Winter handling Subaru vs dual-motor model Y

[Snow Drift]

The video then describes but does not show what happens when the rear motor and traction control are turned off and only the front motor is driven. The video describes being unable to make the Model Y turn while accelerating when only the front motor is driven. (Not sure I understand that explanation but whatever.)

When the front motor is powering the car (think a FWD car), the rear wheels are just rolling, they are not powered. FWD cars exhibit something called understeer. Understeer, when induced, basically locks up the front wheels and you you slide across the road in a somewhat straight line. You "plow" instead of rotating the car around (unable to make the car turn). This is the opposite of oversteer (RWD and sometimes AWD), where in a bad situation the rear end gets light, lifts, spins and you end up backwards on the road. However, oversteer can be controlled and that is how people drift or just induce extra rotation for performance (think Rally racing, etc).

Here is a funny guide:

 

[AhwatukeeDad]

I’d like a winter mode that would set it to chill, stop regen, and maybe off road assist. A quick voice command as conditions might change will driving.

create a user profile with those set for snow and you done!

 

[masotime]

I've been driving through / during the recent snowstorms in Lake Tahoe / Sierra Nevada, and I've definitely felt like the off-road assist made a difference.

The ride became less smooth (the car seemed to require more effort to roll forward / had to apply more pressure to the accelerator for the same speed) but it also felt like the wheels were "firmly planted" on the ground. I drove around twisty mountain roads with snow tracks at a maximum of about 50mph and I'm pretty sure it didn't fishtail as much as it used to without off-road assist.

I'm planning to set it now every time I know I'm going on snowy mountain roads. It's just troublesome that you have to fiddle with the touchscreen to dive into the settings to turn it on (voice control doesn't seem to activate it).

I might try the user profile suggestion above.

 

[seniorcitizen]

I tried to create a profile and wanted to select off-road assist. It was greyed out so I could not select it.
I did not even see an option to select low regen.

Let me know if anyone has been able to create a profile with off-road assist and low regen selected.

 

[jcanoe]

I tried to create a profile and wanted to select off-road assist. It was greyed out so I could not select it.
I did not even see an option to select low regen.

Let me know if anyone has been able to create a profile with off-road assist and low regen selected.

Model Y vehicles built after mid-summer 2020 do not include an option to change from standard to low regen. Theories anyone?

In cold weather regen is limited by the battery management system, almost low regen by default when the battery pack is cold.

 

[Snow Drift]

I tried to create a profile and wanted to select off-road assist. It was greyed out so I could not select it.
I did not even see an option to select low regen.

Let me know if anyone has been able to create a profile with off-road assist and low regen selected.

Were you in Drive? Try going to Park, and then attempt to click "Off Road Assist." I am able to engage it (can't remember if I was in park).

As for Regen, see above, that setting is gone for new MY. I never used it with our Model 3, and don't in the MY either.

 

[Koolio46]

Model Y vehicles built after mid-summer 2020 do not include an option to change from standard to low regen. Theories anyone?

In cold weather regen is limited by the battery management system, almost low regen by default when the battery pack is cold.

No ‘low’ regen option was removed with 2021 MYs. My 2020 has the ‘low’ option.

 

[Snow Drift]

No ‘low’ regen option was removed with 2021 MYs. My 2020 has the ‘low’ option.

You have a low VIN Model Y (I have VIN 32XXX, and also have regen settings). The change started in October, I think. So, it could include later VIN MY20 Model Y.

 

[Koolio46]

You have a low VIN Model Y (I have VIN 32XXX, and also have regen settings). The change started in October, I think. So, it could include later VIN MY20 Model Y.

Good point. I’ve only seen people with 2021s say it’s been removed but could be wrong.

 

[seniorcitizen]

Were you in Drive? Try going to Park, and then attempt to click "Off Road Assist." I am able to engage it (can't remember if I was in park).

As for Regen, see above, that setting is gone for new MY. I never used it with our Model 3, and don't in the MY either.

I was in park. I will try to change the settings in park and drive.

 

[davraker]

You have a low VIN Model Y (I have VIN 32XXX, and also have regen settings). The change started in October, I think. So, it could include later VIN MY20 Model Y.

I have vin 50xxx and have the regen choice.

 

[Srad600Volt]

I just drove from LA to Big Bear Lake and back yesterday with the wife, kids and dog in tow. Halfway up the mountain the CHP had chain control in place since the temps were just at/below freezing and the roads were icy/snowy. I was running the stock “all season” tires and was able to get past chain control with no issue. For most of the way up I was following a Subaru WRX (until I had to pass him...). The snow was not very deep on the road, but the ice was pretty thick in places.

I did feel the car loose traction more than a few times under acceleration, but it was momentary. Seemed like it took a second for the computers to realize there was slip and compensate (of course I would also lift slightly when this happened, not sure how the car would compensate if I didn’t lift). On the way down the mountain, I was being very cautious when lifting off the accelerator, but I didn’t really feel the car loose traction under deceleration.

Compared to my past AWD/4WD vehicles, I’d say the driving dynamics of the Y were pretty average in those conditions. I’ve driven true 4wd’s(Jeep’s / Subaru) and FWD biased AWD’s. I think with a good set of snow tires, and a lighter right foot, the Y should be a pretty good snow driver.

**EDIT** Edited to add that I drove in Sport mode with regen set to standard (although it was reduced) the entire time. I probably should have gone to chill/low regen and off road mode just to see how that would have helped (or not).

Also stoked to arrive back home with a full 114miles of range left in the car. I was convinced we'd need to entertain the kids at a supercharger somewhere.

 

[DaveORD]

Could a lot of this be solved if the MY had track mode option?

Track Mode V2

 

[Snow Drift]

Could a lot of this be solved if the MY had track mode option?

Track Mode V2

You could adjust the torque split as desired, however, the extra nannies would be off, allowing more spin of the tires and extra fun.

Here is a video of a former rally car driver/ Nurburgring, Sebastian Vittel, who has a history with Audi and Porsche.

Track Mode (possibly before torque split ability?) - parking lot/normal roads:
He loves it. Notice when turning onto local roads his hands twitch to correct, rear bias, and he doesn't mind at all. It's just something to get used to.

Track Mode set to ??/?? - parking lot

Track Mode set to 30/70 (front/rear) - rally driving in the Alps (closed road):

 

[guyrelax]

Again, there is nothing wrong with the Tesla system and it works just as well as manual Subarus (which are better systems than automatic Subarus). If you want to compare roller tests, even automatic Subarus, they are rather similar to the Tesla. Both being way better than just about any other manufacturer.

There are a few differences between your Tesla and Subaru.

1) Instant Torque - You need to adjust your right foot input in slippery conditions
2) Rear Torque at 50%+ - Your car doesn't have that, and you just aren't used to how it acts...go get a manual Subaru and it's the same
3) Wider tires - Subarus have much narrower tires stock, or available aftermarket, which are better in the snow bc they carve through snow vs plowing a wide path/floating above it. That is just a downside for all sporty cars with large performance brake calipers requiring wider rims.

My main question would be, how much are you really "fishtailing?" Is it a wide arc like a RWD car who is struggling in the snow? Or, is it really a few mm or inch and your butt is just getting nervous? If it's an inch or two and then it corrects immediately, that is the same reaction of manual Subarus (which you saw I've owned many for 15 years, plus 2 automatics).

This is flat out false. I'm coming from an A4 and a 335xi. Neither fishtailed anywhere near how the Y behaved on my first snow trip last weekend. It was downright sketchy until I turned on off road mode (I have a '21 model Y LR, there is no option to adjust regen). The torque isn't a factor when you are barely tapping the pedal. For me regen engaging would send the tail end all over the place every time I let off the pedal on the highway, driving straight. Subarus and audis were absolutely blowing past me on the way to keystone CO. My guess is they are well aware of this but haven't done an update to fix this because its going to crush the range. Hopefully they are working on it

 

[masotime]

It was downright sketchy until I turned on off road mode.... Subarus and audis were absolutely blowing past me on the way to keystone CO.

Did the “blowing past” stop after you turned on off road? Honest question, I felt I gained a lot more stability w/off-road mode, although I wasn’t confident of pushing close to the speed limit even with that turned on.

My guess is they haven't done an update to fix this because its going to crush the range.

I actually didn’t notice the road trip ending estimate change much when I activated off-road. IMO I think it’s safe to assume your range isn’t going to drop too much with off-road activated - I suspect cold weather is a more important factor for range on the battery.

 

[guyrelax]

Did the “blowing past” stop after you turned on off road? Honest question, I felt I gained a lot more stability w/off-road mode, although I wasn’t confident of pushing close to the speed limit even with that turned on.



I actually didn’t notice the road trip ending estimate change much when I activated off-road. IMO I think it’s safe to assume your range isn’t going to drop too much with off-road activated - I suspect cold weather is a more important factor for range on the battery.

Yup, same. I felt a lot better with off road mode, but it still didn't fee that great and I couldn't keep up with other AWD vehicles. Pretty disappointing honestly. This car should be better in these conditions than my previous awd cars

I'm not sure about off road but I meant a 'snow mode' might kill the range if it used the front motor and reduces regen. For me it really felt linked to the regen braking but can't be sure on that

 

[Srad600Volt]

Yup, same. I felt a lot better with off road mode, but it still didn't fee that great and I couldn't keep up with other AWD vehicles. Pretty disappointing honestly. This car should be better in these conditions than my previous awd cars

I'm not sure about off road but I meant a 'snow mode' might kill the range if it used the front motor and reduces regen. For me it really felt linked to the regen braking but can't be sure on that

I’m curious about the conditions you were driving in. Was there light snow, deep snow, icy roads or all of the above? It sounds like you were driving at highway speeds? Maybe there is some correlation between conditions/speed that account for the differences in driving feel.

Either way I think a “Snow mode” or “track mode” (both for their respective uses really) would be fantastic. Seems like a simple (ha ha...really rather complicated) software issue.

 

[Velcade]

Agree. I came from a WRX and that thing never lost traction. I also miss my heated windshield wipers. The wipers on the Y are trash.

When the Y starts to slip there's no indication on the screen that you're losing traction, which is annoying.

 

[Mvdaog]

I wish someone would tap into the torque details like those bjorn videos with off road on and off. I wonder what it does to the rwd bias. I also wonder about safety at highway speeds with traction control disabled, which happens when you go into off road mode.