Gen III Range & Pricing Speculation

[JRP3]

The other thing to consider is that a large luxury sedan has different expectations than a smaller sport sedan. Do people really expect the larger, heavier, smoother riding luxury sedan to always outperform the smaller sport sedan, be it EV or ICE?

 

[vfx]

It's cool.

I'm just thinking big!

 

[ryanjm]

@ryanjm - Nah, you didn't.

My point was that your assertion that they won't make BlueStar outperform Model S is akin to saying they wouldn't make Model S outperform Roadster. Tesla has already shown that they have no such inhibition.

More generally, Tesla seems to be more concerned with making the best EVs they can (regardless of potential model cross-cannibalization).

More specifically, Elon's personal mission (as I understand it) is for all manufacturers to make the best EVs they can -- regardless of potential impact on the long-term viability of Tesla the company relative to its competition.

Great points all around Brian. I suppose -- since I'm targeting BlueStar for my first Tesla purchase -- that I just find it hard to wrap my head around the idea that I might be able to afford a Tesla that meets or beats the Model S, which is out of my financial grasp. Damn I love this company! In fact, I'm about to buy a bit of stock after I post this, in the hopes that it will help grow a bit into part of my down payment on BlueStar. :biggrin:

 

[dsm363]

I can see the performance Gen III car outperforming the current 85 kWh pack but probably not the performance model S. They'd likely want to keep that faster than the cheaper Model.

 

[jerry33]

Given that it's three to four years down the road, I can see it out-performing the current cars. That's not to say that it will out-perform the 2015-2016 version of the Model S--unless no changes are made to the Model S.

 

[raymond]

... that I might be able to afford a Tesla that meets or beats the Model S

It will be smaller, somewhat less comfortable (shorter wheel-base), perhaps have a smaller touch-screen, etc. so at least some would say it will be a lesser vehicle.

I personally find the S to be waaay to big and prefer the handling (and acceleration) of a lighter and smaller car. So if you're like me, the BlueStar will beat the S. But not everybody might agree!

A €45.000 VW Golf 2.0 R significantly outperforms the €125.000 VW flagship Phaeton (Dutch models and prices), but I don't think this has upset many Phaeton owners.

 

[PhatCat]

... A €45.000 VW Golf 2.0 R significantly outperforms the €125.000 VW flagship Phaeton (Dutch models and prices), but I don't think this has upset many Phaeton owners.

Not that there are that many to upset. :tongue: As a former (very satisfied) Phaeton owner, I'm allowed to say that.

 

[gjunky]

Elon mentioned that the GenIII (Model M :biggrin would most likely be 20-25% lighter than the Model S. Hopefully this won't affect the size of the batteries and range too much

 

[Grendal]

It makes sense when the car will likely be 15%-20% smaller than the Model S. The battery pack will have to be smaller also. The improved battery chemistry should keep the overall numbers similar to the S, I'm guessing.

 

[vfx]

Musk said that if margins improve, Tesla would begin making "a couple of 100,000 units" of its 3rd generation car with a $30,000 sticker price and 20%-25% lighter than the Model S.​

http://energy.aol.com/2012/08/13/bi...ergy-while-musk-admits-to-to/?icid=apb2#page2

 

[bint2k]

hopefully it still stays in sedan form and not a hatchback type prius-mo-bile

 

[Grendal]

"It would be quite similar to the Model S but scaled down. Probably about the size of a BMW 3-series or an Audi A4."

A quote from Elon's most recent interview. It sounds good to me. I love the Model S styling.

 

[Kevin Harney]

"It would be quite similar to the Model S but scaled down. Probably about the size of a BMW 3-series or an Audi A4."

A quote from Elon's most recent interview. It sounds good to me. I love the Model S styling.

That sounds perfect to me !!

 

[vfx]

"It would be quite similar to the Model S but scaled down. ...

I imagine the back seat would only be usable for seating oompaloompas.

 

[brianman]

I imagine the back seat would only be usable for seating oompaloompas.

They really should include the oompaloompas in the base price. It's not like anybody won't opt for that package above the base model.

 

[Grendal]

I imagine the back seat would only be usable for seating oompaloompas.

Or dogs. Which is what I have.

 

[jkirkebo]

hopefully it still stays in sedan form and not a hatchback type prius-mo-bile

I do not agree. Small sedans are very impractical cars. The Model S is a hatchback (thank god), but because it is so large it can be made to look somewhat like sedan. Not so easy with a smaller car, unless you REALLY want to sacrifice rear headroom.

 

[vfx]

I do not agree. Small sedans are very impractical cars. The Model S is a hatchback (thank god), but because it is so large it can be made to look somewhat like sedan. Not so easy with a smaller car, unless you REALLY want to sacrifice rear headroom.

Agreed. Tesla has rewritten what a "hatchback" is.


(and yes others did it first but Tesla has more room (and a frunk))

 

[art]

lexus gs 350 wheelbase 112" weight 3,795, cadillac xts wheelbase 111" weight 4,006, bmw 550i wheelbase 116" weight 4,365, mercedes benz e 350 4 matic wheelbase 113" weight 4,145, tesl model s wheelbase 116" weight 4,647 tesla gen 3 wheelbase 110" ?, weight 3,400 ? range 300 ?, cadillac ats wheelbase 109", weight 3,400, lexus is 250 wheelbase 107" weight 3,455, bmw 328i wheelbase 110" weight 3,406 mercedes benz c 250 wheelbase 108" 3,428lbs. just a guess. have fun.

 

[DuncanWatson]

I do not agree. Small sedans are very impractical cars. The Model S is a hatchback (thank god), but because it is so large it can be made to look somewhat like sedan. Not so easy with a smaller car, unless you REALLY want to sacrifice rear headroom.

I agree with you and vfx. A hatchback is much superior in function which is what a $30k target car is. The coupe market is smaller and not mass-market.

I think we will see a $37k base price bluestar with 200 marketing range, 150 EPA range and options to bring it to 300 mile marketing range. And I will order one the moment I can. I also think that if the base bluestar can access the supercharger network for a onetime software charge similar to the 60kw Model S then it will be a giant success. Assuming the 2 year supercharger projections are accurate.

A bluestar like that would be my family's everything car. Daily driver, day trips, and vacations would all fit in the use case easily.