0 before we hear the first news report about a Tesla being stopped by the police for going down the freeway at 70mph with the seat weight sensor bypassed, nobody at the wheel and the driver napping in the trunk.
Click to expand...

I'm not worried about this. What I am worried about is an accident that causes an overreaction by law makers and diminishes the usefulness of the technology.
 
#48
cgiGuy said:
I'm not sure he clearly said no hands.. it sounds like he repeated back what the reported said when asked, "Some competitors require you to put your hand on the wheel every now and again. It sounds like you don't have that in mind here." Elon's reply was, "Um.. we don't have that in mind.. um.. " Then he goes on to talk about if someone falls asleep you don't want it to not steer because that's backwards. Then goes on later to say "If we see that there's no hand force on the steering wheel for some period of time, we might issue a visual and auditory alert."

So, what it sounds like to me is that he's saying they may require hand force on the wheel or you'll get warnings, but if your hand is off the wheel it will still steer--incase you're sleeping or distracted. That means IF you take your hands off the steering wheel it's not going to like it (and will nag you), but it's not going to disable autopilot and coast you into a tree. Sounds like hand(s) required in that scenario.
Click to expand...

Well, when Elon says "we don't have that in mind", I take that literally. My take was that Tesla does not intend to require drivers to put their hands on the wheel, but the car may issue an alert to make sure you are awake and paying attention in that scenario. I'm not sure I would like the nagging, though.

- - - Updated - - -

lphe said:
Drivers could easily fall asleep at the wheel with auto pilot engaged. The car will need to monitor the driver to make sure they are still alert.
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, if you are deaf - as my Spouse is - no alert will help other than a vibration of the driver's seat. Tesla should consider that.
 
#49
I think they should just let us activate it whenever, wherever, hands, no hands, etc just like cruise control. If I'm an idiot and let the car drive off a cliff or into a school yard, that's my fault. I'd happily sign such a disclaimer to avoid any pointless nagging.
 
#50
Historically, Tesla has done the minimum amount of nagging required by law. Hopefully that will continue.

wk057 said:
I think they should just let us activate it whenever, wherever, hands, no hands, etc just like cruise control. If I'm an idiot and let the car drive off a cliff or into a school yard, that's my fault. I'd happily sign such a disclaimer to avoid any pointless nagging.
Click to expand...
 
#51
There was a lawsuit by a person who purchased a new "Motor Home" (Caravan to our European readers), got on the highway, clicked cruise, and went in the back to make a sandwich... crashed... and then sued the Manufacturer and Dealer for not properly educating her that this sequence was not OK.

I don't know the outcome, but I hope it was negative for the driver and positive for the manufacturer.


People tend to forget that companies do not have any money. Or, if you prefer, the only money they have comes from their customers (us!). McDonald's didn't pay the millions for the infamous hot coffee case, we all paid it as we purchased from McD over the next few years. And so forth. Of course, I'm preaching to the choir here... :)
 
#53
They don't put up any sort of disclaimer screen about using the nav in motion, or restrict the web, or anything else, so I can't imagine they will restrict anyone in this way-- especially since Infiniti already allows hands off operation.

Someone once posted that taking on this sort of nuisance liability is one of Tesla's competitive advantages, and I agree.

mike-415 said:
It will be interesting to see if they allow lane keeping without hands on the wheel. I imagine Elon is giving his legal team a fair number of sleepless nights.
Click to expand...
 
#54
CHG-ON said:
Re: emergency braking, I get false alarms all the time. The last thing I was is for the car to slam on its brakes when not needed, causing the poor guy behind me to plow into my rear. I set mine to the most sensitive setting to see what it would do. But I have not found a consistency yet. It falses when I am approaching a large object, like a truck, at a moderate speed with plenty of time for braking and has not gone off when somebody has pulled right in front of me or slams their brakes on and I have to brake hard. It seems to react much more to larger vehicles and not small ones. So I think more work is needed here.
Click to expand...

You don't have emergency braking yet. You have collision detection. We have no reason to believe that the emergency braking is going to function based on what is currently detected as a possible collision by the collision detection system. In fact in another thread someone pointed out that a literal interpretation of the language used in the description of the emergency braking functionality says that it will reduce the speed before an unavoidable collision, or something very close to that. The language makes it sound like the emergency braking functionality only applies when there is going to be an accident, and helps reduce the impact of that accident. It sounds very different from the collision detection we have now.

- - - Updated - - -

caps04 said:
I do trust for it's designed for: Highway driving. I have done a few hundred miles where it braked and accelerated as expected. Again, the blue cruise control thing has to be on and in those situations I don't see any reason it would fail. Now if it's on cruise and there is a car stopped dead ahead in my path, I wouldn't wait for the chance that TACC will get a lock on it just in time so in those cases, I would take over. But that's not the scenario I'm talking about (TACC has to have a lock on first).
Click to expand...

The release notes on TACC state that there are times that TACC may not be able to brake enough to avoid a collision. So even if TACC has a target car, you should be prepared to brake. Below is the relevant excerpt from the 6.1 release notes:

--
TACC only has a limited amount of deceleration. Therefore, you should always oversee the systemand intervene if corrective action is needed. In particular, Forward Collision Warning notificationsmay be displayed when TACC cannot handle particular scenarios.
--

- - - Updated - - -

Westweb said:
One of the most common accidents, at least in my experience. Is when someone makes a left turn when it is not safe or clear, cutting off an oncoming car.
Click to expand...

You mean like this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIoxGMZpiUY
 
#55
Danal said:
There was a lawsuit by a person who purchased a new "Motor Home" (Caravan to our European readers), got on the highway, clicked cruise, and went in the back to make a sandwich... crashed... and then sued the Manufacturer and Dealer for not properly educating her that this sequence was not OK.

I don't know the outcome, but I hope it was negative for the driver and positive for the manufacturer.


People tend to forget that companies do not have any money. Or, if you prefer, the only money they have comes from their customers (us!). McDonald's didn't pay the millions for the infamous hot coffee case, we all paid it as we purchased from McD over the next few years. And so forth. Of course, I'm preaching to the choir here... :)
Click to expand...

This is classic, urban-legend BS. http://www.snopes.com/autos/techno/cruise.asp
 
#56
The system my Audi has will bring the car to a complete stop, but it does not work 100% of the time.
I can say the times that it has saved me it worked as advertised, but I have had instances when I expected the system to intervene and it did not.
Of course it may be that the car felt I was in complete control in the times it didnt take over. Regardless, Id never own a car without collision avoidance, its a life saving feature.



Andyw2100 said:
You don't have emergency braking yet. You have collision detection. We have no reason to believe that the emergency braking is going to function based on what is currently detected as a possible collision by the collision detection system. In fact in another thread someone pointed out that a literal interpretation of the language used in the description of the emergency braking functionality says that it will reduce the speed before an unavoidable collision, or something very close to that. The language makes it sound like the emergency braking functionality only applies when there is going to be an accident, and helps reduce the impact of that accident. It sounds very different from the collision detection we have now.

- - - Updated - - -



The release notes on TACC state that there are times that TACC may not be able to brake enough to avoid a collision. So even if TACC has a target car, you should be prepared to brake. Below is the relevant excerpt from the 6.1 release notes:

--
TACC only has a limited amount of deceleration. Therefore, you should always oversee the systemand intervene if corrective action is needed. In particular, Forward Collision Warning notificationsmay be displayed when TACC cannot handle particular scenarios.
--

- - - Updated - - -



You mean like this?
Stupidly Impatient Trucker Causes Major Accident On Highway - YouTube
Click to expand...
 
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