TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker or making a Paypal contribution here: paypal.me/SupportTMC

Do textile seats kill resale? I'm selling in 12-18 months - ordered wrong?

Discussion in 'Model S' started by calisnow, Mar 1, 2016.

  1. calisnow

    calisnow Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2014
    Messages:
    1,137
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    I very much want Autopilot 2.0 but I can't handle the wait any longer - so I finally hit the purchase button on an inventory car a couple minutes ago. Rather than lease (and be locked in for 3 years - I think AP 2.0 hardware is 1 year away, max), my strategy is to buy the cheapest AP Tesla I could find and plan to simply take the hit and sell it when Autopilot 2.0 is released - and at that point buy my loaded dream Tesla which I will keep for 10-15 years (as I usually do with cars).

    But now I'm worried that having purchased textile seats is/was a mistake - am I going to lose *more* than $2,500 (vs the Next Gen seats) on re-sale because people don't want expensive cars with cloth seats?

    Thanks for any advice.
     
  2. JeffS

    JeffS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2015
    Messages:
    239
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    I have Textile and am planning to have them reupholstered.

    I went the other way with the math. I can get Textiles, save $2500, and get better upholstery for the same $2500 by doing it custom aftermarket.

    With that said, my car is Dec 2014 build. Back then, there was an upcharge for leather and another upcharge for next gen. Not sure how it is now...
     
  3. spentan

    spentan Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2012
    Messages:
    1,256
    Location:
    SoCal
    I personally think that Textile will be a limiting factor to your future resale. Despite probably preferring textile at times, they will mentally find it difficult to purchase a car for 50-60k without leather. Especially when a camry can be bought with leather nowadays.

    I'd also strongly recommend the pano roof. Anything else, I wouldn't worry.
     
  4. calisnow

    calisnow Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2014
    Messages:
    1,137
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Thanks for the advice - the car is a black 70D with pano, autopilot - no other options. Maybe I should swap out for a car with Next gen.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Interesting thought - I hadn't considered that. Next Gen seats are $2,500 - there is no regular leather seat offered anymore.
     
  5. JeffS

    JeffS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2015
    Messages:
    239
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Depends how much this one costs...

    And a reverse opinion on Pano too...there are 2 options that, in my opinion, will ultimately detract from value (when warranty runs out). Pano and smart air suspension.

    Both are vulnerable and both are uber expensive to fix.

    If you are flipping the car, no biggie. But at least one opinion out there that those 2 options are more trouble than they are worth. Just one though.
     
  6. bart513

    bart513 Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2013
    Messages:
    979
    Location:
    East Hampton
    I bought an 85D with pano , textile seats and tech package. I personally like the textile seats as an animal advocate and I don't miss the leather in terms of the feel. Full disclosure I do wear leather shoes ...
     
  7. Larry93428

    Larry93428 Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2014
    Messages:
    371
    Location:
    Cambria California, United States
    Buy the car you want, love it, enjoy it.
    Resale cannot be predicted. Prospective buyers may have no preference at all.
    Get the car for you.
    ~Larry
     
  8. green1

    green1 Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2014
    Messages:
    4,116
    Location:
    Calgary, Alberta, Canada
    There is no such thing as an option that "kills resale". Every option you can order costs you more from the factory than someone will ever pay for it on the used market.
    Buy what you want, not what you think the next person wants.
     
  9. neroden

    neroden Happy Model S Owner

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2011
    Messages:
    3,572
    Location:
    Ithaca, NY, USA
    If you look at the used market, which I have, the only options which seem to add any value at *all* in the used market are:
    -- larger battery
    -- tech package (which is now standard)
    -- dual chargers

    So get what you want.
     
  10. cman8

    cman8 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2016
    Messages:
    289
    Location:
    United States
    Correct me if im wrong but didnt tesla work with PETA to develop faux leather?
     
  11. calisnow

    calisnow Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2014
    Messages:
    1,137
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    I respectfully disagree - if there is a factory option on a car which the vast majority of buyers do not want, speccing a car with that option certainly can kill resale. It's econ 101 - it shifts the demand curve to the left. Example: Ferraris. There is plenty of data showing that "resale red" 360's and 355's sell on the used market for significantly more money than other colors - we're talking thousands of dollars - when red cost no more new than yellow or black. Another example - the F1 transmission (which cost more money than the 6-speed manual) sells for $30,000 LESS on the used market because 6-speeds are relatively rare and highly desired.

    There's no reason to believe Teslas are immune to supply/demand economics. It could *certainly* be the case that data shows there is a price delta on the used market between cars with/without a particular option that is larger in magnitude than the original price of the option. Case in point? Autopilot - a $2,500 option which I believe is commanding far more than a $2,500 premium on the used market when compared to cars of equivalent miles and options which were built right before the hardware went into the cars in October 2014.

    Having said all that I just changed my order to a car whose color I preferred and it also has gray Next Gen seats. A few thousand more dollars, but who's counting...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Yes, but AFAIK it isn't available as of yet on the Model S - only the Model X. I could be totally wrong on that.
     
  12. cman8

    cman8 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2016
    Messages:
    289
    Location:
    United States
    Oh. Ok. I thought i had read that somehwere
     
  13. green1

    green1 Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2014
    Messages:
    4,116
    Location:
    Calgary, Alberta, Canada
    Sure, but do ANY of those ones have more value relative to other cars compared to the price of the option?

    eg, if an item costs 400 and option X costs 100, the total cost is 500,
    If on resale the item without X costs 200, and with X costs 250, then sure, it added value, but not enough to cover it's purchase price.

    Every single option out there fits in that category, there isn't a possible option you can buy that will be worth more on the resale market than what you pay for it at the factory.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Tesla's aren't even in the same class as Ferraris, they have entirely different demand drivers. Your next comparison to an F1 is even further off the mark.
    Teslas aren't rare super cars, they're premium sedans, and are easily obtainable.

    You're comparison breaks down because you're comparing older cars to newer cars, of course they're worth less money. If you want a valid comparison, look at a post-ap car, where they didn't buy the option.

    Sure Teslas aren't imune to supply and demand, that's what sets the prices. But the used market for Teslas is behaving rationally, in that the cars depreciate over time, and the options depreciate as well. This is exactly as Tesla predicted when they made their buy back guarantee, and has been proven time and time again by looking at the cars that have sold.
     
  14. Uncle Paul

    Uncle Paul Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2013
    Messages:
    353
    Location:
    San Diego
    My prediction is that while leather is a $2,500 option, it will only degrade the trade in price about $1,000 in 3 years. You should come out ahead when it is time for your dream configuration.
     
  15. eye.surgeon

    eye.surgeon Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2014
    Messages:
    709
    Location:
    California
    1. order what you want, not what you think the next owner will want.
    2. yes, cloth seats will hurt resale a bit, but more important than dollars is that it will take longer to sell. $2k here or there isn't going to break you, but an extra month or two on the market might hurt.
     
  16. KJD

    KJD Member

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2013
    Messages:
    630
    Location:
    SLC, UT
    If you really want 2.0 autopilot then just wait it out until they build it. You are just going to loose a ton of money dumping a car that is only a year old. Why go there?
     
  17. neroden

    neroden Happy Model S Owner

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2011
    Messages:
    3,572
    Location:
    Ithaca, NY, USA
    Going from a 60 to an 85 battery seemed (for a while) to be holding the full $10,000 value you paid for it. Nothing else did. This is probably because it's not upgradable without spending *waaaaaay* more than that, and the market for 60s is especially weak (since they can't always make it to the next Supercharger).
     
  18. green1

    green1 Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2014
    Messages:
    4,116
    Location:
    Calgary, Alberta, Canada
    "the full $10,000"? or more than? until it hits more than, it's not worth spending the money up front unless it's for you.
     
  19. calisnow

    calisnow Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2014
    Messages:
    1,137
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    #19 calisnow, Mar 1, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2016
    How else can I say this - I can afford it. I've waited long enough but the cars are not at the point where I will keep one 10 years - so this one time in my auto buying history I am going to quickly turn a car and eat the depreciation. Also dude - you live in SLC - I lived there one winter - your traffic is nothing (and your snow really is the best in the world - that's why I was there that winter). An autopilot Tesla in L.A.'s traffic will literally save me money by preventing the need for a therapist lol.
     
  20. David_Cary

    David_Cary Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2012
    Messages:
    607
    Location:
    Cary, NC
    Also - you are buying CPO or inventory - right? So there is that.

    I think truly enhanced functionality with AP 2.0 may be much more than 1 year out. Look AP 1.0 came out in 10/14 and it took a year to turn on the hardest part of it. And we have had incremental improvement in the next 4 months. And some worsening over that 4 months. Won't 2.0 be even harder. Truly game changing functionality might be 3 years away.

    As a used buyer - a 70D with textile is a nice value choice. Harder to sell - yes. But not $2500 cheaper. In LA - good leather reupholster is less than that.
     

Share This Page