2021 Model S Plaid/LR Fire

[Barklikeadog]

Can you smash the glass? Doesn't the S refresh have laminated glass windows that can't be smashed out?


Would the car go into park if it was rolling and he leapt out (conjecture)? If it was a downhill grade and/or the car is rolling and you jump out what does happen? Assuming something was wrong with the electrics - as he could not apparently unlock the door or something - would that also interfere with any auto-stopping safety features?

The car was rolling uphill.

 

[jimm01]

Obviously way too early to claim "defect" since it isn't known if the owner could have previously run over something and damaged the car... But seeing those 18650 batteries makes me question why Tesla is using their old generation smallest batteries to power a 1020 HP car that draws almost 800 kW of power. The Model 3/Y use the larger 2170 cells. Did they just run out of time and since the S was designed for 18650 batteries, they just went with that? Was Musk's prior comment about working on battery safety related to discharging 18650 cells at that rate? I'm sure Tesla was confident the setup was safe or they wouldn't have released it but I'm just hoping there aren't some operational cases they didn't test well enough like maybe taking a long trip with lots of supercharging and then accelerating hard or some other case that didn't have a lot of testing.

Mike

Not defect but a design tradeoff that did not take into account a situational event. How are theses battery packs constructed to prevent thermal issues down to each cell?

 

[kfly212]

Will need to wait for tesla car video or data from the car to understand what happened but this seems odd.

"Mark Geragos, of the law firm Geragos and Geragos, confirmed he is representing the owner and called for Tesla to take the vehicles off the road."

Why would you need a Celebrity Lawyer for this? or any Lawyer so fast. Would think Tesla would bend over backwards to replace vehicle and cover any inconvenience.
A green Jaugar stopped at a stoplight burned to the ground in front of my house. Was more scared that the gas car would explode then I would be if my Model S caught fire.

 

[juanmedina]

Will need to wait for tesla car video or data from the car to understand what happened but this seems odd.

"Mark Geragos, of the law firm Geragos and Geragos, confirmed he is representing the owner and called for Tesla to take the vehicles off the road."

Why would you need a Celebrity Lawyer for this? or any Lawyer so fast. Would think Tesla would bend over backwords to replace vehicle and cover any inconvenience.
A green Jaugar stopped at a stoplight burned to the ground in front of my house. Was more scared that the gas car would explode then I would be if my Model S cought fire.

The owner is trying to retire lol.

Maybe the owner tried to open the doors while the car was moving and we know that doesn't work. The Model S Plaid made it through Pikes Peak I hope this is just an isolated incident.

 

[Barklikeadog]

Will need to wait for tesla car video or data from the car to understand what happened but this seems odd.

"Mark Geragos, of the law firm Geragos and Geragos, confirmed he is representing the owner and called for Tesla to take the vehicles off the road."

Why would you need a Celebrity Lawyer for this? or any Lawyer so fast. Would think Tesla would bend over backwards to replace vehicle and cover any inconvenience.
A green Jaugar stopped at a stoplight burned to the ground in front of my house. Was more scared that the gas car would explode then I would be if my Model S caught fire.

That is bizarre. This area is older(50-70) mature, successful, 1.5-3m homes, 30k+ per year in property taxes...
Not exactly attention seekers. Rose lane isn't really a cut-through road, I'm guessing the guy lives here.

 

[2101Guy]

I mean, generally speaking. Is it ever wise to get the VERY first one of..almost..anything? Especially when we all new the Plaid was pushed back a week or so from original delivery date..meaning most likely there was extra rush? And this was literally #1 of all Plaid deliveries?

 

[MP3Mike]

Obviously way too early to claim "defect" since it isn't known if the owner could have previously run over something and damaged the car... But seeing those 18650 batteries makes me question why Tesla is using their old generation smallest batteries to power a 1020 HP car that draws almost 800 kW of power. The Model 3/Y use the larger 2170 cells.

Smaller cells are generally better for high power usage. (Easier to cool, etc.) Larger cells are usually better for energy density and cost savings. So there is nothing wrong with them using the 18650 format. (The insides/formulation may be the same, or better, than what they put in the 2170s.)

 

[jimm01]

The high-energy of Li-ion batteries is both a benefit and a risk. Li-ion batteries are a fire hazard due to the risk of thermal runaway in each individual cell. Also, extinguishing them is problematic. Inflamed they continuously create oxygen and lithium when in contact with water produces hydrogen gas and lithium-hydroxide. While physical damage is a primary concerns irregularities during manufacturing are also possible. Then there is damage that can arise from charging. As long as all the safety features are working risk is low. It is my understanding Tesla’s 18650 batteries do not have PTC or CID on individual cells, but they aggravate these and other safety features outside of each cell. Being smaller a single 18650 battery pose less risk due to internal pressure, so I have to wonder if there was no physical damage or mishandling was this occurrence the result of an unforeseen set of circumstances. Please don't take offence but since the problems with the Dreamliner I've remained cautiously optimistic but skeptical (hopefully in a healthy way).

​

 

[MikeyC]

Smaller cells are generally better for high power usage. (Easier to cool, etc.) Larger cells are usually better for energy density and cost savings. So there is nothing wrong with them using the 18650 format. (The insides/formulation may be the same, or better, than what they put in the 2170s.)

But doesn't higher cell capacity usually equate to higher (safe) discharge rates? The 2170 cells have almost 1.5x the volume of the 18650 cells.

Mike

 

[MP3Mike]

But doesn't higher cell capacity usually equate to higher (safe) discharge rates? The 2170 cells have almost 1.5x the volume of the 18650 cells.

But you also have fewer cells if you use larger cells. So your discharge rate per cell is higher. (Tesla has previously said that switching the S&X to 2170 would result in a reduction in performance.)

 

[Silicon Desert]

Are we sure it’s a Plaid? They just started deliveries and photos elsewhere show a permanent license plate. Around here it takes a couple months to get one so no way a car delivered in the last two weeks would have permanent plates already.

Hmmmm, not always true. That assumption about a permanent plate doesn't mean anything. In many states, an owner can simply move a plate from a prior car. That is what the DMV allowed me to do. I had my old plate on my new MX within 2 days of getting the car.

EDIT: and apologies to repeat something similar. I just now see that other people said something similar.

 

[Silicon Desert]

I can imagine getting out of the car quickly during a fire but I can’t see how the car would roll. Doesn’t the car go into park as soon as the driver door is opened?

That's a good point, but maybe he jumped out (if he did) at the speed above where the car no longer goes into park when opening the door. I forget the speed, but I think it was something above 5 mph. Maybe I don't remember the speed.

 

[travwill]

Hmmmm, not always true. That assumption about a permanent plate doesn't mean anything. In many states, an owner can simply move a plate from a prior car. That is what the DMV allowed me to do. I had my old plate on my new MX within 2 days of getting the car.

EDIT: and apologies to repeat something similar. I just now see that other people said something similar.

Yes, in some states like TX the plates go with the car. In others like IL, the plates go with the person.

 

[blackhawk]

Here's why the owner has a celebrity lawyer. The owner is a wealthy investor.

Model S Plaid that burst into flames owned by exec of big Tesla investor

A brand-new Tesla Model S Plaid that burst into flames in Pennsylvania on Thursday was owned by a top executive at one of Tesla’s biggest backers, with a stake worth more than $1 billion, The…

nypost.com

A brand-new Tesla Model S Plaid that burst into flames in Pennsylvania on Tuesday was owned by a top executive at one of Tesla’s biggest investors, with a stake worth more than $1 billion, The Post has learned.

Bart Smith — the head of the digital asset group at trading firm Susquehanna International, who has been dubbed the “Crypto King” by CNBC — was driving his brand-new $124,000 vehicle outside Philadelphia when it was consumed in a harrowing unexplained inferno that took first responders an hour and a half to extinguish.

I notice the fanboys on the Tesla subreddit have suppressed all discussion of this.

 

[2101Guy]

did they ever figure out EXACTY what happened with that texas fire? Was anyone CONFIRMED to be in the drivers seat?

 

[Bluechip]

The Texas fire- The last report I heard about mentioned that home security cameras caught both gentlemen entering the front seats of the Model S before driving off. What happened after that is still under investigation.

 

[SO16]

Here's why the owner has a celebrity lawyer. The owner is a wealthy investor.

Model S Plaid that burst into flames owned by exec of big Tesla investor

A brand-new Tesla Model S Plaid that burst into flames in Pennsylvania on Thursday was owned by a top executive at one of Tesla’s biggest backers, with a stake worth more than $1 billion, The…

nypost.com

I notice the fanboys on the Tesla subreddit have suppressed all discussion of this.

Not quite. Sounds like they are actually short.


Post in thread 'Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable'
Wiki - Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

 

[Tam]

I can imagine getting out of the car quickly during a fire but I can’t see how the car would roll. Doesn’t the car go into park as soon as the driver door is opened?

Agreed. The car goes into park when the driver door is open. It's possible that the fire damaged that safety feature. Or if the driver knew how to place the car into neutral to bypass what feature too.

 

[MikeyC]

Looks like the driver has been identified:

Tesla Model S Plaid Fire Accident Explained: Car Owner Is a Tesla Investor Dubbed Crypto King, NHTSA to Check for Defects

A newly delivered Tesla S Plaid caught fire on Tuesday while its owner, "Crypto King" Bart Smith was on the wheel, fire officials said.

www.itechpost.com

Mike

 

[blackhawk]

Not quite. Sounds like they are actually short.

I didn't say he was long on Tesla. But I can guarantee a guy who's been in a management position for a decade with a fund that has over $600B in assets under management is quite wealthy. Especially if he got into BTC in 2014 which the press implies.