How important are regen settings in snow and ice ?

[rotarypower101]

Read the regen settings, specifically OFF has been removed in 21’ ? Is this accurate?
How do regen settings work now compared to how it used to work, before and after 21'?


How does the current regen setting do when in very slick scenarios with Sumer tires? Decent winter tires?
Does AWD VS RWD matter in regards to how regen specifically reacts on slick surfaces?


People who do a Lot of driving in snow and ice, Is this factor possibly overstated in the threads I have read that it can create issues VS being able to completely turn regen off in that scenario?

Are there ways to turn regen off on 21+ cars if it is still currently an issue at all?

Has anyone seen a good thread I can read to understand the regen factor on snow and ice, what if any issues there are, and any solutions to help with it?

 

[stopcrazypp]

Read the regen settings, specifically OFF has been removed in 21’ ? Is this accurate?
How do regen settings work now compared to how it used to work, before and after 21'?

There was never an "off" option. There was a "low" option that they removed around the 2021 model year:
Tesla mysteriously removes regenerative braking strength option in new cars

How does the current regen setting do when in very slick scenarios with Sumer tires? Decent winter tires?
Does AWD VS RWD matter in regards to how regen specifically reacts on slick surfaces?


People who do a Lot of driving in snow and ice, Is this factor possibly overstated in the threads I have read that it can create issues VS being able to completely turn regen off in that scenario?

Are there ways to turn regen off on 21+ cars if it is still currently an issue at all?

Has anyone seen a good thread I can read to understand the regen factor on snow and ice, what if any issues there are, and any solutions to help with it?

I don't have experience with it on snow or ice, but it seems fine in heavy rain. But it's not hard to simulate a car without regen: just don't let off the accelerator completely! That takes a bit to learn, but it's not hard to.

Things that may disable regen is a fully charge battery or if it is cold:
Model 3 Owner's Manual | Tesla

Other than that, the only way I'm aware of are third party buttons (note the functionality may fail with future updates):
S3XY buttons at Abstract Ocean

 

[SlimJim]

Doesnt it automatically reduce it below freezing?

 

[stopcrazypp]

Doesnt it automatically reduce it below freezing?

It reduces or disables it due to battery temperature, but not directly on outside temperature. I'm not aware of reports of regen not activating even when battery is warm (and SOC low enough), but outside temp is below freezing.

 

[jjrandorin]

Are there ways to turn regen off on 21+ cars if it is still currently an issue at all?

Not officially, no. The only thing you could do is buy those third party S3XY buttons, and I think they might offer that as an option. Note, however, that tesla changes stuff all the time so third party stuff like that sometimes changes operation from some tesla update or other.

There are already a few different threads on very similar topics, like this one:

Model 3 in Snow/Ice

We recently had ~6" of snow here in South Carolina which is a very unusual event. This got me thinking about my M3 LR and how it performs in the snow. I am postulating that my M3 LR is probably a lot "safer" than a regular ICE sedan in snow bc it is AWD and perhaps more importantly, you do not...

teslamotorsclub.com

 

[rotarypower101]

Not officially, no. The only thing you could do is buy those third party S3XY buttons, and I think they might offer that as an option. Note, however, that tesla changes stuff all the time so third party stuff like that sometimes changes operation from some tesla update or other.

There are already a few different threads on very similar topics, like this one:

Model 3 in Snow/Ice

We recently had ~6" of snow here in South Carolina which is a very unusual event. This got me thinking about my M3 LR and how it performs in the snow. I am postulating that my M3 LR is probably a lot "safer" than a regular ICE sedan in snow bc it is AWD and perhaps more importantly, you do not...

teslamotorsclub.com

With "Track Mode" on the performance models, is this still valid the user can modulate the regen percentage manually through non 3rd party means as well as control the F/R bias? Those sound like features that would be beneficial in very slick environments?

And importantly is this equivalent to the older regen settings that were avalible for people that have experience with these settings?

 

[MJB-CO]

How does the current regen setting do when in very slick scenarios with Sumer tires? Decent winter tires?
Does AWD VS RWD matter in regards to how regen specifically reacts on slick surfaces?

To quote an old Audi thread response where an owner complained about AWD when driving in winter with Summer tires, "Summer tires in cold weather have as much traction as a bowling ball on ice".
This is my 5th winter season with my 2018 DM 3. I always drive with the regen setting on (option available in 2018) with Michelin X-Ice snow tires. Excellent traction in all cold weather conditions.

 

[rotarypower101]

To quote an old Audi thread response where an owner complained about AWD when driving in winter with Summer tires, "Summer tires in cold weather have as much traction as a bowling ball on ice".
This is my 5th winter season with my 2018 DM 3. I always drive with the regen setting on (option available in 2018) with Michelin X-Ice snow tires. Excellent traction in all cold weather conditions.

Completely agree, big proponent of Real winter specific tires, however I am Very curious as to how the system reacts to slipping due to regen, and on Good winter tires there is far less of that with much less effort, so I think that is a good bench mark to request when asking about the regen in slick environments.

With a standard tire in those slick conditions, I think the locking of the tires as it finds its regen threshold is far more likely?

So much so there are discussions still about whether the regen is causing instability? Yet Tesla have taken away preexisting tools to cope with that manually if I understand correctly?

I am sure at some point the software will be refined and mature enough to cope with nearly anything, but until it is, IMO it seems like a poor way forward from a users perspective to just deal with problems until it is highly refined. From reading my takeaway is this detail is not on the high priority list, and doesn’t get quite enough attention to make it feel and act seemless, yet significantly reducing regen essentially fixes the problem when needed under those conditions.

I do a lot of difficult winter driving, so would really like to learn about and understand those details better, and if being able to modulate that functionality is actually helpful in that environment , or possibly overstated how unrefined regen is in those conditions?

 

[android04]

Completely agree, big proponent of Real winter specific tires, however I am Very curious as to how the system reacts to slipping due to regen, and on Good winter tires there is far less of that with much less effort, so I think that is a good bench mark to request when asking about the regen in slick environments.

With a standard tire in those slick conditions, I think the locking of the tires as it finds its regen threshold is far more likely?

So much so there are discussions still about whether the regen is causing instability? Yet Tesla have taken away preexisting tools to cope with that manually if I understand correctly?

I am sure at some point the software will be refined and mature enough to cope with nearly anything, but until it is, IMO it seems like a poor way forward from a users perspective to just deal with problems until it is highly refined. From reading my takeaway is this detail is not on the high priority list, and doesn’t get quite enough attention to make it feel and act seemless, yet significantly reducing regen essentially fixes the problem when needed under those conditions.

I do a lot of difficult winter driving, so would really like to learn about and understand those details better, and if being able to modulate that functionality is actually helpful in that environment , or possibly overstated how unrefined regen is in those conditions?

I've driven through 4 winters (currently on my 5th) with a RWD Model 3 and have had no issues with traction. I use winter tires. The only complaint I have is that you are driving through deep snow with the RWD, the car traction control is constantly braking one of the two wheels to keep the car stable and straight, which reduces your speed.

With the dual motor cars, Tesla biases them so they are mostly RWD and the front motor only kicks in if it detects slip (or if you floor the accelerator). The software did not always work perfectly, from what I hear, but seems to be better now. I'd say that you shouldn't worry.

 

[rpiotro]

My only experience with it was last winter when I had an opportunity to drive it on a lightly snow covered and slippery road. It sent me spinning out of control and I crashed and burned and died a horrible death!

Seriously. The stability control works just fine. Don't worry about it. What did you think would happen?

 

[Shelburne]

In December of 2020, I drove my then 2 month old M3AWD in the snow for the first time. There were about 10 inches of fresh snow on the roads. I live in a very rural area so it was easy to find unplowed roads, tracked and untracked. Early on, I took my foot off the accelerator as I was going around a bend and I could feel the car begin to slip sideways a bit. I stopped was soon as I could and switched regeneration from normal to low. From then on the car handled much better on the snowy roads.

 

[heavyD]

My performance is riding on Pilot Alpin PA4 on the Uberturbines and I have got around fine in some pretty slick and snowy conditions the past few weeks. You do have to be a little careful with regen on slippery roads because if you are abrupt letting off the throttle, the rear end can come out a bit which is a product of these vehicles being primarily RWD as the Tesla AWD system is extremely slow when it comes to engaging the front wheels after rear slippage. It's more like driving a RWD vehicle with front wheel assist than a true mechanically coupled AWD vehicle.

 

[Braumin]

this is much less of an issue now than it used to be. Last winter Tesla added "snow mode" to the AWD cars. If it detects the ground is ice covered (which it would detect by the wheels slipping) it will put the car into full AWD for a few minutes so the front motor will be used immediately for traction, and both the front and rear motors are used for braking, rather than just the rear which is the default in good conditions.

As long as you have AWD it's basically fixed now. I have had zero issues on ice since this was added last winter. I have a 2021 M3P with snow tires. We get a lot of snow and ice here. Previous to this change the car was downright scary sometimes under braking on icy roads but now it's good.

I have no experience with RWD cars only so I can't comment on how those would be. I imagine they still suck since the rear axle would be loaded a lot. Tesla did add in an automatic hydraluic braking option for when regen is limited. I am not sure if that would kick in under ice or not though or if it's just battery temp related.

 

[GtiMart]

I have the option on my 2020 model 3 and I leave it at normal. Now I do have an AWD so that helps, and I drive with snow tires. Regen is lower/inexistant when the battery is very cold otherwise works like normal. When the car detects slipping in regen, it will reduce the regen level automatically and try to bring it up as it can. It tries to ride the limits of traction. Some people swear by low regen because they don't like the initial slip at the back. There's no other way to find the limits of traction, you need to go over the limit. The traction and stability controls will make sure that you don't lose control, you just need to get used to the back sliding an inch sideways from time to time.

 

[heavyD]

this is much less of an issue now than it used to be. Last winter Tesla added "snow mode" to the AWD cars. If it detects the ground is ice covered (which it would detect by the wheels slipping) it will put the car into full AWD for a few minutes so the front motor will be used immediately for traction, and both the front and rear motors are used for braking, rather than just the rear which is the default in good conditions.

As long as you have AWD it's basically fixed now. I have had zero issues on ice since this was added last winter. I have a 2021 M3P with snow tires. We get a lot of snow and ice here. Previous to this change the car was downright scary sometimes under braking on icy roads but now it's good.

I have no experience with RWD cars only so I can't comment on how those would be. I imagine they still suck since the rear axle would be loaded a lot. Tesla did add in an automatic hydraluic braking option for when regen is limited. I am not sure if that would kick in under ice or not though or if it's just battery temp related.

I don't get this at all on my car. My rear wheels always have to break traction before the front kick in. It's repeatable every time I have to start from a stop on a snow covered road. My rear wheels always slip out a bit when regen braking kicks in on slippery roads. If this full time AWD is a thing, it's not a thing on my car. I have driven Mustangs, MR2, M2's in Canadian winters and I know what a RWD car drives like in snow/ice. This car drives like a RWD car in those conditions. It's better because the front provide assistance when you lose traction but it's overall behavior is more RWD than a true mechanically coupled AWD vehicle. I just want to be clear that I'm having no issues with this at all and it actually adds a degree of fun, but I also have a lot of experience with RWD in the winter.

 

[Chisale]

I've been through 3 Ohio winters in my M3 AWD and though we don't have to bad here, there's about 8-10x a year where we're out in what I would call "bad conditions". I've always just left the Regen in Normal mode and I've found it to be fine that way. Just feather off the accelerator like you would if attempting to come to a stop slowly. I just use All Season tires on account of our fairly moderate winters and those are fine too. AWD Teslas are great in slippery conditions. I mean, nobody is going to mistake it for a Subaru (which we also own and are phenomenal) but they are still more than adequate.

 

[GtiMart]

The car will always try to be RWD for efficiency. When the rear starts slipping, the front will be used more, both for regen and acceleration, for a while. The car will go back to RWD after a little while, unless it starts slipping again.

You should often feel the back slide a little bit. In fact, you should also feel the front slipping a bit. The car needs to break the limits of traction to find those limits. It also needs to constantly try to raise power as road conditions are not constant.

 

[mtmra70]

As the owner of manual transmission vehicles running snow tires, I prefer heavy regen in the winter. Operates just like a manual transmission, which means more manipulation of the vehicle in the snow.

 

[pnwadventures]

TL;DR I drive a *ton* in snow/ice with Hakkapeliitta snow tires and full regen is the shiz.

 

[DrGriz]

As others have said, regen kicks in on the rear wheels as you lift off the accelerator and on snow or ice this can cause an uncomfortable kick out of the rear until stability control engages. The simplest thing to do is to feather the accelerator and not lift off completely, and that generally minimizes that feeling.

Alternatively, if you are driving slick conditions with an AWD Tesla, you can enable off road mode, which applies both regen braking and drive 50/50 to the front and rear wheels, at the price of turning off traction control. You avoid the kick out. You still want to feather the accelerator, but we drive a lot on snowpack and "polished" snowpack and we have found we like the lack of kick out a lot.

Also, since the recent availability of blending regen with mechanical brakes we have found that braking behavior is much more predictable, and this has also improved the driving experience on snow. Before that, regen was a variable and somewhat unpredictable experience depending on SOC and battery temperature.