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Cintoman
Member
I think the M3 prototype shown at the reveal looks amazing. Phenomenal job Tesla, and I wasn't expecting anything less than greatness. However, I did have a little concern with the front snubbed snout. Liking it even more, but kind of wish it was a little smoother. I'm not a big fan of the newer ICE cars that have these big gaping grilles and nothing for a bumper (think Audi, Lexus). With that said, I really really like Mihai75's modification in post #20. I think the continuation of the line underneath the headlights straight thru looks awesome.
Regarding the modified S....I think it looks amazing. But somehow it reminds me a little bit of the Dodge Intrepid.
Finally..regarding having to mount a license plate on the front end. I absolutely hate the idea of having to mount one on the front of cars. I think it totally ruins the front of these newer cars. My state (RI) is a 2-plate state, so I'm required by law to have one mounted. Luckily, when I bought my car from a dealership in California (which I believe is a 2-plate state also), when they delivered it to me in RI, surprisingly, they had never mounted the bracket onto the front bumper cover. The car came with the bracket in the truck, unopened, as well as the 2nd CA plate. So I've never mounted it. There was no way I"m going to be drilling 4-6 holes in my front bumper. Only issue I have is with our 2-year safety and emissions inspection, which requires the front plate to be "securely and permanently mounted". So no leaving it on top of your dash or using duct tape/velcro to fasten it to your bumper.
To get past this, I built my own license plate bracket. My car (2005 Mercedes C230 Kompressor Sport Sedan) has a small square pop-out cover for the tow hook to mount. So I mount my homemade bracket and screw into the same spot where the tow hook would get attached. It's mounted very securely (drove with it once from RI to FL). So I'll do this prior to inspection, drive it down, get it inspected, come home, remove the bracket, and I'm good for another 2 years. So far, in the 10 years I've had the car, I've never gotten pulled over.
So Mr. Musk...no matter what design you finalize for the front end of the Model 3, I'm sure it will look stunningly beautiful. And there is no way I'll be ruining it with a 12" x 6" piece of metal.
--Cintoman
Regarding the modified S....I think it looks amazing. But somehow it reminds me a little bit of the Dodge Intrepid.
Finally..regarding having to mount a license plate on the front end. I absolutely hate the idea of having to mount one on the front of cars. I think it totally ruins the front of these newer cars. My state (RI) is a 2-plate state, so I'm required by law to have one mounted. Luckily, when I bought my car from a dealership in California (which I believe is a 2-plate state also), when they delivered it to me in RI, surprisingly, they had never mounted the bracket onto the front bumper cover. The car came with the bracket in the truck, unopened, as well as the 2nd CA plate. So I've never mounted it. There was no way I"m going to be drilling 4-6 holes in my front bumper. Only issue I have is with our 2-year safety and emissions inspection, which requires the front plate to be "securely and permanently mounted". So no leaving it on top of your dash or using duct tape/velcro to fasten it to your bumper.
To get past this, I built my own license plate bracket. My car (2005 Mercedes C230 Kompressor Sport Sedan) has a small square pop-out cover for the tow hook to mount. So I mount my homemade bracket and screw into the same spot where the tow hook would get attached. It's mounted very securely (drove with it once from RI to FL). So I'll do this prior to inspection, drive it down, get it inspected, come home, remove the bracket, and I'm good for another 2 years. So far, in the 10 years I've had the car, I've never gotten pulled over.
So Mr. Musk...no matter what design you finalize for the front end of the Model 3, I'm sure it will look stunningly beautiful. And there is no way I'll be ruining it with a 12" x 6" piece of metal.
--Cintoman
James Anders
Member
The Model 3 has a grille opening at the very bottom of the front. There needs to be some air flow there. Obviously, not as much as needed for a front-engined ICE car. And even with ICE cars much the air flow is from the bottom.
I can't imagine that front blunt section can do anything but hurt the Cd.
Sure the Model 3 doesn't need excessive drag force pushing it down but it also doesn't need useless frontal drag. This isn't anything new. We've seen similar discussions revolving around alternatives to the Cd killing rear view external mirrors.
If I get the time I will try to create a 3D model of the M3 from the photos - and then do some flow simulation studies of blunt nose versus more pointed nose. It would be a very rough estimate but I think it would show the difference.
https://www.linkedin.com/in/jim-anders-6705a013
I can't imagine that front blunt section can do anything but hurt the Cd.
Sure the Model 3 doesn't need excessive drag force pushing it down but it also doesn't need useless frontal drag. This isn't anything new. We've seen similar discussions revolving around alternatives to the Cd killing rear view external mirrors.
If I get the time I will try to create a 3D model of the M3 from the photos - and then do some flow simulation studies of blunt nose versus more pointed nose. It would be a very rough estimate but I think it would show the difference.
https://www.linkedin.com/in/jim-anders-6705a013
I like both posts by S3XY and Mihai but I think Tesla will go with something similar to the Model X presented by S3XY. The nose of a car is an important part of branding a manufacturer. BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Etc. all have created strong brand identity and every model has a theme that is present in the nose of every car. I think Tesla is searching for that Nose identity that will brand their cars. The Model S nose was put in place because consumers still needed their grill when the S was first released, but I think the Model X nose was their first attempt to create a nose piece that could be used throughout all their models. I think both the Model 3 and Model S move in that direction and it would look great on the 3.
I might be dead wrong, but I find it hard to believe that Tesla would stick with a blank nose simply from a branding stand point.
I might be dead wrong, but I find it hard to believe that Tesla would stick with a blank nose simply from a branding stand point.
James Anders
Member
I find it hard to believe that styling would trump "form follows function" in the mind of Elon Musk. Now, I'm not saying he would purposely make something goofy for some modest gain, but my guess he's one to optimize as many parameters as possible, including beauty.
Haha, Hawaii is a 2 plate state as well. I just mount mine with double stick tape for the inspection and then remove it after.
Drag is weirder than you think it is. That section is almost certainly good for the Cd.
-- Remember that the ideal shape for Cd looks roughly like a teardrop, or the Aptera.
-- Now, remember that there *will* be a flat, rectangular license plate at the front of the car, in the middle.
-- Then remember that the extended hood is being used for crash safety, so the hood has to be more horizontal than the windshield, so there's going to be an unpleasant obstruction in the airflow where the windshield wipers are
-- so you probably want to send the air to the sides of the car, not up...
As for the scofflaws who feel that license plate laws don't apply to them... well, if I encountered your car, I'd report you to the police. If I had a license plate number to report! It's amazing how some people think. If you don't want a license plate, keep your car off the public road and leave it at the track.
I do not think that a Model X nose addition would sacrifice much function.
If Tesla leaves that nose blank, it is an invitation for many owners to add their own faux grille or whatever they think looks good. Remember that neighbor that painted their house pink? I think it is important that Tesla take control of their image and not leave it to the random tastes of the masses.
I want NO GRILLE. This ain't no stinkin' ICE car. Don't waste a penny on useless ornamental garbage that just creates drag.
This is a really good point. I also think Tesla purposefully went extra bold to see how people would react to such a design. They knew their car was going to be a seller, so they wanted to see how much they could get away with and gauge audience perception on a design that was likely as far as they'd go into weirdmobile territory.
It may change, but I'm not thinking by much.
There it is. Nailed it. Was trying to put it into words!
If you do end up tackling the 3D model, be sure to post it here. I would be very interested in trying my hand at my ideal front end, as well as playing around with slapping license plates on there. My issue now with the plate photoshops floating around is the perspective and lighting is off, even if only a little bit and it's hard to truly picture how it looks from all angles.
voyager
Active Member
Alright sirs, I believe this is what you're looking for, first one is James version, and bottom one with voyagers suggestion to also make a slight crease between the light slits:
This is EXACTLY what they need to do...at the very least. The current style looks like they gave up, or like a kit car that someone decided to not install a front grill for - and instead of cutting out the front, they just left it. With all of the other really great styling they couldn't get to an agreement in something like these pics?? Too bad.
Yes, I think you are right, testing boundaries being another reason for this prank. I say prank, as I think it's very possible that not only did Elon never intend the homicidal robo-alien front end design to actually be produced for all the reasons we've discussed, but that he also did not pick "April Fool's Day" for the reveal by accident to play a little joke on the whole world. Remember, he mentioned it being April Fool's day somewhere in the world right before showing the car. What's more, Tesla showing the bland de-contented control system rather than the "spaceship" one Elon is obviously excited about would be consistent with employing some deception to try to temper Model 3 cannibalization of S and X near term.
arjay
member
I vote for no "make believe grille", so let's move on to solving the sculpture. The front end has always been an important aspect of an automobile's design statement and It is important to get it right. The as presented nose is certainly lacking in flair, especially compared with the rest of the design. Recent renders showing an integrated continuous line will be the answer if the line will reads gracefully at all angles of view. I think all that is needed is "tweaking" not major surgery. Although I don't know what that lump is hiding under there.
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