Bluetooth in garaged X keeps taking control of my iPhone

[madodel]

I can't imagine this being a problem with the car, but rather a problem with the phone. The phone knows about all the Bluetooth devices and which one to send the audio signal to. The car is only a dumb mic/speaker, just like your wireless headphone or speaker. I have to believe it's the phone that decides where to route the signal.

I suspect that the phone sees the car come into range and decides to switch sources. I can't imagine the car has the ability to 'reject' the connection because the fobs are not in range.

I could be wrong, but it doesn't make sense to me otherwise.

While I understand that the car bluetooth takes control of the phone if no bluetooth device is already connected to the phone, why would it pair with a new device just because it comes into range? Is this just an iPhone problem? Do Android users have this as well?

 

[vandacca]

While I understand that the car bluetooth takes control of the phone if no bluetooth device is already connected to the phone, why would it pair with a new device just because it comes into range? Is this just an iPhone problem? Do Android users have this as well?

I'd be interested to know if Android users have this issue as well. If they don't, it clearly would indicate that the phone is the deciding factor. If they do have the same issue, it doesn't confirm anything since the Android phone might use the same algorithm as Apple.

However, I'd like to view this issue from a different perspective (from the phone). The phone senses a new bluetooth device and it decides to connect and send/receive audio to that new device. Why? Perhaps because it thinks you're now getting into your vehicle and would prefer to use it. Really, only Apple would be able to answer this question (assuming I'm right about who controls the source).

I assume the same thing would occur if you suddenly turned on an (already paired) bluetooth headset. I would expect the phone to automatically start transmitting/receiving with the headset. I wouldn't expect the phone to be able to determine if it's connecting to a car or a headset. Although the Bluetooth spec does allow for different types of devices, there doesn't appear to be one for "automobiles".

 

[PedanticOne]

While I understand that the car bluetooth takes control of the phone if no bluetooth device is already connected to the phone, why would it pair with a new device just because it comes into range? Is this just an iPhone problem? Do Android users have this as well?

It's not a new device. It's a known previously-paired device. This is a convenience feature so when you get in your car, your phone automatically connects. Just like any other on-and-ready bluetooth device. When you get in proximity, they connect.

 

[ohmman]

I can't imagine this being a problem with the car, but rather a problem with the phone. The phone knows about all the Bluetooth devices and which one to send the audio signal to. The car is only a dumb mic/speaker, just like your wireless headphone or speaker. I have to believe it's the phone that decides where to route the signal.

I suspect that the phone sees the car come into range and decides to switch sources. I can't imagine the car has the ability to 'reject' the connection because the fobs are not in range.

I could be wrong, but it doesn't make sense to me otherwise.

What I meant was that they could associate the profile with both the fob and the bluetooth device. So Ohmman's profile would have my fob and my phone. If Wohmman is driving the car, or at least if it senses her fob, it will only associate with her phone. I like this also when we travel together and she's not driving. I'd like her to be able to carry on her conversation without it grabbing the mic and speakers in the car.

It would give them some programming flexibility if they tied all of this into a profile. I'm not suggesting it's a great idea, but it seems feasible.

 

[PedanticOne]

I think that's worthy of investigating for sure.

 

[vandacca]

What I meant was that they could associate the profile with both the fob and the bluetooth device. So Ohmman's profile would have my fob and my phone. If Wohmman is driving the car, or at least if it senses her fob, it will only associate with her phone. I like this also when we travel together and she's not driving. I'd like her to be able to carry on her conversation without it grabbing the mic and speakers in the car.

It would give them some programming flexibility if they tied all of this into a profile. I'm not suggesting it's a great idea, but it seems feasible.

@ohmman, I don't think what you're suggesting is possible. You're looking at this from the perspective of the vehicle, assuming that the vehicle is in complete control of everything. I don't think that's the case (I could be wrong).

The vehicle is working as a bluetooth device and it needs to follow the bluetooth spec and connect when an attempt is made. Once the connection is made, it's up to the phone (IMO) whether or not to use it as a "hands-free" device.

Having said that, Tesla could implement a very ugly hack and somehow create multiple, unique "bluetooth" devices. At the moment, your Model X is probably listed as the same device name on both your and Wohmman's phones (so Tesla has no way to treat each uniquely).

If Tesla could implement 2 unique "bluetooth" devices, they could then turn on/off the associated bluetooth device based on which fob is nearby. Not sure if this can be done all in software or if Tesla would need 2 bluetooth chips in the vehicle.

 

[PedanticOne]

You can certainly have multiple phones bound to the car, and add rules to state when/if they should pair. This can all be done in software.

 

[madodel]

It's not a new device. It's a known previously-paired device. This is a convenience feature so when you get in your car, your phone automatically connects. Just like any other on-and-ready bluetooth device. When you get in proximity, they connect.

That is what I meant. Yes it is a known previously connected device but if I am already paired to a bluetooth device (my PowerBeats or some other audio device) it is crazy to just have the new device take control from the existing paired device. I need to see if powering on my PowerBeats takes control from the X. If that happens then it is the phone doing this. Apple should allow some sort of ordering of preference of devices like they do with WiFi SSIDs. I also have a Moto E Android phone, that I only use it when I'm in Germany so I will see if I can replicate the problem with that. I need to find time to play with all this stuff to see if any of it makes sense. Right now I'm trying to configure the dash cams I just had installed in the X yesterday.

 

[PedanticOne]

That is what I meant. Yes it is a known previously connected device but if I am already paired to a bluetooth device (my PowerBeats or some other audio device) it is crazy to just have the new device take control from the existing paired device. I need to see if powering on my PowerBeats takes control from the X. If that happens then it is the phone doing this. Apple should allow some sort of ordering of preference of devices like they do with WiFi SSIDs. I also have a Moto E Android phone, that I only use it when I'm in Germany so I will see if I can replicate the problem with that. I need to find time to play with all this stuff to see if any of it makes sense. Right now I'm trying to configure the dash cams I just had installed in the X yesterday.

Gotcha. Yeah, if it is already paired to another handsfree device it should not switch, afaik. That would be odd. But if it's just sitting on the table nearby not paired, it would. It would be good to add bluetooth triangulation/proximity to determine the phone is really close or even inside the car before attempting to connect.

 

[retinaguy]

This may have been mentioned but there's a preference for "always be connected" which I have turned off and don't have similar problems. My Fob and iPhone are close to the car often and the iPhone doesn't get connected to my MX. It takes a few seconds to "wake the car" when I access it from the app on the phone.

 

[madodel]

This may have been mentioned but there's a preference for "always be connected" which I have turned off and don't have similar problems. My Fob and iPhone are close to the car often and the iPhone doesn't get connected to my MX. It takes a few seconds to "wake the car" when I access it from the app on the phone.

I took that to mean connected to the Tesla cellular network. But perhaps it also affects the bluetooth as well.

 

[PedanticOne]

You can certainly have multiple phones bound to the car, and add rules to state when/if they should pair. This can all be done in software.

I should clarify that what I said is all theory. I mean, other cars/head units allow multiple pairings, and since this car can tell what fob is in use, they could certainly do some magic here in their copious spare time.

 

[Electric700]

I don't know if there is a solution for this but when my X is parked in the garage and I walk by and it wakes up, the X keeps taking control of my iPhone 7 Plus bluetooth and I keep missing calls because they ring inside the X and not on my phone. This happens even if I have another bluetooth device connected to the phone like my PowerBeats earphones. It also continues to control my phone when I am in the house, at least when I am in the family room attached to the garage. Is there anything I can do to stop this other than disconnecting bluetooth on the X?

I don't have this issue when I go near my Model S with my phone, both of which have Bluetooth enabled. Perhaps try contacting [email protected].

 

[ohmman]

I don't have this issue when I go near my Model S with my phone, both of which have Bluetooth enabled. Perhaps try contacting [email protected].

The uniqueness of the Model X is that the door opens when you approach. It is then that the phone joins the Bluetooth network on the car. Model S doesn't have the same situation.

Also, the Model X fobs are Bluetooth as well. Not sure if that has changed on the S, but it could require having that network awake at all times.

 

[madodel]

But the X knows whether someone is actually in the car (seat sensor and position of key FOB) so it really shouldn't activate bluetooth until at least someone (preferably just the driver) is actually sitting in the car. It just makes no sense to take control of the phone when no one is in the car.

 

[FarmerDave]

I can't imagine this being a problem with the car, but rather a problem with the phone. The phone knows about all the Bluetooth devices and which one to send the audio signal to. The car is only a dumb mic/speaker, just like your wireless headphone or speaker. I have to believe it's the phone that decides where to route the signal.

I suspect that the phone sees the car come into range and decides to switch sources. I can't imagine the car has the ability to 'reject' the connection because the fobs are not in range.

I could be wrong, but it doesn't make sense to me otherwise.

You're probably correct, but the car won't turn on and communicate with the phone until the fob comes in range.

 

[FarmerDave]

But the X knows whether someone is actually in the car (seat sensor and position of key FOB) so it really shouldn't activate bluetooth until at least someone (preferably just the driver) is actually sitting in the car. It just makes no sense to take control of the phone when no one is in the car.

Kind of nice, though, when I approach the door opens and the music is already playing.

Do any other cars do that?

 

[madodel]

Kind of nice, though, when I approach the door opens and the music is already playing.

Do any other cars do that?

I'd much prefer to be able to answer my phone in my house. ;-)

 

[FarmerDave]

I'd much prefer to be able to answer my phone in my house. ;-)

Hmm... keeping my fobs out of range I don't have that issue with either of the iPhones.

 

[ohmman]

@vandacca, I want to thank you for making me aware of some of the limitations of Bluetooth. I was tied up most of the day but this evening I have taken a look at the Bluetooth protocol, with which I have had no previous development experience.

Here's what I understand: Bluetooth employs a master/slave hierarchy. One master can have multiple slaves at the same time but each slave can only have one master at any given moment. In our case, the Model X is the slave, and the phones are masters. Slaves have the opportunity to select three different levels of security: open, first connection request for that device, every connection request. In our case, the Model X uses the second security option, and is therefore "open" to all masters with which it has been successfully connected.

That said - the Bluetooth stack remembers these by the MAC address of the Bluetooth master trying to connect. That MAC address is saved in software, and therefore I do think it would be possible for Tesla to manage profiles by swapping out the "active" MAC based on the selected profile. I haven't dug deep enough, but I'm guessing there is a related mechanism when you use the slave controller (in the X) to select a device with which you're not already connected.

I'll say what I've said many times before, much to the dismay of some of my colleagues/coworkers. "It's just software - it's not that difficult."