Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Edmunds Model S Long-Term Test

This site may earn commission on affiliate links.
#63
By the way who ever wrote the previous Edmonds update said the car had become his favorite of the long-term fleet.

It still puzzels me how auto designors can get the complicated engine computers to work every time and still get the "reboot blues" from the rest. I really would like to know.
 
#64
Joyrider said:
By the way who ever wrote the previous Edmonds update said the car had become his favorite of the long-term fleet.

It still puzzels me how auto designors can get the complicated engine computers to work every time and still get the "reboot blues" from the rest. I really would like to know.
Click to expand...

Well, as a software developer who works on medical devices from the control systems up to the UI, I would say that there are different kinds of complicated. There is mathematical and algorithmic complexity of the kind found in car engine controls, flight controls, and medical device robotics. Then there is combinatorial and human interaction complexity of the kind found in user interfaces. Developing software for the two different regimes is quite distinct. The first kind can often be tested in an automated way from the ground up, nearly exhaustively (though not all the time). The second cannot, and the users can often come up with sequences and scenarios that would be difficult to anticipate or include in any sort of automated testing. Automated testing of the visual aspects of a UI is even more problematic. This is why your computer's hard drive, firmware, etc. generally perform flawlessly, while Office or certain high-level OS functions are often buggy and frustrating.

In my experience, in my products, we have very complicated image processing algorithms that have never once failed to work in a catastrophic or embarrasing way, 99% of our bugs end up being in the UI.

Just my $0.02 and why I am willing to cut them some slack. This stuff is hard and you don't want to thrash about releasing minor fix updates for stuff like this and possibly wreak more havoc. (E.g. 4.1).
 
#66
Stoneymonster said:
Well, as a software developer who works on medical devices from the control systems up to the UI, I would say that there are different kinds of complicated. There is mathematical and algorithmic complexity of the kind found in car engine controls, flight controls, and medical device robotics. Then there is combinatorial and human interaction complexity of the kind found in user interfaces. Developing software for the two different regimes is quite distinct. The first kind can often be tested in an automated way from the ground up, nearly exhaustively (though not all the time). The second cannot, and the users can often come up with sequences and scenarios that would be difficult to anticipate or include in any sort of automated testing. Automated testing of the visual aspects of a UI is even more problematic. This is why your computer's hard drive, firmware, etc. generally perform flawlessly, while Office or certain high-level OS functions are often buggy and frustrating.

In my experience, in my products, we have very complicated image processing algorithms that have never once failed to work in a catastrophic or embarrasing way, 99% of our bugs end up being in the UI.

Just my $0.02 and why I am willing to cut them some slack. This stuff is hard and you don't want to thrash about releasing minor fix updates for stuff like this and possibly wreak more havoc. (E.g. 4.1).
Click to expand...

Truer words have never been spoken. My company develops software for the Newpaper/Publishing industry and I'd agree that 99% of our bugs are in the UI. Unfortunately for me 99% of our software is the UI.. :)
 
#69
I suppose it would be preferable for panel fit to be a bit better. I have looked at mine and concluded that the fit will not improve with the current die sets. This is a bit surprising in the era of CAD sunk dies. It really isn't bad though. The fit-and-finish-fetish is somewhat an attribute of it being easily observed and quantifiable rather than meaningful.
 
#70
None of my chrome is misaligned 1 bit. And the panels fit better than newer Lexi that I have seen (haven't looked too close at new S class or A8) . I would consider an A8 or an S class to be in a different price range when you look at the Model S is a '$50,000' premium car before you pimp it out. An S class starts at $92k and the A8 starts at $72k.~ both Luxury cars - not premium. add on the S class and can get over $230K ! (and still be beat to 60mph by a Model S P)
 
#71
The chrome issue they talk about isn't really misalignment, but failure of the adhesive at one end causing it to pull away. The body panels issues they point out appear on every car I've seen and I've always taken to be the way it was designed. I.e. the vertical trunk panel overlap, the larger gap on the top of the trunk,the frunk lip overbite. If any of these things were fixed by moving the existing panels, gaps would open up elsewhere or panels wouldn't fit.

I haven't followed Edmund's long term tests before, are they this particular on every car?
 
#73
I think this kind of exposure will only improve the quality of cars down the road. Lets face it, while many have no body fit issues, some do, and it should be corrected. Edmunds bought a car like everyone else, and happened to get one with panel fit issues. If your car had that defect, you might find it unacceptable too.


Sent via Tapatalk
 
#74
spatterso911 said:
I think this kind of exposure will only improve the quality of cars down the road. Lets face it, while many have no body fit issues, some do, and it should be corrected. Edmunds bought a car like everyone else, and happened to get one with panel fit issues. If your car had that defect, you might find it unacceptable too.


Sent via Tapatalk
Click to expand...
In case this is directed at me, I'm all for fixing the issues for those that have it. What I should have included in that post was the fact that as Tesla builds more cars, the quality is improving. This was also true for the roadster, as some of the early cars had issues similar to these.
 
#75
spatterso911 said:
I think this kind of exposure will only improve the quality of cars down the road. Lets face it, while many have no body fit issues, some do, and it should be corrected. Edmunds bought a car like everyone else, and happened to get one with panel fit issues. If your car had that defect, you might find it unacceptable too.
Click to expand...

Ok, but how do you define what is an issue? The pictures on Edmunds post look like my car and every other car (and I've seen a lot, up close) that I've seen. It's the shape of the panels. Is Tesla going to replace body panels for everyone? I think not. The only issue my car has that I haven't seen commonly elsewhere (but have on these fora) is the little bending of the edge of the small panel near the side view mirrors.

Look at your car today and tell me your vertical trunk panel (the face where the license plate attaches) does not look exactly like the Edmunds photo. Is that a flaw or just the way they designed it?

I'm not arguing, by the way, I'm genuinely curious about these issues and don't even know if I should complain :)
 
#76
Stoneymonster said:
Ok, but how do you define what is an issue? The pictures on Edmunds post look like my car and every other car (and I've seen a lot, up close) that I've seen. It's the shape of the panels. Is Tesla going to replace body panels for everyone? I think not. The only issue my car has that I haven't seen commonly elsewhere (but have on these fora) is the little bending of the edge of the small panel near the side view mirrors.

Look at your car today and tell me your vertical trunk panel (the face where the license plate attaches) does not look exactly like the Edmunds photo. Is that a flaw or just the way they designed it?
Click to expand...

My trunk does not look like that at all. More specifically; I watched the launch event video (where the first owners got their cars at the plant) a while before I picked up my car. The trunk alignment issues are clearly visible on the cars in that video... You should check it for yourself. A month or so later I saw a green S outside of my eye doctors office... same exact alignment issue. At this point I was worried about this just being a general issue, and it was one of the first things I checked when I got my car. Fortunately the issue appears to have been corrected (vin 5448) and all alignments on my car are nearly perfect.

That said, this is a real issue on some cars, and I would hope they are able to fix it, and are doing so for those that request it.

On the trunk fit, look at this video:
http://vimeo.com/44558698 at 4:36 and 10:39 for pretty clear examples.
 
Last edited:
#78
DrComputer said:
It's also interesting to note that Edmunds seems to be publishing these "updates" completely out of order. At the bottom of each article the author notes the odometer reading on the car. Not sure they are doing this for some sort of dramatic reason or what.
Click to expand...

Different people get the car each day and probably don't finish/submit their entries in order. They post them as they are completed. That's why
the tone changes, some posts are flattering, some are deeply critical. It's a good way to do it actually because they get a wide range of opinions, but it is confusing to follow if you don't know that.

- - - Updated - - -

scriptacus said:
My trunk does not look like that at all. More specifically; I watched the launch event video (where the first owners got their cars at the plant) a while before I picked up my car.
Click to expand...

Interesting. Well in my case it's how the panel was stamped: adjusting the trunk to have the vertical surface flush with the bumper
would have the top of the trunk several mm's, maybe a full cm below the top of the side panels it meets. So maybe they improved
the forms after my car (3280). Not likely they will do anything to fix that after the fact.
 
#80
DrComputer said:
It's also interesting to note that Edmunds seems to be publishing these "updates" completely out of order. At the bottom of each article the author notes the odometer reading on the car. Not sure they are doing this for some sort of dramatic reason or what.
Click to expand...

Agreed. The Edmunds site is one of the most frustrating on the internet. I know they have several contributors, so the posts aren't always consistant, but they have no organization other than arbitrary categories like "interior" or "cargo space" with no information about entries made to those categories. I end up just clicking a post that looks new and then hitting the "previous article" link at the bottom a dozen times to go back to where I left off last time. Half the time I find out that the original link I clicked wasn't to the latest article after all, so I have to repeat the process after having read posts referring to something which hasn't occurred yet. :cursing:

tdiggity said:
Latest update seems dumb - Philosophical Range Anxiety - 2013 Tesla Model S Long-Term Road Test

Complains that he might not have enough range, drives 50-60 miles a day, and makes a big deal about how it wouldn't work for him (and the reader) because you can't drive spontaneously around town but isn't willing to even talk about installing at least 30amp service at home to cover his daily needs. weird.
Click to expand...

I don't really understand that guy. Charging at home and always leaving with a "full tank" is one of the great things about an EV, but he seems totally unwilling to work with it. And he can't drive around spontaneously all weekend without running out of charge but won't look for a charging station...talk about determined to be miserable.

I bet even if none of those things was an issue, he'd slash his own tires just to have something to complain about.

And since when does a Model S only go 150 miles on a full charge? Did Edmunds only get a 60KWh? I thought they had an 85?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

C
how much does the car of new model 3 highland long range feel like the current model S long range?
Replies
8
Views
2K
Model 3
Maki22
M
F
Deciding Between older Model S or Newer Model 3
Replies
10
Views
838
Model S
thefrog1394
T
N
Buying a used 2020 Tesla Model X Long Range Plus Sport Utility 4D
Replies
2
Views
262
Model X: Ordering, Production, Delivery
Genie
G
EVFan786
Rejecting my brand new model 3 Highland
Replies
62
Views
5K
Model 3
n2mb_racing
n2mb_racing
D
New ‘23 Model X, long term Tesla owner. Some questions…
Replies
29
Views
5K
Model X
cstromme
cstromme
Top
Back
Blog
New
Forum list
Marketplace
Menu