Garage fire suppression design. Oregon

[DEMitchel]

Looking for garage fire suppression advice -- feasibility, design, hardware selection. I am in southern Oregon.
Detail: Designing a new house and attached 24'X22' garage to shelter our model 3, later a cybertruck. Also planning on 3 powerwalls, when they become available. I am fire averse after evacuating from the Camp Fire in Paradise (!) CA in 2018, and two communities near me in Jackson County, Talent and Phoenix burned down in wildfires last September. Southern Oregon does not require interior fire suppression yet, but I will install it if it makes sense from a safety point of view.

 

[BGbreeder]

I think that it is great that you are thinking ahead on this one.

My recommendation-
Concrete: floors, walls, ceiling. Seriously.
Or at least a solid foundation to above roof concrete wall between the garage and the home with no penetrations.

By the time you have two EVs, and three powerwalls in the same space, you have a significant quantity of flammable and energetic materials stored in your garage. I would seriously consider windows/ doors strategically located to be blown out.
E.g. While they were asleep, their Teslas burned in the garage. It’s a risk many automakers are taking seriously.

I would observe that the house was a total loss, despite a timely warning of the fire, and prompt arrival of the fire department, not something that we all can rely on.

As you probably know, Tesla is currently recommending that the vehicle fires now be allowed to burn themselves out, which can take 24 hours.
“Battery fires can take up to 24 hours to extinguish,” Tesla’s website says in an emergency response guide for the Model S. “Consider allowing the battery to burn while protecting exposures.”

"protecting exposures" is going to mean serious firewalls for 24 hour plus protection, not just double layer plasterboard.

I would also point out that during the above referenced garage fire there was an explosion that blew off the doors, so you might want consider not having direct access from the garage into the house, nor having the garage attached to the house. I am unaware of any 24 hour fire rates doors.

All the best,

BG

 

[jhn_]

Don’t know about suppression, but definitely add a heat sensor in your garage wired into your house smoke alarm setup. So if something does go aflame in the garage while sleeping, or otherwise unaware in the house, you’ll be warned.

Thinking again about suppression, not sure there is anything on the market that could really help with a li-ion fire in thermal runaway seeing how fire departments need to pour water continuously on them for HOURS to cool them down, or let them burn out.

 

[Bitslizer]

Don’t know about suppression, but definitely add a heat sensor in your garage wired into your house smoke alarm setup. So if something does go aflame in the garage while sleeping, or otherwise unaware in the house, you’ll be warned.

Thinking again about suppression, not sure there is anything on the market that could really help with a li-ion fire in thermal runaway seeing how fire departments need to pour water continuously on them for HOURS to cool them down, or let them burn out.

I think any water sprinkler would be better than none at least to give you more time to safely exit or respond. Add a garden faucet in the garage in case you want to play fire fighter?

 

[Vines]

A standard fire sprinkler system is decent assistance in case of a battery fire, that at least the water will keep the flames to a somewhat manageable size. Once a battery fire has turned into a serious thermal runaway event, there's not much else to do except keep things cool.

However, I agree that the best fire suppression is a fireproof room with CMU or concrete wall construction. I think that a garage full of Tesla products is safer than a garage full of ICE cars, but regardless, accidents do happen.

 

[BGbreeder]

If you are thinking sprinklers will make a difference, why not have a look at

and decide whether you think a few sprinklers are going to help.
FWIW: NAHB recommends 0.05gpm/sq.ft. (Typical sprinkler is 10-20gpm) Fire nozzles are typically 60-200gpm, as used in the above video.

There are lots of relevant videos available, many of them referenced on TMC. Li-ion fires are hot, energetic, and difficult to control. (As demonstrated in the above video)

I am unfamiliar with another material where the manufacturer recommendation is to a) let it burn, and b) that it might take 24hours to burn out.

At the end of the day, it is ultimately, your nickel, and your life.

All the best,

BG

 

[Vines]

If you are thinking sprinklers will make a difference, why not have a look at

and decide whether you think a few sprinklers are going to help.
FWIW: NAHB recommends 0.05gpm/sq.ft. (Typical sprinkler is 10-20gpm) Fire nozzles are typically 60-200gpm, as used in the above video.

There are lots of relevant videos available, many of them referenced on TMC. Li-ion fires are hot, energetic, and difficult to control. (As demonstrated in the above video)

I am unfamiliar with another material where the manufacturer recommendation is to a) let it burn, and b) that it might take 24hours to burn out.

At the end of the day, it is ultimately, your nickel, and your life.

All the best,

BG

I agree that the sprinklers alone won't do much to the car or powerwall itself, but they will help to slow down any combustibles which also may be in the garage.

Good to know that the fire departments are aware that EV's are 10 times less likely to burn than an ICE.

 

[Brando]

IF saving buildings is your strategy, SEPARATE Garage and House. PowerWalls ever known to catch fire similar to vehicles ??
IF SO then keep all Lithium battery systems in Garage [PowerWalls outside is optional in some climate - you'll have to research avoiding freezing & too much heat] [ LiFePO4 a consideration - can they catch fire ??] Talk with the local fire department - they MIGHT be helpful. good luck doing research - cutting edge considerations People didn't expect their Chevy Bolt to burn down their house - Even Boeing 787 had Lithium fires.

Which EV brand safest?? I suspect Tesla and suspect LiFePO4 (which Tesla maybe offering by next year.

 

[MY1stEV]

Elide Fire Extinguishing Balls... hang a few of these around the garage.

Youtube demo video

Company web site

PASSIVE USE - EFB is mounted in areas of concern where a possible fire can occur

Examples: Switchboard and circuit control system, electric appliance areas, electrical outlet, deteriorated or damaged electrical wire areas, battery power bank, lithium-ion battery charger, engine room, kitchen, boiler room, washer/dryer

 

[CrazyRabbit]

100 lbs of dynamite under the car should do the trick with a sky light above the car! or perhaps just build it out of straw (3 pigs), because if the batteries catch fire everything is lost.
but OP seemed worried about forest fires, so i would build out of steel. steel buildings are low cost.