Can charge but cannot supercharge

[Daniellane]

Has everything been good since they replaced the defective part(s) in 2018? Just wondering if this is a problematic component or just a one off.

I am going to a service appointment tomorrow morning.

Funny you should ask
That car had so many issues, I won’t get into… that it would have qualified for the lemon law. Tesla offered me a full credit (less sales tax…) which I accepted.
They were extremely understanding and cooperative…
I used the refund towards a 100D. (Not required by the offer)

 

[MP3Mike]

Dang...that's worrisome. Replacing an entire $3000 onboard charger for a supercharger issue? The supercharger basically bypasses the onboard charger, so I'm wondering what actually failed...a $50 relay?

No, it doesn't bypass it. The Supercharger actually gets connected directly to the AC input of the charger as well as the battery. The charger has to just ignore it. It could be that something fails and causes an isolation issue.

 

[mspohr]

No, it doesn't bypass it. The Supercharger actually gets connected directly to the AC input of the charger as well as the battery. The charger has to just ignore it. It could be that something fails and causes an isolation issue.

The charger still needs to regulate the DC

 

[MP3Mike]

The charger still needs to regulate the DC

No, that is handled by the Supercharger equipment itself. (The battery BMS tells the Supercharger what voltage and current it wants.)

 

[mspohr]

No, that is handled by the Supercharger equipment itself. (The battery BMS tells the Supercharger what voltage and current it wants.)

And that information goes through the charger...

 

[J-a-x]

Brought my car in on Thursday. Before I arrived at the service center they presented me with a repair estimate which said they were replacing the contactor and charging module for DC fast charging issues. They said they were able to remotely diagnose the issue. They also said that since they knew what was going on, it would be a one-day repair. Estimated repair completion time in the app passed without any communication so I reached out. Now they say they need to keep my car all weekend which turns it into a minimum five day repair. No loaners available. I wish I had told me when I brought it in that It was going to take so long or I would’ve planning to get a rental or something.

Also, service advisor told me today that they spent all day yesterday simply diagnosing the issue, which I was previously told they had diagnosed remotely before I brought it in! They haven’t even started doing the work yet!

Is this normal for Tesla service?

 

[dbldwn02]

No, it doesn't bypass it. The Supercharger actually gets connected directly to the AC input of the charger as well as the battery. The charger has to just ignore it. It could be that something fails and causes an isolation issue.

Keyword: "basically"

I took mine apart when Level 2 charging failed but supercharging was still working. Wrote a diy on it.

The large gauge wires hit the orange contactor...orange contactor flips to bypass and sends the DC out the HV cables and bypasses the whole AC/DC conversion process. Doesn't touch probably 95% of the electronics in the charger.

My point being, supercharging bypasses all the expensive crap in the onboard charger but Tesla insists on replacing the entire charger for $3k. They replace a faulty $20 sensor or whatever was causing the problem, and sell it to the next person for $3k

 

[dbldwn02]

Is this normal for Tesla service?

Depends on the service center in question...but generally yes. High school grads following what a computer tells them to touch. No critical thinking involved.

 

[mspohr]

Keyword: "basically"

I took mine apart when Level 2 charging failed but supercharging was still working. Wrote a diy on it.

The large gauge wires hit the orange contactor...orange contactor flips to bypass and sends the DC out the HV cables and bypasses the whole AC/DC conversion process. Doesn't touch probably 95% of the electronics in the charger.

My point being, supercharging bypasses all the expensive crap in the onboard charger but Tesla insists on replacing the entire charger for $3k. They replace a faulty $20 sensor or whatever was causing the problem, and sell it to the next person for $3k

Nobody (except DIYers) does component level repairs.

 

[mspohr]

Depends on the service center in question...but generally yes. High school grads following what a computer tells them to touch. No critical thinking involved.

You don't want techs doing creative thinking. Just follow procedure. Don't jury-rig anything.

 

[mongo]

Third person unsolicited clarification attempt:
When Supercharging, the current flow bypasses the vehicle charger via the direct connection contactors.
The vehicle charger is still connected to the charge port and is connected to the DC Fast Charging (DCFC) feed on both its input and output terminals.
The DCFC cabinet supplys a current that is the lesser of its maximum output and what the vehicle charger requests.

If the charger has an internal fault, that could take out AC charging, DCFC, or both.
If the direct connect contactors fail open, that takes out DCFC. If they fail closed I think the car won't re-engage the main contactors. Similarly, a vehicle charger fault can prevent pack activation.

 

[dbldwn02]

You don't want techs doing creative thinking. Just follow procedure. Don't jury-rig anything.

The labor charge makes you think they have PhDs in electrical engineering though. Lol

 

[J-a-x]

The issue is resolved.

They ended up replacing only the contractors not the controller and all is good. Took just under a week to get my car back but pretty sure the actual work just took a few hours based on when my car was inside the shop instead of sitting out in their lo lt (monitored via TeslaFi).

 

[J-a-x]

*contactors

 

[Olle]

I just had a similar charging problem, although intermittent. Car at service center now for HV pack contactors. Although those are located inside the pack, SC says it's not covered under pack warranty. They write parts only "literally inside pack" are covered under warranty. But in service manual you clearly see that contactors are literally inside the pack.

Does anybody have any clarity regarding this?
I would have taken Tesla's word for this if it weren't for warranty confusion in the past. (As an example they wanted customer pay for LED headlight assembly replacement while under warranty because of a clause saying that "light bulbs" are not under warranty. When I asked them to show me the light bulb, they said there is none and went on to replace the headlight assembly under warranty.)

 

[mongo]

I just had a similar charging problem, although intermittent. Car at service center now for HV pack contactors. Although those are located inside the pack, SC says it's not covered under pack warranty. They write parts only "literally inside pack" are covered under warranty. But in service manual you clearly see that contactors are literally inside the pack.

Does anybody have any clarity regarding this?
I would have taken Tesla's word for this if it weren't for warranty confusion in the past. (As an example they wanted customer pay for LED headlight assembly replacement while under warranty because of a clause saying that "light bulbs" are not under warranty. When I asked them to show me the light bulb, they said there is none and went on to replace the headlight assembly under warranty.)

Parts that can be replaced without replacing the >$10k block of cells are not part of the battery warranty.

 

[Olle]

Parts that can be replaced without replacing the >$10k block of cells are not part of the battery warranty.

Good to know. I read the warranty text (2016 S) and don't see it. Where did you find that limitation?

 

[mongo]

Good to know. I read the warranty text (2016 S) and don't see it. Where did you find that limitation?

It's not a limitation, it's the difference between the battery proper and the pack which is the cells plus the additional discrete HV components

The Tesla lithium-ion battery (the “Battery”)
If your Battery or Drive Unit requires warranty service, Tesla will repair the unit, or replace it with a factory reconditioned unit

 

[Olle]

Well that's essentially what the service advisor is telling me too. How did you figure this out?

The facts make it so counter intuitive:

• the pack is designed as a quick swappable and sealed unit
• the distinction between 'battery' and 'battery pack' is not written anywhere in the warranty docs

 

[mongo]

Well that's essentially what the service advisor is telling me too. How did you figure this out?

The facts make it so counter intuitive:

• the pack is designed as a quick swappable and sealed unit
• the distinction between 'battery' and 'battery pack' is not written anywhere in the warranty docs

Mostly unguided rationalization... Warranty is to protect from unexpected big expense. Only the block of cells is a big expense. Other parts are small in comparison and so do not need to be under the coverage umbrella. Loosely, it's like having a deductible.
Anything that requires unsealing the pack seems like it would be warranty, service can't relid them. The electronics penthouse is serviceable without even removing the pack.
Model S Service Manual | Tesla