I think it is to get back at people that are installing solar and are reducing their bills dramatically. The more income you have the more likely you are to have a big home and be able to afford solar and batteries. That means these previous big bill payers are now little bill payers.
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Has anyone cut ties with your utility in California?
- Thread starter whydontwe
- Start date
Someone posted this earlier:
It's legal in San Diego County, if your system meets all of these requirements:
I think you must have another energy source outside of solar/batteries. For me, it'll probably be a generator (probably as big as possible to run shorter windows during cloudy days and diesel so I can make gas runs + propane for massive tank I see at Tahoe cabins) and EV2H car later for big bigger battery backup.
It's technically possible, but legally unknown unless someone tries and gets it done, but will be a hassle since generators are not as care free as solar panels. You also will get yelled at from the partner if things in your setup stops working for whatever reason (and you can't blame the IOU now so that's a reverse risk to stick it to them).
It's legal in San Diego County, if your system meets all of these requirements:
- California Building Code, Title 24, Part 2
- California Residential Code, Title 24, Part 2.5 (One- and Two-family dwellings)
- California Electrical Code, Title 24, Part 3
- California Mechanical Code, Title 24, Part 4
- California Plumbing Code, Title 24, Part 5
- California Energy Code, Title 24, Part 6
- California Fire Code, Title 24, Part 9
I think you must have another energy source outside of solar/batteries. For me, it'll probably be a generator (probably as big as possible to run shorter windows during cloudy days and diesel so I can make gas runs + propane for massive tank I see at Tahoe cabins) and EV2H car later for big bigger battery backup.
It's technically possible, but legally unknown unless someone tries and gets it done, but will be a hassle since generators are not as care free as solar panels. You also will get yelled at from the partner if things in your setup stops working for whatever reason (and you can't blame the IOU now so that's a reverse risk to stick it to them).
I wish we could charge ours from the grid. Unfortunately, we can only do that when Storm Watch is active.
There are different rules for IOUs vs Munis, so a blanket question like this causes more confusion than clarity. But to my knowledge, it is pretty difficult to completely disconnect from either. Also, if you do want to disconnect and are able to, check the reconnect fees before deciding, unless you never plan on selling your house.
If you mean without solar, sure some people do that, but when you do the math for what it will cost you to get "several powerwalls" you will find that pretty much no amount of doing that will come close to paying for what you spent to install the powerwalls in any amount of reasonable time (with reasonable time meaning the warranty term, or 10 ish years).
The regulations say that you have to be connected to "A grid" . It does not say that you have to be connected to the local utility. I see no reason that if you have a reliable Microgrid of your own design that you would not be able to disconnect. I had all the regulations copied and ready to make the argument. That said, it is difficult to disconnect from the local utility with 3 EV's attempting to charge at night.
Just quit paying them....... What are they going to do? Disconnect you???
In some areas, Tesla is coordinating their many customers into their own grid. Will sell back up battery power back into the Utility grid when their power is needed to avoid brownouts. Electricity is very expensive during these peak times, so often it provides a tidy profit to those using battery backups. Members will actually get a check from their utility.
Possibly send you to collections for non payment? Anyone who has enough money to buy all this stuff is also likely to care about their credit scores, etc.
RKCRLR
Active Member
If you have Powerwalls and solar it is the Virtual Power Plant in the application.
You can do OK on it. We got around $250 for 3-4 ISO events last fall. There are currently about 5,200 homes on it here in PG&E territory.
One item relevant to most suburban residents, and some rural residents is that if you are in a clean air district, there may be restrictions on your generator, e.g. how long you can run it, when you can run it, what the peak and annual emissions are, and even whether you are allowed to run it if it isn't an "emergency". For most of us California "coastal" and "inland valley" residents, I don't think it is on the table, from an emissions perspective, e.g. see CARB's regulations.
Now if you can do it with a combination of solar / geothermal / self hydro / wind, go for it.
All the best,
BG
Good point, I'm guessing that's a no in general to use a gen for most places unless there is an actual grid outage. Here's some blurb from Air resource board:
Until some folks leave the grid and it's more widespread (there are like 0? examples/cases for urban/suburban areas), going off grid is probably not possible at this time.
Yes, that's the bit of the regulations that I was thinking of.
I have installed a couple of backup generators in my time, and just the regularly scheduled testing runs can be problematic in some locales, which lead to oil/fuel heaters to keep things dry (added energy loads), reduced speeds during routine tests to reduce NOX and particulate emissions.
I think even if your own generator for off grid use were legal in a particular locale, I would not bet on it remaining legal...
All the best,
BG
I have installed a couple of backup generators in my time, and just the regularly scheduled testing runs can be problematic in some locales, which lead to oil/fuel heaters to keep things dry (added energy loads), reduced speeds during routine tests to reduce NOX and particulate emissions.
I think even if your own generator for off grid use were legal in a particular locale, I would not bet on it remaining legal...
All the best,
BG
Where is the specific CARB rule against that? Lots of people run generators for camping and RV's.
See above; in the small off road engines section, and notice that CARB's leniency expired in 2019. In general, I encourage you to read the documentation on CARB's site pertaining to generator and generator usage.
CARB'S rules get down into the nitty gritty of who, what, when where, and how. If you aren't in an air district, it isn't an issue, if you are, you need to ensure that none of the rules impinge on the details of your proposed activities.
All the best,
BG
That's for EPA only generators. CARB certified generators sales are not prohibited.
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