BMW i3

[dennis]

This may have already been answered before, but I am curious. Are states going to classify this car as an EV and be eligible for EV-only benefits or are they going to classify it as a hybrid since it will still be partially powered by gas?

In California BMW has qualified the car for the Zero Emissions (white) carpool lane sticker. In speaking to someone from BMW this gives them a marketing challenge for the Range Extender since touting it as allowing you to drive from say SF to LA would negate how they have positioned the car to the CA Air Resources Board.

 

[stopcrazypp]

This may have already been answered before, but I am curious. Are states going to classify this car as an EV and be eligible for EV-only benefits or are they going to classify it as a hybrid since it will still be partially powered by gas?

The i3 REx was designed specifically to fit into a new loophole, which counts it as an EV under a new BEVx category (which as added from BMW lobbying). That's probably why it will not have a hold mode (in the US, will have it in the UK) and will try to operate the range extender as emergency use only. It's also probably why the gas tank is so tiny (smaller than the scooter where the engine came from).
http://green.autoblog.com/2013/07/10/new-bmw-i3-details-show-ev-aiming-for-carb-hov-loophole/
http://bmwi3.blogspot.com/2013/08/how-carb-may-make-i3s-range-extender.html

 

[vfx]

In California BMW has qualified the car for the Zero Emissions (white) carpool lane sticker....

This is just wrong. It's like the Volt so it should get the green sticker.

 

[stopcrazypp]

If you order it with range extender, the REx sits alongside the electric motor at the rear of the car - no space is lost at under the bonnet for it. The "frunk" is small - maybe related to the short bonnet and the tiny turning circle which requires large angles of movement on the front wheels.

Space is lost under the frunk for the gas tank. The space is also lost in the rear for the REx. Discoducky's complaint is that neither space is reclaimed when you pick the EV version. So the EV version of the i3 is compromised to accommodate the REx.

- - - Updated - - -

This is just wrong. It's like the Volt so it should get the green sticker.

Nope, it gets the white sticker (see the new BEVx loophole I linked).

 

[vfx]

...

Nope, it gets the white sticker (see the new BEVx loophole I linked).

AIS, That is just wrong.

 

[stopcrazypp]

AIS, That is just wrong.

Well CA legislature extended both white and green stickers for the same length (seems like they are going to treat both almost equally), so at this point there's not practical difference. However, the ZEV credits that this qualifies BMW for means they don't have to sell any real EVs (non-REx versions of the i3).

GM, on the other hand, is required to sell a certain amount of Spark EVs (the Volt reduces their burden, but does not replace the requirement).

 

[surfingslovak]

Here are a few videos, which show various aspects of the manufacturing process. Perhaps they will help form a more informed opinion, and facilitate better speculation about some of the design decisions taken. This material was released alongside a press release last week, when the first production vehicle was delivered.


Frame and body assembly:

Exterior panels:

Battery module assembly:

Battery assembly:

Motor assembly:

 

[surfingslovak]

Final assembly:

 

[SanSerif]

Space is lost under the frunk for the gas tank. The space is also lost in the rear for the REx. Discoducky's complaint is that neither space is reclaimed when you pick the EV version. So the EV version of the i3 is compromised to accommodate the REx.

Cars without the REx will generally fill the space with the heat pump option (which the REx does without). I think you can specify it with neither REx nor heat pump - but I can't think *why* anyone would do so! In that instance, though - yes there's nothing in the void bar a bloody big structural bar that's absent with the REx.

The fuel tank is tiny:

 

[Realist]

The i3 has too low range, the i8 is a Fisker Karma with better badging.....If that sounds dismissive, well I guess it is.

The Fisker is primarily driven electric but with a Range Extender.

The i8 is a hybrid. The major power source is the combustion engine. The electric engine can operate on its own but most of the time the engines work together.

The cars are entirely different.

 

[m.rudolf]

Impressions from my visit to IAA concerning i3 an Model S:

The i3 interior looks tiny but it isn't (well at least not as tiny as I thought): the trunk is about 70 cm deep x 100 cm wide an 32 cm high under the "parcel shelf". That means it is as wide and as high as a Prius trunk with only 10-15 cm less depth (same goes for the comparison with Volt/Ampera. If I adjust the drivers seat for my needs there is 34 cm of space between front and rear seat (Prius 32 cm and Ampera 28 cm). The frunk is really tiny but should be sufficient for a (long) charging cable, adapters and emergency kit (things I wouldn't know where to put in an Ampera/Volt).

The seating position is good. I can sit on both the front as well as the rear seat with more than 5 mm headroom - something which can't be said for the backseat of a Prius, Ampera or Model S. You sit higher over the cabin floor compared to a Model S and that felt much more comfortable for me. But the doors are very thick which makes entry slightly difficult and I absolutely hate the suicide rear doors - who would want to always open the front doors before being able to open the rear doors.

The interior design looks great - especially the Lodge version. Fit and finish are okay. Leather on the seats was mostly good but with some wrinkles (Tesla's two Model S on display showed slightly more wrinkles but no "raw" carbon fiber).

The exterior looks good for me - I actually prefer the futuristic, boxy look to Tesla's voluptous curves. Ground clearance seems adequate (without the means to acurately measure it, I would say it's the same as on a normal Golf VII).

The sunroof is a joke: it's tiny and not even remotely comparable to Tesla's pano roof.

I still haven't decided if I should order one or not but most of my worries after reading about the i3's shortcomings have dissipated. Probably will have to let my reservation expire and wait till I can drive one.

 

[Discoducky]

@surfingslovak, thanks for the videos! Very cool to see the carbon fibre bonding agents being applied and the robots look very familiar Also, proud of the product coming out of the Moses Lake plant!

The frunk is really tiny but should be sufficient for a (long) charging cable, adapters and emergency kit (things I wouldn't know where to put in an Ampera/Volt).

Great write up and would agree with most of your post but I'm wondering if the i3 you saw has a different 'frunk' than the one I saw. No way anything other than a small ladies purse would fit in the one I saw which was wedge shaped, pointing down. Maybe 12" long, 4" wide and 9" deep.

 

[m.rudolf]

Maybe 12" long, 4" wide and 9" deep.

30 cm x 10 cm x 23 cm cm seems smaller than what I remember but I didn't measure it (because it really is too small to put actual luggage in it). I would say it was more like 40 cm x 20 cm x 20 cm (conversions into non-SI units have to be done by the reader).

Oh, and one other data point: if you fold the rear seat the cargo area's length was 158 cm.

 

[Discoducky]

I wish I had taken a picture as the hood was closed pretty fast. But maybe someone has a good pic. I was really expecting more cargo space and could not believe how small it was. Was hoping for at least one piece of luggage.

Really cool how much carbon fibre is in the car. Makes me think of how much lighter Model S could be...

 

[surfingslovak]

I wish I had taken a picture as the hood was closed pretty fast. But maybe someone has a good pic. I was really expecting more cargo space and could not believe how small it was. Was hoping for at least one piece of luggage.

Really cool how much carbon fibre is in the car. Makes me think of how much lighter Model S could be...

Here are couple of photos a fellow LEAFer and friend has snapped at the Alt Car Expo in Santa Monica this weekend. I have another video mashup in the works, which highlights the carbon fiber manufacturing chain spanning Moses Lake, Wackersdorf and Leipzig. I have good prior experience with this material from another field, and would have to agree that it could be a great fit for the automotive industry. Perhaps this will be remembered as the most significant contribution the i3 and BMW brought to the table through this program.

There is the new CARB rule for the BEVx too, and while it's significant, I'm not sure if that's something to call out and be proud of. Yes, it will likely help lure a number of people from their ICE, and put them into something more advanced and interesting. Although that's true, I also feel that this type of focus might have prevented BMW from pursuing a more credible pure BEV in their first attempt.

I've been getting more active in the German-speaking EV community, and a surprising number of prospects are selecting the BEV over the range-extended variant. Naturally, they all have questions about the range, and how far they can expect to go on the autobahn, when driving at the recommended speed (richtgeschwindigkeit) of 130 km/h, which is approximately 80 mph. It's a bit heartbreaking to be the bearer of bad news, and point out that the range likely won't exceed 100 kilometers or 60 miles at that speed. And that's in good weather.

 

[tommolog]

I wish I had taken a picture as the hood was closed pretty fast. But maybe someone has a good pic. I was really expecting more cargo space and could not believe how small it was. Was hoping for at least one piece of luggage.

Really cool how much carbon fibre is in the car. Makes me think of how much lighter Model S could be...

No luggage space for sure. I always carry 150' of 10ga extension cords with me so they'll go up there. It's just big enough for the portable EVSE, cables, connectors and a small tool kit. Just the stuff you always carry around with you, definitely not groceries or luggage:

 

[Discoducky]

Wow, way bigger than he prototype I saw. That one looks about 300% bigger. Happy to see they've addressed the issue...somewhat

 

[surfingslovak]

No luggage space for sure.

I think Mary might have had the best application so far. The ultimate beach mobile?

 

[ev-enthusiast]

Licensing of BMW i3 vehicle in Germany

Looks like in Germany first i3 vehicles are licensed:
July: 24
August: 77
Should be mostly Test-Drive-vehicles or showroom vehicles.
vehicle deliveries to end-customers is expected to be only a few this Year.

 

[Lloyd]

Here is a good writeup from BMWCCA, and BMW press release

https://www.bmwcca.org/node/6595