buy used model S with AP1 or wait for used model S with EAP

[dk10438]

so here's my dilemma. Currently I'm driving a 2012 GTR but I'm sick of buying gas so I've decided to get rid of it and have started shopping for a used MS and want a 2016 P90D under 30k miles with the facelift which can probably be had for somewhere between 75k and 85k (might consider a non performance version with the same). Unfortunately, there are very few to no 2016's with EAP. When I speak to Tesla, they tell me that AP1 and EAP function the same so there's no real advantage to trying to get a car with EAP since there isn't the appropriate regulatory approval (at least not at this time).

So my question is this, is the general consensus that EAP is significantly better (or will be) and should I wait for a 2016/17 with EAP to drop into that price range or do you guys think that EAP won't ever be capable of FSD and it's not worth the wait???

 

[steve841]

Speaking as an AP1 owner.. Tesla is right.

EAP is making strides but no clear timeline AND ever changing AP versions ...

So, IMO, find what you like and get it. AP1 or >...

 

[bmah]

There is no consensus. The autopilot and FSD features have different values to different people. I’ve been quite happy with AP1 for long distance driving assistance. With the Version 9 software, it’s the first time that EAP cars (with (AP2/2.5) can do something qualitatively different than AP1 cars (your contact at Tesla was wrong in this sense). No one knows for sure how far away FSD is, or what hardware it’ll take. Some people eschew all of the above features and didn’t even buy any of the autopilot-type functionality. It depends on what’s important to you.

Bruce.

 

[P85_DA]

There is no consensus. The autopilot and FSD features have different values to different people. I’ve been quite happy with AP1 for long distance driving assistance. With the Version 9 software, it’s the first time that EAP cars (with (AP2/2.5) can do something qualitatively different than AP1 cars (your contact at Tesla was wrong in this sense). No one knows for sure how far away FSD is, or what hardware it’ll take. Some people eschew all of the above features and didn’t even buy any of the autopilot-type functionality. It depends on what’s important to you.

Bruce.

Agreed drove over 65k AP1 miles and car was great ..on my AP2.5 NoA seems more of a gimmick than being actually practical ....

 

[croman]

By the time HW2 came out, Tesla had switched to the P100D, so it makes sense you can't get a P90D with EAP since P90Ds, even refresh ones, were almost exclusively before HW2 debut. Further, some P90D owners that bought before P100D announcement were promised an upgrade path and some did upgrade.

The 100kwh battery pack is much better than the 90kwh packs. I would avoid P90D and see about P100D w AP1 if it's in budget. A used 100D can do 4.1s 0-60mph and likely even faster with better tires. Fast enough and tons of range and comes with EAP and no performance premium.

 

[glide]

Performance model S > any autopilot version

 

[AMPd]

By the time HW2 came out, Tesla had switched to the P100D, so it makes sense you can't get a P90D with EAP since P90Ds, even refresh ones, were almost exclusively before HW2 debut. Further, some P90D owners that bought before P100D announcement were promised an upgrade path and some did upgrade.

The 100kwh battery pack is much better than the 90kwh packs. I would avoid P90D and see about P100D w AP1 if it's in budget. A used 100D can do 4.1s 0-60mph and likely even faster with better tires. Fast enough and tons of range and comes with EAP and no performance premium.

I have a P90D and completely agree with this post.
I would take a 100D over a P90D in a heart beat

Op before jumping into a P90D, look into the battery supercharging throttling thread.

If you fast charge, Tesla will permanently throttle charging

 

[dk10438]

what does the P90D have to do with fast charging? and are the superchargers fastDC chargers?

I do seem to remember reading that there was a limited number of ludicrous launches it could do before the software disabled it in order to preserve the battery.

 

[ucmndd]

what does the P90D have to do with fast charging? and are the superchargers fastDC chargers?

The basic issue is that the 90kwh batteries are turds and have proven less reliable and more prone to degradation than basically any other pack.

 

[croman]

The basic issue is that the 90kwh batteries are turds

Yea, that's what I meant to say when I said the 90s have "issues"

 

[dk10438]

are the later 90kwh batteries (ie v3) prone to premature degradation or failure as well? and is there anyway to determine by VIN or production date if one of the newer batteries was used?

 

[rdrcrmatt]

I just bought a P90DL CPO with AP1. LOVE IT.

 

[Xenoilphobe]

Get a 100D, I don't buy into the speculation that the 90D battery is a turd, but some people on here want to make that perception a reality. I have a 90D and its awesome! It charges at 107kw and has NO range degradation, but I would pay for a little more range and the new tech, faster charging in the 100D battery. Auto Pilot 1 is great just did a 500 mile college visit with my son this weekend without any glitches. It has one glitch, when you exceed 85 MPH - it shuts off - or maybe it was 100 MPH... I can't remember, but it wouldn't let me re-engage it until I shut the car off and turned it back on... also the 90D has plenty of power P85D + has so much power that the following quote applies: "With great power comes great responsiblity"

 

[MC408]

Not to downsell you, but you may want to look into the P85D (2014 / 2015) as there are a ton hitting the market and prices seem to be driving down to low $50s.

If the price delta between a P85D and P90D is $25-$35k difference, you can buy and drive for a few years and if/when AP2.5 or higher has a significant benefit, you have the extra money banked for your upgrade and won’t take as big a hit on the trade in/ upgrade.

Just speaking from my own experience as that is the route I chose and I couldn’t be happier with my P85D right now (well if it has Ludacrous or if that was still and option, I may be a little happier!) lol.

P85D seems like the best bang for your buck on the used market right now IMO.

 

[MC408]

Oh. And with the early built P85Ds (pre April 2015) you can find one with the + suspension. Something you can’t get on the later built P90Ds.

P85D (pre/post April) ride performance

Happy hunting!

 

[dk10438]

Appreciate the replies. I'm really trying to keep the car in the 75-85k range. For me, this all started thinking I could get a used BMW i3 as a commuter car can keep my beloved GTR with the cost being offset by gas savings (usually 6 or 7 fill ups per month @50-55 per). i3 would strictly be commuting, ie no highway use so then I'd have 2 limited use cars and neither could be used for the weekend soccer tournaments etc...

So then I ordered a M3 but again, it seemed ridiculous to have a 60k car as the "commuter" at least for me. So now I'm exploring an MS (75-85 price point was chosen because GTR is worth 55-60k and I was planning on spending up to 25k)

If I had to spend greater than 30k then it's not worth it to me because the primary motivation was to save some money on gas...

 

[henderrj]

I have an AP1 car with 130000 miles on it. I absolutely love the car. And there's no way that I would buy another Tesla with less than ap2 Hardware. I have a friend with a model 3 and I just drove the latest version of software for its EAP. It's clearly better now, and will only get better with time. Go for the autopilot 2 and up Hardware. It'll also keep the resale value up dramatically.

 

[dk10438]

Oh. And with the early built P85Ds (pre April 2015) you can find one with the + suspension. Something you can’t get on the later built P90Ds.

P85D (pre/post April) ride performance

Happy hunting!

Hmm
may have to explore this option.

 

[Xenoilphobe]

You have tons of options to consider:

EV-CPO.com - Tesla New, Used, and CPO Inventory Listings

 

[Xenoilphobe]

Hmm
may have to explore this option.

My DD is a P85+, love it, almost to 80,000 miles.. every time I go in to trade it in, I can't get over the new soft suspension... my wifes 90D has the new soft suspension and AP1, I use that one for long road trips like this weekend, but I miss the suspension in the P85+...

Another option is to look at the regular Model 3 and then get the MPP suspension and some nice light wheels added...

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