Huge difference between hitting a slippery white line when on the limit cornering vs casually drifting across motorway lanes! Tyres wouldn't be anywhere near their traction limit at motorway speeds.
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Tyre slip over wet white lines
- Thread starter WheresMyCar
- Start date
Huge difference between hitting a slippery white line when on the limit cornering vs casually drifting across motorway lanes! Tyres wouldn't be anywhere near their traction limit at motorway speeds.
Ive had an ICE car break traction at motorway speeds before in mixed conditions. It was quite a lightweight car though.
That sparked my interest
'We' as a fan or 'We' as someone involved in F1? Putting 2+2 together I wondered being in MK if you had any involvement with RBR or probably Stewart Racing given the last time F1 used either Michelin or Bridgestone?
That sparked my interest
'We' as a fan or 'We' as someone involved in F1? Putting 2+2 together I wondered being in MK if you had any involvement with RBR or probably Stewart Racing given the last time F1 used either Michelin or Bridgestone?
I was a Test/Race Engineer at BAR (Honda), then a Senior Race Engineer at Jaguar (Ex Stewart), then Chief Development Engineer at Williams. Then retired in 2009 at 40 lol.
It's fair to say we did a LOT of tyre testing in the 2000s. I worked on both sides of the Michelin/Bridgestone fence at various points along the way. Michelin were far more open with the teams than Bridgestone, who really only worked closely with Ferrari. I worked closely with Pascal Vasselon at Michelin for quite a few years, both in F1 and before that in BTCC in the mid-late 90s. The Michelin engineers were great to work with and it's a shame they left F1 in the end.
Maybe I'm just not that sensitive, but I don't notice any sort of "twitching" while simply changing lanes on a motorway. Unless it's so wet that aquaplaning is a possibility and in that case it wouldn't really matter about the white lines. I strongly suspect the OP is just getting freaked out by lane assist as others have mentioned early on.
MrBadger
Badger out
You probably knew a good mate of mine then. Alex (Lex) V. He was ex Minardi (Alonso's and Webbers race engineer), Jaguar (possibly Justin Wilsons engineer but that may have also been Minardi), Tyrrell (Rossets and Takagi race engineer), Honda Racing Development then a break to be latterly Mercedes and now gone back to Alpha Tauri. I remember him telling me about this new guy they had complaining about oversteer at 190mph - turned out it was a very young Alonso.
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Such a shame the way the F1 tyre situation has moved in more recent years. I would love it to be competing tyre manufacturers (again) actually trying to make the very best tyres ... instead of tyres from a single manufacturer which, in a sense, appear to have "weaknesses" intentionally built in!
Did I mention mold release agents,
The Technical adviser was Steve Dolby who worked for Michelin at the time and I never heard a question he couldn't answer, it was truly a privilege to have him at our meetings.
I do agree with you regarding the old tyre with very very little tread and the new tyre with tall tread blocks, the new tyres will feel squirrely and will need their surface scrubbed in. Of course the clever trousers will tell you a couple of burnouts will do the trick but I do not have a lot of time for those sort of people. And while that is all very well for the driving gods out there I do not claim to be one of them so I like to ascertain the cars new handling behaviour in a more gentle fashion by driving appropriately, but maybe that's just me.
I will continue to observe his advice and for the record 100 miles in my experience is conservative and can be accomplished in half a days driving, hardly a massive impediment to ensure the only part of your car that is in contact (normally) with the road is at full operating condition. How many times have you seen tyres on vehicles driving along where the fitter can't even be bothered to remove the sticker. Similarly I have seen tyres with more than a few miles still with the whiskers on them, admittedly they have had a shave but whiskers none the less.
Good luck
P. S. maybe a major manufacturer could bring out a set of tyres pre-scrubbed with 4mm of tread from new, would be handy for track work.
Gosh you sound like a total maniac on a bike, new set of tyres every 1,000 miles , do you still have your Yamahe FS1-E?
Have I made you laugh yet
Didn't I read another thread on here recently where there was excess vibration and it looks like it might be down to out of round tyres which despite being balanced repeatedly seem to cure themselves with a bit of driving?
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Actually gentle scrubbing in of new tyres is the best way to get the optimum long term performance and wear. Loading and heating them too quickly from new can cause quite a lot of irreversible compound damage.
No I don't actually know this guy but must have brushed shoulders a few times over that period. I know for sure he was never at Jaguar and I didn't know any of the Minardi guys. Most people I know in F1 are from RBR, Merc, Williams and a few of the Ferrari ex pats.
Couldn't agree more and it applies to a lot more components such as bearings, brake pads (different bedding in procedure admittedly), batteries, gear assemblies etc. etc.
Given the choice of a car considerately run in with respect and one run in by Johnny Mc' twit who doesn't own it and doesn't care, well I know which one I would want to buy.
Absolutely agree. Heat cycling is much more important than even some 'enthusiasts' realise but if done right it doesn't have to take 100 miles. It's the same a bedding in brake pads, which is another subject which seems to be full of misinformation.
I still maintain that the biggest felt difference between an old, worn treaded tyre and a brand new one is the tread blocks moving around more (assuming everything else is identical).
There's a another myth about homologated tyres not mattering too. i.e. Porsche owners saying don't bother with N0, N1 tyres, just get the cheaper non-N marked ones. This is also happening with Tesla T0 tyres now. The fact is, there are often significant differences in the construction of these tyres, as I discovered when a tyre place fitted non N-marked Bridgestones to a 911 I owned. The first fast corner I took after driving away was much more exciting than usual.
MrBadger
Badger out
Defo at Jaguar. I even went to one of their Silverstone tests. I think I still have my Jaguar pit pass and probably photos somewhere. Eddie Irvine testing that day and iirc another but too long ago to remember details but in pit experience unforgettable.
Ah okay, must have been pre 2002 then when I joined. There was no sign of him while I was there. I was Pedro DLR's engineer in 2002, while Gerry Hughes ran Eddie's car, then I engineered Mark Webber for 2003/04, with Stefano Sordo running the other car with Pizzonia and then later Wilson. I left when Jag became RBR at the end of 2004. Probably not my best move ever in hindsight
!Absolutely agree. Heat cycling is much more important than even some 'enthusiasts' realise but if done right it doesn't have to take 100 miles. It's the same a bedding in brake pads, which is another subject which seems to be full of misinformation.
I still maintain that the biggest felt difference between an old, worn treaded tyre and a brand new one is the tread blocks moving around more (assuming everything else is identical).
There's a another myth about homologated tyres not mattering too. i.e. Porsche owners saying don't bother with N0, N1 tyres, just get the cheaper non-N marked ones. This is also happening with Tesla T0 tyres now. The fact is, there are often significant differences in the construction of these tyres, as I discovered when a tyre place fitted non N-marked Bridgestones to a 911 I owned. The first fast corner I took after driving away was much more exciting than usual.
The thing I notice most on brand new tyres vs fully worn is the difference in road noise. New tyres are soooo much quieter. Agree on the tread blocks moving though. Can definitely feel that.
I just go off the load ratings for tyre construction. When I replaced the tyres on my MX I went for a different tyre (newer Michelin model than the OEM fitment) but it had identical load rating and was fine. With Porsche I always go for N-rated variants as you say.
