actually they do. there are a lot of laws being passed by both parties. It's usually big, convoluted bills that do this. The country was founded on the premise 'do no harm.' The idea was to complicate the government so much that only common, consensus laws get passed. Anything that's controversial shouldn't. Unfortunately, over the last 100 years, the federalist type of government has been transitioned into an elected monarchy, with congress giving too much power to executive branch.
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Bad news for those who delayed until 1/1
- Thread starter mrwug
- Start date
Not sure about this "do no harm" thing, pretty sure elected officials don't sign the Hippocratic oath. Maybe the "hypocrite oath" in some cases.
BBB is not being mired solely because it's controversial, it's because of the outsized representation conferred by 2 senators per state. Many of these states receive more money from the federal government than they generate, and would actually benefit from aspects of BBB, funded by other states. But nope, it's party line, the facts or benefits don't really matter. Their elected officials are voting against their constituents best interests, to curry favor with their god emperor.
Fair point about smaller measures being moved through the gears.
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I think a separate EV tax credit bill could be passed.
It wouldn't hurt to remind people that the original $7500 EV tax credit (Public Law 110-343, Energy Improvement and Extension Act of 2008) was signed by George W. Bush and passed with votes of 268-48 in the House and 74-25 in the Senate.
Public Law 110-343
juliusa
Active Member
What is the purpose of EV incentives? Aren't most (all?) EV manufacturers sold out of vehicles?
It is (and always has been) a forward looking investment to spur EV production and adoption. Not sure why you are associating current global supply chain and logistic issues with EV incentives, they're completely orthogonal.
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carlos31820
Member
Outside of the reconciliation process, any new bill would need 60 votes (10 republicans). I doubt any EV type bill can get passed outside the dead BBB bill.
Any new bill, I agree with you. However, the Reps would absolutely love to fund the government with a Continuing Resolution -- last year's budget and a few bucks for inflation -- which would extend the current EV program and it current caps. No help for Tesla buyers, however.
juliusa
Active Member
Stimulate demand for a product that is sold out? I thought only idiots in Washington would think that way. We are years away from production catching up with EV demand.
Yes only idiots would think of the future. All that matters is right now.
juliusa
Active Member
Creating demand incentives now for products where demand will exceed supply for years is idiocy that could only come from Washington. Incentives did nothing to get the legacy automakers off their ass - it took Tesla kicking their ass and leaving them no choice that got them to finally develop EVs. Now that everyone is going EV, the idiots in Washington are giving out our money to their cronies.
juliusa
Active Member
Time has come and gone - clearly did little to get legacy automakers to bring EVs to market since the law was passed over a decade ago. They are selling EVs to remain in business now - they have no choice. Ford says they are aiming for #2 and hope to eventually overtake Tesla as #1 in a few years. They are all building car and battery factories to try to catch up.
Audi CEO Sees Chances of U.S. EV Manufacturing Increasing
At the moment, all of Audi's EV manufacturing is done in Europe. Some of it is done in Germany (Audi Q4 e-tron, Audi e-tron GT), while some is done in
www.quattrodaily.com
VW plans new EV factory in Germany to counter Tesla
The plant would build about 250,000 cars a year and would be less complex than retooling the existing operations, VW brand chief Ralf Brandstaetter said.
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Who are these "cronies"? It's a direct to the consumer incentive. The idea is you create demand so manufacturers pivot to EV faster.
A "crony" incentive would be to pay the manufacturers directly. You've got a very warped view of how this works from my perspective but that's what makes this place great, we don't always have to agree.
No - they built these for EPA compliance reasons. Full stop. Their decade worth of "compliance cars" has put them in last place in the EV race.
Now that it's clear where the future is heading, they're scrambling to be relevant.
Try to keep up.
juliusa
Active Member
My point exactly. The incentives never got the manufacturers to build EVs.
Certainly no need for incentives now - they know it is EV or die.
I say it is Washington idiocy, but it is really Washington corruption. Using our tax dollars to pay off their corporate cronies to get contributions and re-elected.
juliusa
Active Member
Auto manufacturers. They can charge more because the consumer gets the government to pay part of the cost.
Just like easy federal college money as loans "direct to the consumer" drove up college costs. When the feds throw in cash prices go up.
Or when the car dealer give you a great trade in value on your clunker, and no discount on the new car. It is the net amount paid that matters. People get that,
Seems Tesla is doing just fine selling cars without feds footing part of the bill.
I believe you need those 60 votes to override a filibuster in the Senate. So it would depend on if there is a filibuster.
The last EV credits passed pretty easily in a bipartisan manner. But that was 2008. It will be tougher now, but I think it could still happen again. The current EV tax credits won't last very long.
pepperoni
Member
Tesla has benefited from numerous government subsidies, including loans from the DoE, billion dollars tax incentives from Nevada, a $7500 tax credit for EVs, and other state and local subsidies. That’s not a knock on Tesla, and it’s possible they wouldn’t be where they are without them.
TSLY
Member
juliusa
Active Member
Yes!! And new incentives no longer needed for Tesla or anyone else. Plenty of capital available, plenty of demand, plenty of competitors.
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