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Decision between Enhanced Autopilot vs. FSD
- Thread starter lucas11ger
- Start date
beatle
Active Member
Tesla's full price for either is too steep for what you get, IMO. Having the ability to have the car change lanes without disabling AP is nice, and I do use summon occasionally to back the car out of the garage, but if my car didn't come with EAP, I wouldn't give Tesla $6k.
I see no value that FSD offers at this time, so $12k for that is even more absurd.
You can try out FSD for $200/mo before shelling out a lump sum. Though I hate the idea of subscriptions, you need to own the car for 5 years before you make that lump sum worth it.
I see no value that FSD offers at this time, so $12k for that is even more absurd.
You can try out FSD for $200/mo before shelling out a lump sum. Though I hate the idea of subscriptions, you need to own the car for 5 years before you make that lump sum worth it.
^^^ what beatle said. None of the assisted driving options are remotely worth what Tesla is charging. Go with base AP and call it a day. Rent FSD if you want from time to time. IF you do go with FSD, assume it is always trying to kill you and be vigilant.
Tesla says it is Beta and they aren't kidding. Sometimes it can be pretty good but as soon as you let your guard down; wham! I had it almost steer me into an oncoming car at 40 mph.
You know how I know they aren't worth what Tesla is charging? Just look at resale values of cars with and without FSD. There is almost no difference in price and Tesla doesn't give you jack when you trade one in with FSD.
So rent if for a while and if you REALLY like it, then buy it. Even then I'd just keep renting it. Take the 12k and put in an investment account and give Tesla $200/mo for the rent. Unless you are going to keep the car at least 5+ years, no sense in buying it.
Tesla says it is Beta and they aren't kidding. Sometimes it can be pretty good but as soon as you let your guard down; wham! I had it almost steer me into an oncoming car at 40 mph.
You know how I know they aren't worth what Tesla is charging? Just look at resale values of cars with and without FSD. There is almost no difference in price and Tesla doesn't give you jack when you trade one in with FSD.
So rent if for a while and if you REALLY like it, then buy it. Even then I'd just keep renting it. Take the 12k and put in an investment account and give Tesla $200/mo for the rent. Unless you are going to keep the car at least 5+ years, no sense in buying it.
RTPEV
Active Member
There's what DID I choose and what WOULD I choose.
5 years ago, I chose EAP for $5K because at the time I wanted to invest in Tesla's mission (this was at the very beginning of the Model 3 ramp, so they were certainly not in the same financial position they are now) and be at least partway to FSD. I had no expectation that FSD would be coming any time soon (despite Elon Musk's insistence back then of an LA to NY unassisted "summon"--I am even less optimistic today by the way!) but I did figure that if I kept my car long enough, eventually I could see getting FSD. Back then of course, it was $9K all in, with EAP being the first $5K.
Then they had a fire sale on FSD for only $2K, so I took advantage of it, again not figuring it would be truly FSD any time soon, but I saw an opportunity to grab it, so I took it.
But would I do that again today? No way! I could easily live without FSD. It's really not a driver assistance tool at this point. While it may do the right thing 99% of the time, you have to pay a lot of attention and be ready for that 1% 100% of the time. It can't be used to earn money or to multi-task while driving to work or any of the other things that supposedly make it worth the money now, and it won't be for a very long time.
As for EAP, I would certainly miss the ability to be able to use my turn signal to initiate a lane change. Navigate on Autopilot is nice, but before they merged FSD onto the highway stack I would mostly have it off because it wasn't reliable in changing lanes automatically. Even now I have "minimal lane changes" turned on and it still insists on occasionally changing lanes when I don't want it to. But do I think that capability is worth $6K? No, not really. And I really only use that on road trips anyway. The other EAP features like smart summon really don't work reliably anyway.
As for FSD, it's valuation at $12K is based on it's potential future value as a way to let your car earn money. But when will that be? We have no official timeline, nor could we as not only does it depend on future technological progress, but also regulatory approvals. And believe me, progress towards that goal has been incremental at best. It will not be any time soon.
Take a look at how the resale market values FSD. I have heard it's about a $2-3K bump, which seems about right. And I'm pretty sure that's pricing in the value of just the EAP feature to change lanes when prompted. I'd stick with the plan of subscribing to FSD occasionally (such as on road trips when the EAP features would be most useful). At $200/month, that's about 30 months worth of road trips to get up to the EAP level, which unless you are always taking road trips is probably going to last you 8-10 years anyway. And you may actually find that it's not even as useful as the "influencers" and Elon are telling you.
5 years ago, I chose EAP for $5K because at the time I wanted to invest in Tesla's mission (this was at the very beginning of the Model 3 ramp, so they were certainly not in the same financial position they are now) and be at least partway to FSD. I had no expectation that FSD would be coming any time soon (despite Elon Musk's insistence back then of an LA to NY unassisted "summon"--I am even less optimistic today by the way!) but I did figure that if I kept my car long enough, eventually I could see getting FSD. Back then of course, it was $9K all in, with EAP being the first $5K.
Then they had a fire sale on FSD for only $2K, so I took advantage of it, again not figuring it would be truly FSD any time soon, but I saw an opportunity to grab it, so I took it.
But would I do that again today? No way! I could easily live without FSD. It's really not a driver assistance tool at this point. While it may do the right thing 99% of the time, you have to pay a lot of attention and be ready for that 1% 100% of the time. It can't be used to earn money or to multi-task while driving to work or any of the other things that supposedly make it worth the money now, and it won't be for a very long time.
As for EAP, I would certainly miss the ability to be able to use my turn signal to initiate a lane change. Navigate on Autopilot is nice, but before they merged FSD onto the highway stack I would mostly have it off because it wasn't reliable in changing lanes automatically. Even now I have "minimal lane changes" turned on and it still insists on occasionally changing lanes when I don't want it to. But do I think that capability is worth $6K? No, not really. And I really only use that on road trips anyway. The other EAP features like smart summon really don't work reliably anyway.
As for FSD, it's valuation at $12K is based on it's potential future value as a way to let your car earn money. But when will that be? We have no official timeline, nor could we as not only does it depend on future technological progress, but also regulatory approvals. And believe me, progress towards that goal has been incremental at best. It will not be any time soon.
Take a look at how the resale market values FSD. I have heard it's about a $2-3K bump, which seems about right. And I'm pretty sure that's pricing in the value of just the EAP feature to change lanes when prompted. I'd stick with the plan of subscribing to FSD occasionally (such as on road trips when the EAP features would be most useful). At $200/month, that's about 30 months worth of road trips to get up to the EAP level, which unless you are always taking road trips is probably going to last you 8-10 years anyway. And you may actually find that it's not even as useful as the "influencers" and Elon are telling you.
gtae07
Member
This is the only feature I'd like given the unreliability/beta ststus of FSD. I'm certainly not paying thousands of dollars to get it. Heck, I'd be happy with just automatic re-engage after the lane change.
If AP was available without wheel nags (using the camera instead), I'd probably be willing to pay $2k or so.
SalisburySam
Active Member
@lucas11ger you’ve posted the identical thread topic in another forum. Here’s my response from there:
Bought my 2018 Model 3 LR RWD with both EAP and FSD. I appreciate what the $5000 for EAP does for me but regret spending the then $3000 that FSD cost for what little value it actually delivers. Every drive I think of the many, many other things I could’ve done with that money instead of the betting-on-the-come vaporware it actually was in 2018 and remains so today. At the current price I only laugh, as it reminds me of the “I’m a prince in Nigeria” email scam of a few years ago.
Although I expect to have no other Tesla in the future, if I did I’d not make the FSD mistake again. I advise others who ask to skip this silliness, but if you wish, try it on the monthly option. You can always decide to get it, but if you buy you can never get your money back.
Bought my 2018 Model 3 LR RWD with both EAP and FSD. I appreciate what the $5000 for EAP does for me but regret spending the then $3000 that FSD cost for what little value it actually delivers. Every drive I think of the many, many other things I could’ve done with that money instead of the betting-on-the-come vaporware it actually was in 2018 and remains so today. At the current price I only laugh, as it reminds me of the “I’m a prince in Nigeria” email scam of a few years ago.
Although I expect to have no other Tesla in the future, if I did I’d not make the FSD mistake again. I advise others who ask to skip this silliness, but if you wish, try it on the monthly option. You can always decide to get it, but if you buy you can never get your money back.
EVRider-FL
Active Member
EVRider-FL
Active Member
Basic Autopilot is a standard option, and you don’t have to use it if you don’t like it. No need for “None of the Above” since it just deprives other people of the chance to use it.
Remember the OP is from Germany, so their experience will be vastly different to that of North America. Especially in a new USS-less car.
EAP gives "Navigate on Autopilot" and "Lane Change Assistant" for €3800. FSD Package gives "Traffic light and stop sign recognition" along with EAP features for €7500.
Anything else is "Future". Could be 6 months; could be 5 years.
Other points of note:
* Traffic light and stop sign recognition - This stops at every GREEN light unless there is a car in front that is going through until you acknowledge with the accelerator.
* NOA - UNECE rules mean it won't automatically take off-ramps. Driver has to signal to initiate it.
* Lane Change Assistant - UNECE rules make this fiddlier than in North America as the maneuver has to be started and completed in a certain amount of time from signalling otherwise it cancels and goes back to the original lane.
UNECE rules are unlikely to change before 2025, so the choice of paying for the upgrades depends on whether you think you're going to keep the car for many years and whether you believe that when the rules do change the cost of these packages will increase significantly.
EAP gives "Navigate on Autopilot" and "Lane Change Assistant" for €3800. FSD Package gives "Traffic light and stop sign recognition" along with EAP features for €7500.
Anything else is "Future". Could be 6 months; could be 5 years.
Other points of note:
* Traffic light and stop sign recognition - This stops at every GREEN light unless there is a car in front that is going through until you acknowledge with the accelerator.
* NOA - UNECE rules mean it won't automatically take off-ramps. Driver has to signal to initiate it.
* Lane Change Assistant - UNECE rules make this fiddlier than in North America as the maneuver has to be started and completed in a certain amount of time from signalling otherwise it cancels and goes back to the original lane.
UNECE rules are unlikely to change before 2025, so the choice of paying for the upgrades depends on whether you think you're going to keep the car for many years and whether you believe that when the rules do change the cost of these packages will increase significantly.
OxBrew
Active Member
I stopped even using the basic AP on open highways with no one around. It's mostly broken, again, after working really well for months at a time.
Save your money, try it out for a month or 6, see if you love it so much you want to pay full price for it. There is zero difference between paying for it before or after purchase, the price and capabilities are the same.
We can debate all day, but your experience could be anywhere along the spectrum from horrible to amazing, no one can predict where you will land.
Save your money, try it out for a month or 6, see if you love it so much you want to pay full price for it. There is zero difference between paying for it before or after purchase, the price and capabilities are the same.
We can debate all day, but your experience could be anywhere along the spectrum from horrible to amazing, no one can predict where you will land.
cdub
OG 2011 Leaf / 2023 Model Y LR
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