TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker and becoming a Supporting Member. For more info: Support TMC

Does S/X get priority at supercharger?

Discussion in 'Model 3: Battery & Charging' started by cypho, Jan 6, 2020.

  1. cypho

    cypho Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2018
    Messages:
    743
    Location:
    USA
    Twice I have been charging at 500 + MPH, and then along comes a clueless/inconsiderate X and parks in the stall paired with mine. Both times my charging rate immediately plummeted to less than 200 MPH. I then moved over to another stall (we were the only two cars there) and my charging rate goes back up to 500 mph so I know it was not just my car tapering. The first time I was in B and I attributed it to A getting priority over B. But the most recent time I was in A and still lost out to the newcomer.

    The only other time I shared a charger, it was also an X, I arrived second (all other stalls were full) and I got nothing (less than 100mph) until the other car left.

    So it does not seem that the newcomer gets priority, or first come first serve. Do S/X just get priority over my 3 at chargers?
     
    • Funny x 3
    • Disagree x 1
  2. ElectricIAC

    ElectricIAC Devil’s Advocate

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2019
    Messages:
    2,176
    Location:
    DFW
    Interesting. As I understand it the first car is supposed to remain at its rate (tapering as SoC increases) with the second car picking up speed as the first begins tapering.
     
    • Disagree x 2
    • Like x 1
  3. TonyT

    TonyT Member

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2018
    Messages:
    792
    Location:
    Orange county, CA
    Interesting, More likely clueless, if they knew they would likely go to a non shared station if available. Unless they knew this and was being super rude, however I would imagine they still would get faster charging at a non shared.

    I have heard the first car still can loose some speed however I've never watch or checked my logs.
     
  4. M3BlueGeorgia

    M3BlueGeorgia Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2018
    Messages:
    1,282
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    Perhaps politely chat to the other driver and point out they'd get a faster rate by parking at an unpaired bay.
    Not everyone knows this.
     
    • Like x 5
    • Helpful x 1
  5. cypho

    cypho Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2018
    Messages:
    743
    Location:
    USA
    Both times the model X owners plugged in walked off. I'm not going to go chase someone down and tell them to move.
     
  6. ElectricIAC

    ElectricIAC Devil’s Advocate

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2019
    Messages:
    2,176
    Location:
    DFW
    Had not heard this last bit but down here in TX I rarely have to share stalls anyway. Interesting dealing with the limitations of a system designed for the previous generation of cars. Have you tried unplugging and plugging back in and seeing the result?
     
  7. MorrisonHiker

    MorrisonHiker S 100D 2020.48.30

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2015
    Messages:
    8,930
    Location:
    Colorado
    No, they do not get priority. You are just witnessing how paired Supercharger stalls work on v2 Superchargers. The same would happen if a Model 3 parked in a shared stall and started charging.
     
    • Like x 5
  8. ewoodrick

    ewoodrick Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2018
    Messages:
    5,285
    Location:
    Buford, GA
    No, no priority. But there seems to be a few reports that the charging algorithm might have changed.
     
  9. cypho

    cypho Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2018
    Messages:
    743
    Location:
    USA
    Really? My rate drops by way more than half? Do superchargers become super inefficient when charging two cars?

    By myself I get a 150KW. Shared I get 50. Assuming the other car is also only getting 50, where does the other 50KW go?

    It seems like they are giving us equal mph instead of equal KW.
     
  10. MorrisonHiker

    MorrisonHiker S 100D 2020.48.30

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2015
    Messages:
    8,930
    Location:
    Colorado
    #10 MorrisonHiker, Jan 6, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2020
    Things are not shared 50/50. There are dozens of other threads concerning pairing at Superchargers so I won't go into much detail here.

    Basically, on a v2 Supercharger, the first car to plug in gets priority. The second car then gets what remains. If the first car is charging ~120 kW, then the second car would initially get ~36 kW. As the first car lowers the kWs it is using, they are shifted over to the paired car. If you are plugged in first and getting the full 150 kW, then it will drop approximately 25% when someone plugs in after you at a paired charger. I believe it changes in 36 kW increments, IIRC. If you are getting 72 kW, then the second car to plug in will get about 72 kW as well when they plug in. If the first car is nearing the end of its charge, then they might only be using 36 kW and it would be possible for you to get close to 120 kW shortly after you plug in, depending on your state of charge, battery temperature, etc.

    In the first example that you gave, it sounds like you were getting most of the kW available at the Supercharger. Once the other car plugged in, it gave them the minimum ~36 kW, lowering what was available to your car. In your second example, it sounds like the other car had a really low state of charge so they were charging and probably getting the full 150 kW. When you plugged in, your car would've received the minimum ~36 kW and lowered the kW available to the first car. Once the other car left, you then had the entire 150 kW available for your car. If you dropped from 150 kW to 50 kW then there was either a problem or your car was already ramping down intentionally.

    I was traveling over the holidays and there were so many new Model 3 owners confused with how paired Superchargers worked. When I plugged in at one, a driver a few cars over complained that I had slowed his charge...but I had no other choice since the other pair of empty Superchargers was out of order. At another location, a driver complained that they couldn't get over 72 kW until the car next to them left. Both of these are due to paired Superchargers and the system was working exactly as designed.

    As suggested previously, it can be helpful to explain paired Superchargers and how both cars can charge faster if there are other non-paired Superchargers available. If they leave before you can mention it to them, you can move to a non-paired Supercharger yourself...but your car's charging might've already slowed down so it might not make much of a difference. Just try not to blame the other driver as they most likely don't know about pairing and they didn't create the paired Supercharger hardware.

    Fortunately pairing isn't an issue with v3 Superchargers.
     
    • Like x 5
    • Informative x 1
  11. cypho

    cypho Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2018
    Messages:
    743
    Location:
    USA
    I also thought first come first serve was how it was supposed to work. Perhaps with a slight drop.

    But I am first and am getting 150 kilowatt. Model x plugs in I drop down to 50 KW.
     
  12. ElectricIAC

    ElectricIAC Devil’s Advocate

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2019
    Messages:
    2,176
    Location:
    DFW
    V3 will be great when it actually gets widespread...until then: be mindful of how full SC stations are or consider an urban SC if available. Slower but at least you know what you’re getting.
     
  13. SouthSeas

    SouthSeas Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2019
    Messages:
    201
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Yes, if you are charging at over 108 kW the second car is assured to get 36 kW, so there won't be enough left to let you keep more than 108 kW. The total at a charger is 144 kW for the standard Supercharger, often referred to as 150 kW even though it's actually a bit lower.
     
  14. SouthSeas

    SouthSeas Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2019
    Messages:
    201
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Yeah, there's something messed up with that. Who did you piss off at Tesla??? ;)

    You might report this and see if there is something wrong with your car. It will be a tough sell however as Tesla is not good at believing their customers when they can just offer an explanation based on the idea you have no idea of what you are talking about. Take very detailed notes, photos of the screen, do a "bug report" to time stamp the change in charging rate. Then report all this and someone will dig into it... if you push hard enough.

    Oh yeah, don't bother with MPH numbers on the charging rates. Use the kW numbers always.
     
  15. Bruinfan

    Bruinfan Member

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2016
    Messages:
    164
    Location:
    Elk Grove, ca
    if someone plugs into my pair, when there are unpaired stalls available, I just view that as not knowing how it works, since it only would benefit them to not be second. I've never noticed a drop off, but maybe i'm not paying that close attention.

    But I just view that as a teaching opportunity. I politely inform them, before they leave, that it would be better for them to use an unpaired stall... I have to educate them on how to id the pairs, and then try to make sure that they realize I'm not being a dick, I'm trying to help them, and it really doesn't hurt me to be paired.

    I don't know if I achieve the last thing 100% of the time. But I am mindful of how I'm coming off when I do educate.
     
    • Like x 2
  16. Wooloomooloo

    Wooloomooloo Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2018
    Messages:
    814
    Location:
    Brooklyn, NY
    Great post.

    I'd just urge people to not be too smug or preachy when "explaining" how paired superchargers work because they don't all pair in the same way.

    Last week on a road trip, I went to a supercharger in NC I think, and Plugshare noted that the pairing was 1A to 2A and 3A to 4A, not 1A to 1B as you might expect. I parked appropriately and some middle-aged guy jumped out of his S and started mansplaining pairing to me as I plugged in without even checking whether he was getting reduced speed.

    I did point out the Plugshare comment, but he was far more interested in being righteous, than correct.

    Also, some SC's just seem to charge at a reduced rate. I've plugged in plenty of times to only get 36kw in a completely empty stall, only to find that moving get's me 137kw. I wish Tesla allowed reporting of this through the app, as calling them every time isn't always convenient.
     
    • Disagree x 1
  17. SSonnentag

    SSonnentag Rocket Scientist

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2017
    Messages:
    1,668
    Location:
    Arizona
    I've noticed that when a second car plugs in, the charging on the first car will sometimes reset to zero and then gradually ramp back up, but never will the first car get more than 75% of the charging capacity of the pair of chargers.
     
  18. SouthSeas

    SouthSeas Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2019
    Messages:
    201
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Are you sure about the pairing above? I think you might be confusing the actual pairing with the location of the stalls. Was this Rocky Mount, NC where I have charged multiple times? The stalls are not in the expected 1A, 1B, 2A, 2B order. I'm not sure they are in any order. That was a strange one. But I've never heard anyone else say the actual pairing of the stalls wasn't still xA with xB.


    Yeah, Tesla seems to have a lot of problems with their stalls. Reporting through the phone is a way to waste a half hour or more. A simple thing they could do is to implement a call back queue, but obviously if it isn't important enough to you to waste your hours on hold, it's not important to them at all. Oh, and the fact that they claim you don't need to report charger problems since they report themselves. lol I wish it were that simple.
     
  19. ewoodrick

    ewoodrick Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2018
    Messages:
    5,285
    Location:
    Buford, GA
    I think that what Plugshare was trying to tell you is that the chargers aren't lined up 1A 1B 2A 2B.... They were lined up 1A 2A 3A...1B 2B 3B..
    That's a common "different" configuration. Some people tend to assume that every other slot is safe.
     
    • Like x 1
  20. cypho

    cypho Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2018
    Messages:
    743
    Location:
    USA
    That might explain what I saw. Since there were plenty of other chargers I could move to I did not hang around to see if things were going to improve. If it happens again I will be a bit more patient and see if things improve before I jump ship.
     

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Formed in 2006, Tesla Motors Club (TMC) was the first independent online Tesla community. Today it remains the largest and most dynamic community of Tesla enthusiasts. Learn more.
  • Do you value your experience at TMC? Consider becoming a Supporting Member of Tesla Motors Club. As a thank you for your contribution, you'll get nearly no ads in the Community and Groups sections. Additional perks are available depending on the level of contribution. Please visit the Account Upgrades page for more details.


    SUPPORT TMC