V2G support in Backup Gateway/Switch

[slcasner]

He said nobody used it which was a reason
to not continue the feature?

I am one of those Roadster owners. The inverter in the 2008 Roadster was bidirectional because it was a digital reimplementation of the A/C Propulsion drive system. The A/C Propulsion drive system was inherently bidirectional and was, in fact, operational in some V2G experiments using several of the Mini-E cars after they were reclaimed by BMW at the end of the program.

However, there was not any way for us Roadster owners to actually use the bidirectional capability. It would have required additional functionality in the car's firmware, to which we had no access, of course. So Elon's statement was rather disingenuous.

 

[Rocket_man]

I havent looked into this closely at all, but I saw a video somewhere that when a teardown was done of the charge ports in the model 3 / Y, first someone reported that the compnents there were capable of bi directional charging, then someone else came back and said "no thats not correct, and heres why".

Its my understanding that bi directional charging ports are not installed in the car, which would be the first step in doing something like this. The charge port / chargers are also linked by all the software running the car, so its not like you could easily hack in another charge port or something. That would only work if tesla offered this in some cars but not others.

Thats as far as I got looking into it as I was wondering if I would be able to use my car to supplement my powerwalls, and the answer was "not likely in its current configuration".

I still figure at "some point" tesla will use this as a selling feature for those of us that have powerwalls and gateway, but this discussion doesnt normally go there. It normally goes to people expecting to be able to use it like in the ford lightning commercial, and railing against tesla as to why they cant.

This might be the source? There is a video in this article that looks at an older Model 3 board and comes to the conclusion it cannot do bi-directional charging. This article is more than a few years old. I can see a lot of benefit to having this capability. The Tesla GW could be that device that protects the grid during an outage. If you also had Solar connected to the same GW it could more precisely use the solar to charge your car. In an extended outage it could augment your PW's or allow you to have less PWs installed if you could use the car's battery. In a house without solar it could replace a gas backup generator without all the overhead of maintaining a gas generator. Also it could be used as a car-to-car charging option to be used in a pinch. Lots of upsides. Other EV manufactures are doing some of these things and Tesla looks like they are behind the competition.

Electrek article

 

[h2ofun]

This might be the source? There is a video in this article that looks at an older Model 3 board and comes to the conclusion it cannot do bi-directional charging. This article is more than a few years old. I can see a lot of benefit to having this capability. The Tesla GW could be that device that protects the grid during an outage. If you also had Solar connected to the same GW it could more precisely use the solar to charge your car. In an extended outage it could augment your PW's or allow you to have less PWs installed if you could use the car's battery. In a house without solar it could replace a gas backup generator without all the overhead of maintaining a gas generator. Also it could be used as a car-to-car charging option to be used in a pinch. Lots of upsides. Other EV manufactures are doing some of these things and Tesla looks like they are behind the competition.

Electrek article

As, is any car shipping that can do this?

 

[Zinc_Saucier]

As, is any car shipping that can do this?

F-150 Lightning

 

[h2ofun]

F-150 Lightning

Has any shipped?

I would consider an EV if it has V2h. I could care less about v2g.

I see PGE says they have a pilot program but not seeing how. And I do not see any cars in the US that one can buy NOW. And, I do not need a truck
Would like a car at about 30k with v2h. Guess just have to wait.

 

[wwu123]

Has any shipped?

I would consider an EV if it has V2h. I could care less about v2g.

I see PGE says they have a pilot program but not seeing how. And I do not see any cars in the US that one can buy NOW. And, I do not need a truck
Would like a car at about 30k with v2h. Guess just have to wait.

According to what I've been following, it formally entered production this past week, about 1000 made so far, and the first deliveries planned next week will be to some commercial customers. If you get in line now as #200,001, you might get one in about two years.

Not sure if any of the first ones are the higher config with the V2H capability, nor whether the other equipment needed installed in the home are available.

 

[h2ofun]

According to what I've been following, it formally entered production this past week, about 1000 made so far, and the first deliveries planned next week will be to some commercial customers. If you get in line now as #200,001, you might get one in about two years.

Not sure if any of the first ones are the higher config with the V2H capability, nor whether the other equipment needed installed in the home are available.

I could never find anything to sign up for

what are the 1000 made?

 

[Zinc_Saucier]

I could never find anything to sign up for

what are the 1000 made?

DEARBORN, Mich. — Ford Motor said on Tuesday that it had produced about 2,000 electric F-150 pickup trucks and planned to begin delivering them to customers in the next week.

Ford says it has produced 2,000 electric F-150 pickup trucks.

Deliveries of the F-150 Lightning, Ford’s most important new vehicle in many years, will begin in the coming week, it said.

www.nytimes.com

 

[BGbreeder]

@h2ofun Have a look at this link;

https://www.kbb.com/electric-car/

There is one vehicle shipping that has supported V2H for years, since it was first built in fact. (But to my knowledge, not (yet?) enabled in the US...)
dcbel supports V2H, as well as direct DC charging;

Dcbel Home Energy Station Secures First U.S. Location

/PRNewswire/ -- dcbel, a leader in residential solar and vehicle charging technology, is opening a new logistics and administration complex in the heart of...

www.prnewswire.com

BUT, and it is a major but, no vehicle manufacturer currently enables DC export on their current vehicles in the US. UK, yes, Japan, yes, Australia, yes. So the dcbel charger may be V2H capable, but vehicles aren't yet. Yes, the Ford lightning is supposed to support V2H on its higher range models, with its own charge system, but it hasn't been seen in the wild yet, and real questions remain unanswered about where the transfer switch (aka gateway) is going to be located and how it will be controlled. Right now, the lightning looks like a great remote work truck, good for powering a job site as needed, but the home side of things remain light on details.​

For some vehicles, it would appear to be a simple firmware up date, but for most EVs, they don't have the hardware. (E.g. no DC charging support, J2 charging only and / or a lack of CHAdeMO or CCS charging support.)

​

 

[h2ofun]

Ford says it has produced 2,000 electric F-150 pickup trucks.

Deliveries of the F-150 Lightning, Ford’s most important new vehicle in many years, will begin in the coming week, it said.

www.nytimes.com

Thats WAY too expensive

 

[h2ofun]

@h2ofun Have a look at this link;

https://www.kbb.com/electric-car/

There is one vehicle shipping that has supported V2H for years, since it was first built in fact. (But to my knowledge, not (yet?) enabled in the US...)
dcbel supports V2H, as well as direct DC charging;

Dcbel Home Energy Station Secures First U.S. Location

/PRNewswire/ -- dcbel, a leader in residential solar and vehicle charging technology, is opening a new logistics and administration complex in the heart of...

www.prnewswire.com

BUT, and it is a major but, no vehicle manufacturer currently enables DC export on their current vehicles in the US. UK, yes, Japan, yes, Australia, yes. So the dcbel charger may be V2H capable, but vehicles aren't yet. Yes, the Ford lightning is supposed to support V2H on its higher range models, with its own charge system, but it hasn't been seen in the wild yet, and real questions remain unanswered about where the transfer switch (aka gateway) is going to be located and how it will be controlled. Right now, the lightning looks like a great remote work truck, good for powering a job site as needed, but the home side of things remain light on details.​

For some vehicles, it would appear to be a simple firmware up date, but for most EVs, they don't have the hardware. (E.g. no DC charging support, J2 charging only and / or a lack of CHAdeMO or CCS charging support.)

​

​

yep, nothing in US

 

[BGbreeder]

Thats WAY too expensive

Clearly not for over 200,000 other folks...

 

[Zinc_Saucier]

Clearly not for over 200,000 other folks...

9.7 Powerwalls worth of battery storage, and I don’t know about you guys but I haven’t been able to figure out how to drive my 2PWs to the recycling center with all my yard waste…

 

[Rocket_man]

This is needed in addition to the Ford Charging Station pro. I imagine this is like the Tesla Gateway. No pricing on the unit or installation. I think the Tesla GW is ~$1,200??? Plus installation which must be a few thousand as well. But if you can afford a $100K truck I guess it is a drop in the bucket.

Sunrun Page

 

[Rocket_man]

This is needed in addition to the Ford Charging Station pro. I imagine this is like the Tesla Gateway. No pricing on the unit or installation. I think the Tesla GW is ~$1,200??? Plus installation which must be a few thousand as well. But if you can afford a $100K truck I guess it is a drop in the bucket.

Sunrun Page

And the answer is... $4K. Ops, that does not include installation. Or the Ford Charging Station Pro, unless it is included with the truck.

InsideEVs

 

[holeydonut]

Thats WAY too expensive

You spent all your monies on the solar and batteries. But once those systems pay back next year, you can afford a F150 lightning just fine.

 

[CrazyRabbit]

Fords implementation is dc from truck to delta inverter. it also appears you can not charge the truck with dc either…
Charge station pro supplies ac to truck for charging and has dc to supply the delta inverter/house.

 

[hobbes]

Hi, just found this info on V2G code in Tesla App - haven´t been following this too closely, can anyone tell me if this is new and point me to the right place where this has been discussed?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1522718061622616069

(see the screen shots in the tweet)

 

[cwied]

Hi, just found this info on V2G code in Tesla App - haven´t been following this too closely, can anyone tell me if this is new and point me to the right place where this has been discussed?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1522718061622616069

(see the screen shots in the tweet)

I don't see any V2G related messages in the screenshots. Which messages are you talking about?

 

[Vines]

Hi, just found this info on V2G code in Tesla App - haven´t been following this too closely, can anyone tell me if this is new and point me to the right place where this has been discussed?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1522718061622616069

(see the screen shots in the tweet)

I am unclear why you think this is V2G code, and not Powerwall to grid code?