Climate Change Denial

[MitchP85D]

I'm not so sure about cloud cover by itself, but surely CO2 is small compared to all other variables combined. The thing, is, all other variables are largely in balance, otherwise we would see much larger ups and downs, especially aside from the trend that corresponds to the CO2 change. The trend that we see does not require larger variables than CO2 and the mostly obvious higher temperature -> more water vapor reinforcement.

Also, the outward radiation at the surface, which corresponds to the black body radiation, is largely in balance with measurable incoming short wave and long wave radiation at the surface, not leaving that much space for additional factors (like adiabetic pressure). (Unless these largely cancel each other out, which would pose the question of why bring them into the climate change discussion in the first place.)

Nevertheless, that's why climate science spends so much effort in creating complex models and simulations: in order to verify all factors that might play a role. And that's why Lindzen, Curry and Spencer do get a certain amount of attention from climate scientists in general. It's just that their desire for political attention is not in relation to the significance of their research compared to climate science as a whole.

Curry, Lindzen, and Spencer have no desire for political attention. They don't seek it. But they do get called in for congressional testimony sometimes.

 

[CyberGus]

 

[eevee-fan]

Curry, Lindzen, and Spencer have no desire for political attention. They don't seek it. But they do get called in for congressional testimony sometimes.

On that video I initially posted to refute your 'global cooling' claim, Dr. Spencer literally said he thinks scientists should play politician. BTW, why does his site not fess up that there is no 'global cooling' happening even after he had to admit to it on video. LOL

 

[nwdiver]

External costs is just a faulty concept from the land of liberaldom.

No External costs? ..... what are you smoking?

 

[eevee-fan]

CleanTechnica: Coal Plant Explosion In Australia Shows Why Tesla Batteries & Renewables Are The Future Of Energy.

Coal Plant Explosion In Australia Shows Why Tesla Batteries & Renewables Are The Future Of Energy - CleanTechnica

Sign up for daily news updates from CleanTechnica on email. Or follow us on Google News! A Tesla Powerpack recently stepped in to save the day when a coal-fired plant at the Callide Power Station in Queensland, Australia, exploded. Teslarati reported that the explosion resulted in mass power...

cleantechnica.com

 

[Norbert]

External costs is just a faulty concept from the land of liberaldom. The benefits of fossil fuels to humanity far outweigh any harm caused by the ancient fuel. But as our technology advances, we'll eventually replace fossil fuels with something better and cheaper. Let the scientists, engineers, and the free market sort it all out. Get out of their way, and get the bureaucrats off heir backs.

"Eventually" it will happen, however it would happen too far in the future. Now is better. External costs are real, just like monopolies and anti-competitive behavior in the absence of intervention, and too much lobbyism. Also, is this a vote to end all subsidies for fossil fuels?

 

[eevee-fan]

NBC News: A faction of conservatives pushes to build its own climate movement.

A faction of conservatives pushes to build its own climate movement

At a rally next month in Miami, one group is trying to kick-start a conservative grassroots climate movement.

www.nbcnews.com

 

[nwdiver]

Get out of their way, and get the bureaucrats off heir backs.

Stop working backwards from an ideologically formed conclusion. 'Bureaucrats' are a critical part of the force pushing society forward. Without government support there's ~0 chance we would have nuclear power, fracking, affordable solar, modern EVs, etc, etc. Those technologies took far too long to yield a profit. To this day 100% of our nuclear fuel comes from government owned companies. The US tried to privatize Uranium enrichment... it failed almost immediately.

Greatest Achievements of Public Policy​

 

[DrLOAC]

Isn’t venus closer to the sun?

Yes. Which means at the top of the atmosphere it receives more energy than Earth but less than Mercury.

However have you ever seen Venus at night? It’s very bright. Due to clouds of SO2 which reflect visible light in the upper atmosphere it reflects 75% of that energy. So in fact should be colder than Earth at the surface. Yet it’s almost 3 times hotter than Earth and almost twice as hot as Mercury which gets close to 4 times as much energy.

Now the physics denier community would like us to believe that Venus is hot because it’s atmosphere has more pressure than Earth and gases warm when compressed.

The problem is thermal systems try to reach an equilibrium with their surroundings. Venus is very hot, space is very cold and only a fraction of the energy required from the sun to maintain that hot high pressure atmosphere actually makes it through the upper atmosphere.

Since that atmosphere appears to be in thermal equilibrium only a small amount of heat, roughly equivalent to amount that makes it the surface, can escape to space.

Now you may have experienced in your own life that hotter things radiate more heat but when you put insulation between you and the heat source it radiates less - like the difference between an open oven and a closed one.

Could it be that there is something insulating Venus? It just so happens we’ve known for over a century that CO2 which makes up 96% of Venus’s atmosphere, absorbs and re-radiates infrared heat. So every little infrared photon trying to escape Venus to space to bring its atmosphere into thermal equilibrium has trillions of chances of hitting a CO2 molecule and being re-radiated in a random direction.

So there we go. A very nice theory that matches our observations and other theories about heat transfer that explains why Venus is so much hotter than Mercury and Earth. No magical perpetually hot compressed gases.

 

[DrLOAC]

Curry, Lindzen, and Spencer have no desire for political attention. They don't seek it. But they do get called in for congressional testimony sometimes.

I see you are continuing your love of “climate scientists” with ties to fossil fuels with Lindzen there. He works for the libertarian Cato institute which was founded by the Koch brothers.

 

[eevee-fan]

On that video I initially posted to refute your 'global cooling' claim, Dr. Spencer literally said he thinks scientists should play politician. BTW, why does his site not fess up that there is no 'global cooling' happening even after he had to admit to it on video. LOL

LOL

 

[MitchP85D]

So if Venus is so hot because of the pressure (according to you) and Earth and Venus are roughly the same mass what’s driving the super high pressure on Venus since they both have roughly the same gravity…..

View attachment 667794

That is Giorgio Tsoukalos. Here is a brief little debate between Dr. Richard Lindzen and your hero, Bill Nye the "science guy" back in 2007. This is why not too many global warming zealots want to debate Lindzen.

 

[MitchP85D]

On that video I initially posted to refute your 'global cooling' claim, Dr. Spencer literally said he thinks scientists should play politician. BTW, why does his site not fess up that there is no 'global cooling' happening even after he had to admit to it on video. LOL

You haven't refuted a thing.

 

[MitchP85D]

No External costs? ..... what are you smoking?

Those costs are just a mere blip compared to the benefits fossil fuels brought to humanity. You are just an ingrate.

 

[MitchP85D]

"Eventually" it will happen, however it would happen too far in the future. Now is better. External costs are real, just like monopolies and anti-competitive behavior in the absence of intervention, and too much lobbyism. Also, is this a vote to end all subsidies for fossil fuels?

This fossil fuel age we are living in is just a mere infinitesimal increment of time compared to the paleoclimate time scale.

 

[eevee-fan]

You haven't refuted a thing.

Well, you did not have a come back, so seems like I did. Plus, your hero was on video admitting it. 2 point for me.

 

[MitchP85D]

Stop working backwards from an ideologically formed conclusion. 'Bureaucrats' are a critical part of the force pushing society forward. Without government support there's ~0 chance we would have nuclear power, fracking, affordable solar, modern EVs, etc, etc. Those technologies took far too long to yield a profit. To this day 100% of our nuclear fuel comes from government owned companies. The US tried to privatize Uranium enrichment... it failed almost immediately.

Greatest Achievements of Public Policy​

Bureaucrats are by far more of a burden than a benefit to society. A primary example is the enforcement of our convoluted income tax law. Enormous time and resources are spent to comply with the thousands of rules. And many of those rules are subject to interpretation. Bureaucrats will target people they don't like politically, look through their taxes and see if the taxpayer took a proper write-off or not. This is highly unproductive, but this what happens when the statists get in charge. Bureaucrats harass Americans they don't like. And that is why I don't like bureaucrats!

 

[eevee-fan]

That is Giorgio Tsoukalos. Here is a brief little debate between Dr. Richard Lindzen and your hero, Bill Nye the "science guy" back in 2007. This is why not too many global warming zealots want to debate Lindzen.

So he can out debate a Mechanical Engineer, great job, LOL!

BTW, he agreed that a 2 degree rise would be a big concern... we surpassed 1 degree already and it's accelerating.

 

[MitchP85D]

Well, you did not have a come back, so seems like I did. Plus, your hero was on video admitting it. 2 point for me.

Admitting what? 0 point.

 

[MitchP85D]

So he can out debate a Mechanical Engineer, great job, LOL!

I know you didn't watch it.