How much did your HPWC installation cost?

[username123]

I am being quoted prices between $830-960CAD+tax for what I think is a relatively simple installation. I only need 20'-25' of cables, the electrical panel is in the back of the garage and I want to place the wall connector at the front of the garage on the exterior wall.

Also, am I being charged a Tesla tax? When I asked one of the electricians for a quote, he told me it would be $660 (30A breaker, 6 gauge cable). I told him I needed 60A for a Tesla and now he quoted me $830 which is $170 more. At home depot the 60A breaker is only $20 more and the difference between 4AWG and 6AWG cables is around $2-3 per meter so the extra materials should only be $40.

 

[Sophias_dad]

You are being charged a Tesla tax. 6AWG cable was overkill for 30 amp service, and if it was going to be in conduit it would be sufficient for a 60 amp service. Additionally, you wouldn't need a neutral line for the HPWC, so you'd need less conductors in the conduit than if you were running an outlet.

I'm not sure about the rules in Canada, but around here, you'd need a very expensive GFCI breaker for your outlet, and the 60 amp breaker would be LESS expensive, by far.

Call a different installer, even if only for comparison.

 

[Rocky_H]

I am being quoted prices between $830-960CAD+tax for what I think is a relatively simple installation. I only need 20'-25' of cables, the electrical panel is in the back of the garage and I want to place the wall connector at the front of the garage on the exterior wall.

That doesn't sound out of line, with needing to fit and bend conduit, mount it, plus having to go exterior through a wall. Remember that electricians or plumbing or HVAC people already have 100-200 just in overhead of taking the call, bidding a job, driving to your place, etc. just to show up at your house, regardless of how small the job is.

I told him I needed 60A for a Tesla

Well, no the car doesn't. The wall connector is a variable power device. It can be installed and configured on circuits as low as 15A, and the car doesn't have a minimum level of 60A that it needs either.

This should start with a question for the electrician:
"Do a load calculation on my service. How many amps do I have available for a new circuit?"
Sometimes if people start off saying "I must have a 60A circuit", then that is what the electrician is going on, and that may require some expensive upgrades to the panel or main service, where a 30 or 40A circuit might fit in pretty well without that.

 

[username123]

That doesn't sound out of line, with needing to fit and bend conduit, mount it, plus having to go exterior through a wall. Remember that electricians or plumbing or HVAC people already have 100-200 just in overhead of taking the call, bidding a job, driving to your place, etc. just to show up at your house, regardless of how small the job is.


Well, no the car doesn't. The wall connector is a variable power device. It can be installed and configured on circuits as low as 15A, and the car doesn't have a minimum level of 60A that it needs either.

This should start with a question for the electrician:
"Do a load calculation on my service. How many amps do I have available for a new circuit?"
Sometimes if people start off saying "I must have a 60A circuit", then that is what the electrician is going on, and that may require some expensive upgrades to the panel or main service, where a 30 or 40A circuit might fit in pretty well without that.

I know that it doesn't "need" a 60A circuit and that the RWD model 3 only benefits of a 40A circuit but I would rather future proof the wiring.

The one that quoted me $830 said that that cable doesn't need a conduit since its an "industrial black cable that I can just paint over."
The one that quoted $960 said that they would use conduit but that I could also ask them to "fish" the cable through the wall for the same price. Does that mean that I won't see the cable at all and they won't have to tear down the drywall?

I didn't start off by saying I want a 60A circuit, I just sent them both pictures of my panel. For the one that quoted $960, I told him that it would be for the Tesla wall connector and he quoted me everything with a 60A circuit. That electrician is 2 minutes away from my house so driving shouldn't be that expensive for them.

For the other electrician, I didn't tell him anything at first so he quoted me for a 30A circuit including a $1000 charger. When I told him I wanted 60A and that I already had the $700 Tesla WC, he quoted me $830.

Neither of them talked about a load calculation. I think its because my panel is 200A and has 60 spots with 17 of them being free

 

[username123]

You are being charged a Tesla tax. 6AWG cable was overkill for 30 amp service, and if it was going to be in conduit it would be sufficient for a 60 amp service. Additionally, you wouldn't need a neutral line for the HPWC, so you'd need less conductors in the conduit than if you were running an outlet.

That electrician told me that I don't need a conduit for this type of cable.

The other electrician that quoted me $960 is on Tesla's website and it says that he will run the cable through a PVC conduit 208/240. He didn't say anything about AWG. Also, Tesla's manual says not to install a GFCI circuit breaker since its integrated into the WC.

 

[dmurphy]

Remember that electricians or plumbing or HVAC people already have 100-200 just in overhead of taking the call, bidding a job, driving to your place, etc. just to show up at your house, regardless of how small the job is.

This. All of this. By the time the contractor van pulls up to your house, there's already a lot of cost in there - office operations, insurance, vehicle costs, fuel, tools, so on and so forth. Someone also holds the license - that's not free either. Not in time, not in fees, not in training, not in continuing education, not in liability insurance ...

I think small businesses are very misunderstood - there's absolutely a ton of cost wrapped up in a business like this.

 

[pbenjamin94]

don’t get from the tesla website lol. And honestly wall connector is a waste of money take it from someone who has it. I would get a NEMA 14-50 Plug and just tell them you need a NEMA 14-50 with 60A and don’t bring up tesla. I paid 250 to get wall connector installed and 250 to get NEMA installed. Have both since I got two cars.

 

[pbenjamin94]

don’t get from the tesla website lol. And honestly wall connector is a waste of money take it from someone who has it. I would get a NEMA 14-50 Plug and just tell them you need a NEMA 14-50 with 60A and don’t bring up tesla. I paid 250 to get wall connector installed and 250 to get NEMA installed. Have both since I got two cars.

Btw difference of like 7 miles per hour for me on my model S 75d. Will let you know what it is on my model Y

 

[username123]

And honestly wall connector is a waste of money take it from someone who has it. I would get a NEMA 14-50 Plug and just tell them you need a NEMA 14-50 with 60A and don’t bring up tesla. I paid 250 to get wall connector installed and 250 to get NEMA installed. Have both since I got two cars.

I want to install it outside so I have to get the wall connector and I can get up to a $600 rebate when buying a level 2 charger so I can either get the mobile connector + nema adapter for free instead of $425 or the wall connector for $100 instead of $700.

 

[Rocky_H]

I can get up to a $600 rebate when buying a level 2 charger

Check the details on that of what the requirements are. Some states are kind of specific with those incentives that it has to be certain types or has to be a standard kind of plug like J1772 instead of brand specific proprietary.

 

[israndy]

I'll say it again in this thread, it was a VERY easy job to add a Wall Charger to my cabin. I just popped off one more cover on the breaker panel, purchased a 60 amp 240v breaker of the same make (pretty expensive, maybe $60), and then I also got a 50' roll of 6 gauge two conductor solid core Romex (maybe $150), cause I don't need neutral, just to hots and a ground. I then ran the cable down existed conduit to under the house and then stapled across the ceiling of the garage (the entire bottom floor) and down the beam where I was gonna mount the WC. Pulled off the top plate that allowed me to run the Romex into the WC and curved around to attached the three wires into the WC at the terminals. Put the cover on and the faceplate, walked around outside and turned the breaker on walked down to the garage and saw it flashing, and then when finished I plugged my car in and got 45 MPH charging. Iz verry nicee

 

[Sophias_dad]

I know that it doesn't "need" a 60A circuit and that the RWD model 3 only benefits of a 40A circuit but I would rather future proof the wiring.

The one that quoted me $830 said that that cable doesn't need a conduit since its an "industrial black cable that I can just paint over."
The one that quoted $960 said that they would use conduit but that I could also ask them to "fish" the cable through the wall for the same price. Does that mean that I won't see the cable at all and they won't have to tear down the drywall?

I didn't start off by saying I want a 60A circuit, I just sent them both pictures of my panel. For the one that quoted $960, I told him that it would be for the Tesla wall connector and he quoted me everything with a 60A circuit. That electrician is 2 minutes away from my house so driving shouldn't be that expensive for them.

For the other electrician, I didn't tell him anything at first so he quoted me for a 30A circuit including a $1000 charger. When I told him I wanted 60A and that I already had the $700 Tesla WC, he quoted me $830.

Neither of them talked about a load calculation. I think its because my panel is 200A and has 60 spots with 17 of them being free

Fishing the wire is indeed putting it inside the wall. They'd have to make a few holes in the drywall, at least at the ends and turns.

With conduit, 6 gauge wire is fine. SOME 'industrial black cables' are actually wiring-in-flexible conduit, so they may also be also okay at 6 gauge. Typical NMB needs 4 gauge to be allowed to run at 48 amps continuously.

I hate visible conduit, probably more than I should. I'll probably hate it less when the various crap I have leaning against the NMB in my garage(since 1980) wears a hole in the insulation and my house burns down.

 

[pbenjamin94]

I want to install it outside so I have to get the wall connector and I can get up to a $600 rebate when buying a level 2 charger so I can either get the mobile connector + nema adapter for free instead of $425 or the wall connector for $100 instead of $700.

You could install a NEMA 14-50 outside they just put something covering it but it’s you’re choice. I guess with a rebate it works.

 

[username123]

You could install a NEMA 14-50 outside they just put something covering it but it’s you’re choice. I guess with a rebate it works.

Do you know if it would be possible to install a 14-50 outlet inside of the garage using the same wiring as the wall connector? That way I can still charge the car if its inside the garage

 

[UncleCreepy]

Do you know if it would be possible to install a 14-50 outlet inside of the garage using the same wiring as the wall connector? That way I can still charge the car if its inside the garage

The wall connector needs to have its own breaker. If you want an additional NEMA 14-50 outlet, it needs to have its own breaker and wiring.

 

[RayK]

Do you know if it would be possible to install a 14-50 outlet inside of the garage using the same wiring as the wall connector? That way I can still charge the car if its inside the garage

The alternative that I'm considering for my own garage setup is using transfer switch. Power will only go to the wall connector or a 14-50 outlet, selected by throwing the switch in the appropriate position.

 

[pbenjamin94]

Do you know if it would be possible to install a 14-50 outlet inside of the garage using the same wiring as the wall connector? That way I can still charge the car if its inside the garage

I believe if you have two outlets or one NEMA and one wall connector it splits the power between the two. But I believe that is only if both are plugged into something. Someone I know had two wall connectors on one breaker and it split the power between his two cars.

 

[Sophias_dad]

I believe if you have two outlets or one NEMA and one wall connector it splits the power between the two. But I believe that is only if both are plugged into something. Someone I know had two wall connectors on one breaker and it split the power between his two cars.

No, it doesn't work like that. You need two HWPCs in order to do power sharing. A UMC and an HPWC won't talk to each other.

Additionally you aren't allowed to put an outlet and an HPWC on the same circuit, although having a giant switch to select one or the other is probably fine. The only problem THEN is that the HPWC does NOT want a GFCI, and the outlet REQUIRES a GFCI.

 

[RayK]

The only problem THEN is that the HPWC does NOT want a GFCI, and the outlet REQUIRES a GFCI.

Yeah, that's one thing that needs to be figured out. I intend to use the 14-50 as a backup charging resource with the mobile connector, which I believe has it's own built-in GFCI. A secondary use of the 14-50 would be to power my daughter's RV when she visits but that would require a very long cord to reach the rig (can't park it in my driveway).

 

[civicdrivr]

and the outlet REQUIRES a GFCI.

This is entirely dependent on the state you live in. NEC 2020 code says yes, an outlet requires a GFCI breaker, but many states are still using 2017 or even 2014 code (like Virginia).

Secondly, OP is in Quebec, and they use CEC, so their code may differ even more.

@username123 - Given the rebates that are available to you, I would definitely go with the wall connector. I can't speak to the installation costs, but there is always a markup on electrical work. As others have mentioned, small businesses have a lot more that needs to be covered than materials.

Maybe call around and ask what they would charge to install just the breaker and terminate the wire at the wall connector, with you running the cabling ahead of time.