Battery Degradation - Two Model Y's - P vs AWD

[ergela]

So we've put a few miles on our Model Y's and just wanted to put some info out there and see how it compares to what everyone else is seeing.

Both Y's have similar daily drive patterns and neither of us really push our cars at all. You can see the lifetime efficiency is almost identical on both but the battery degradation has been worse on the performance, almost 7% from delivery. One thing to note is the performance did have the coolant pump replaced early on (~300 miles in).

Another observation....as far as overall efficiency of the Y, the AC and Battery Cooling pulls a massive amount of electricity when on full blast, roughly 6kw. This compared to my old Model 3 which was about 3.75kw. We've had high 90's weather here in Texas and it's like driving the Model 3 in the winter. In the heat, we are averaging 305 wh/mi for both Y's vs 230 wh/mi in my Model 3.

Model Y Performance Stealth - 20" Induction
Miles: 2114
Lifetime Efficiency: 273 wh/mi
Daily Charge: 80%
100% Charges: 0
Supercharges: 1
App 100% Estimate (Delivery): 315 mi
App 100% Estimate (Current): 295 mi
Major Service: Coolant Pump Replaced due to Sound Issue


Model Y AWD - 19" Gemini
Miles: 1926
Lifetime Efficiency: 271 wh/mi
Daily Charge: 80%
100% Charges: 0
Supercharges: 1
App 100% Estimate (Delivery): 314 mi
App 100% Estimate (Current): 311 mi
Major Service: None

 

[LevelHeaded]

This isn’t battery degradation. And with no charges to 100% it’s even less accurate

 

[Watts_Up]

Both Y's have similar daily drive patterns and neither of us really push our cars at all.
You can see the lifetime efficiency is almost identical on both but the battery degradation has been worse on the performance,
almost 7% from delivery. One thing to note is the performance did have the coolant pump replaced early on (~300 miles in).

Model Y Performance Stealth - 20" Induction
Miles: 2114

Model Y AWD - 19" Gemini
Miles: 1926

Battery degradation after about one month of driving?

This isn’t battery degradation. And with no charges to 100% it’s even less accurate

This is right, the BMS balancing is more efficient when you try to full charge to 100%.

Try to full charge to 100% and de-charge to 10% and charge again to 100%.

There are several video from Bjørn Nyland covering this topic,

 

[Klau2]

So we've put a few miles on our Model Y's and just wanted to put some info out there and see how it compares to what everyone else is seeing.

Both Y's have similar daily drive patterns and neither of us really push our cars at all. You can see the lifetime efficiency is almost identical on both but the battery degradation has been worse on the performance, almost 7% from delivery. One thing to note is the performance did have the coolant pump replaced early on (~300 miles in).

Another observation....as far as overall efficiency of the Y, the AC and Battery Cooling pulls a massive amount of electricity when on full blast, roughly 6kw. This compared to my old Model 3 which was about 3.75kw. We've had high 90's weather here in Texas and it's like driving the Model 3 in the winter. In the heat, we are averaging 305 wh/mi for both Y's vs 230 wh/mi in my Model 3.

Model Y Performance Stealth - 20" Induction
Miles: 2114
Lifetime Efficiency: 273 wh/mi
Daily Charge: 80%
100% Charges: 0
Supercharges: 1
App 100% Estimate (Delivery): 315 mi
App 100% Estimate (Current): 295 mi
Major Service: Coolant Pump Replaced due to Sound Issue


Model Y AWD - 19" Gemini
Miles: 1926
Lifetime Efficiency: 271 wh/mi
Daily Charge: 80%
100% Charges: 0
Supercharges: 1
App 100% Estimate (Delivery): 314 mi
App 100% Estimate (Current): 311 mi
Major Service: None

No sure about battery degradation. Only been 2 months. I do agree with AC taking a lot of power and it's very loud.

 

[sherlockw]

Could you tell me what tire came with the 20 induction on performance stealth? Is is all season or is it the sport tires?

 

[tomas]

Tesla listings of range for new cars is over simplified. They advertise AWD and P as same, but those 20” wheels are most of the difference. Your AWD may actually be 315 new, but your P with 20s was actually about 300. So you are showing ~ 5 miles less than new, which could be normal loss or inaccuracy of the estimation. Your cars WILL lose 5% in the first year or so. If you are already worrying about it, you will worry more. Don’t! After that first 5%, the battery stabilizes. My 2012 lost 5% in 1 year and 2% in the next 7.

chill.

 

[Kuro Houou]

Right now after 1000 miles TeslaFi says I have lost about 3.5%... Not worried, I mean how accurate can it be at 1000 miles, that's barely 4 full charges... ill wait until I hit 10,000.

 

[Matsayz]

You’re good to go. I think you’re over thinking it especially for having TWO Model Y’s when some people who ordered on day one and haven’t received them. I would ignore the numbers for the first 6months because it’s not like Tesla is going to do anything about it anyways right?

 

[MrTuna]

The flipside, is if you really do want some extra miles - try swapping the 20" to 19". That should give you an instant 15 mile boost.

 

[VT_EE]

The difference in wheels/tires is most likely the cause of the discrepancy. Tesla adjusts their algorithm based on the type of wheel you have selected in the service menu.

 

[Kuro Houou]

Right now after 1000 miles TeslaFi says I have lost about 3.5%... Not worried, I mean how accurate can it be at 1000 miles, that's barely 4 full charges... ill wait until I hit 10,000.

Replying to myself here. I just started a test where I got my battery down to about 1-2% then started a full charge. Right now it says at 100% I should be at 250 miles (I have a PUP btw).... That's 7.5% lower then the base number... I sure hope this isn't an overall indication of range, I am only at 1100 miles so taking it with a grain of salt, still not exactly what I was expecting to see. I'll report back once its done fully charging.. doing a 0-100 charge hoping maybe it just needs a "reset".

 

[Georgia_Y]

That's odd you only see 250 at a full charge. I'm at 1,571 and it shows 279, but when fully charged it's actually goes to ~281.

 

[plee1024]

No sure about battery degradation. Only been 2 months. I do agree with AC taking a lot of power and it's very loud.

You don't want to start the car by trying to cool below 78 is what I found on our MX, let the AC build up the pressure for a minute or so then you can lower the temp. Otherwise, it will sound like a Falcon 9 blasting off...

 

[Kuro Houou]

Well finished my full charge cycle, it got up to 274 then dropped to 273, when it finished charging the app said it got up to 273 so we will go with that. Looks like sitting at about 2.5% degredation at 1200 miles. I'll just say that's in the margin of error right now Also just for reference lifetime Wh/m is at 295 right now, or about 90% efficiency which seems about right. On a PUP ~268 wh/m would get you to 280 miles on the 75kW pack. Overall I'm good with all those numbers

 

[Georgia_Y]

Well finished my full charge cycle, it got up to 274 then dropped to 273, when it finished charging the app said it got up to 273 so we will go with that. Looks like sitting at about 2.5% degredation at 1200 miles. I'll just say that's in the margin of error right now Also just for reference lifetime Wh/m is at 295 right now, or about 90% efficiency which seems about right. On a PUP ~268 wh/m would get you to 280 miles on the 75kW pack. Overall I'm good with all those numbers

You can't go by the mileage shown to determine battery degeneration. That's like looking out the window and determining the temperature by how hard to wind is blowing. Go query the API and get the actual values back before declaring you have a 2.5% degredation.

 

[Kuro Houou]

You can't go by the mileage shown to determine battery degeneration. That's like looking out the window and determining the temperature by how hard to wind is blowing. Go query the API and get the actual values back before declaring you have a 2.5% degredation.

Not sure if it is the same but TeslaFi said 273.63 I believe, I assume it queries the APIs.

 

[Georgia_Y]

That's an estimated rate based on your usage, not the actual battery capacity. If you look at the API response, you are wanting to get the actual capacity of the battery. From the example below, the batter level and usable battery level is what you should be more interested in, the milesage is an estimate.

{
"response": {
"charging_state": "Complete",
"fast_charger_type": "\u003cinvalid\u003e",
"fast_charger_brand": "\u003cinvalid\u003e",
"charge_limit_soc": 86,
"charge_limit_soc_std": 90,
"charge_limit_soc_min": 50,
"charge_limit_soc_max": 100,
"charge_to_max_range": false,
"max_range_charge_counter": 0,
"fast_charger_present": false,
"battery_range": 219.06,
"est_battery_range": 157.1,
"ideal_battery_range": 280.53,
"battery_level": 86,
"usable_battery_level": 86,
"charge_energy_added": 18.77,
"charge_miles_added_rated": 58.0,
"charge_miles_added_ideal": 74.0,
"charger_voltage": 0,
"charger_pilot_current": 7,
"charger_actual_current": 0,
"charger_power": 0,
"time_to_full_charge": 0.0,
"trip_charging": false,
"charge_rate": 0.0,
"charge_port_door_open": true,
"conn_charge_cable": "SAE",
"scheduled_charging_start_time": null,
"scheduled_charging_pending": false,
"user_charge_enable_request": null,
"charge_enable_request": true,
"charger_phases": null,
"charge_port_latch": "Engaged",
"charge_current_request": 7,
"charge_current_request_max": 7,
"managed_charging_active": false,
"managed_charging_user_canceled": false,
"managed_charging_start_time": null,
"battery_heater_on": false,
"not_enough_power_to_heat": false,
"timestamp": 1532915238524
}
}

 

[Kuro Houou]

Actually TeslaFi shows both Actual and Estimated ranges in their GUI. I'll check again though when I get a chance and compare the two numbers (direct API call vs TeslaFi range #), then we will know for sure.

 

[Kuro Houou]

Ok, just verified, TeslaFi and making a manual API call to get Battery range stats both show the same numbers. As of right now, both the API and TeslaFi show my "Battery Range"range at 243 Miles with 89% charge.

There is one difference though, TeslaFI shows my "Estimated Battery Range" at 209.63, and the API call manually shows it at 209.95, my guess is maybe based on polling times the numbers could be a little off, obviously its not by much so not a big deal here at all.

 

[hcdavis3]

Here is my range loss according to Teslafi. Screen shot was taken now. Sudden an precipitous. Should I be concerned. I’ve tried the battery reset to no avail, similar to what people have been saying on this forum.