Is MCU 2 the most important feature when shopping for a used Tesla?

[Ostrichsak]

Those arguing "only go for MCU2" are not advocating the videos/games, they are advocating a longer expected life before an eMMC failure and $2-3k repair comes your way.

Great accept 1) the majority to this point have been replaced under warranty and 2) those that are out-of-warranty now have an option to replace the eMMC for about $500 or so. Kind of hard to justify the tens of thousands of dollars more that the newer MCU2 cost to save $500 if it's not for the video games.

 

[Ostrichsak]

Now that the boutique industry has sprung up around proactive eMMC replacements, I don't see this as a particularly compelling argument. Sounds like it's around $500 to have it done.

Nor do I particularly subscribe to the financial wisdom of paying $10k more for a car to reduce the risk of a $2-3k repair.

Looks like you beat me to the punch with roughly the same idea.

 

[OrbiterTI4]

Now that the boutique industry has sprung up around proactive eMMC replacements, I don't see this as a particularly compelling argument. Sounds like it's around $500 to have it done...

Great accept 1) the majority to this point have been replaced under warranty and 2) those that are out-of-warranty now have an option to replace the eMMC for about $500 or so...

I've seen some discussions on those points - I was of the understanding (please correct me as necessary) the third-party replacement was dependent on grabbing vehicle-specific certs off the existing MCU hardware (which was not guaranteed to be available) and only possible if the MCU board was physically on the third-parties bench (which may be a non-starter for some owners).

As far as number replaced, I have not seen any stats to claim a majority of warranty vs new vs refurbs.

 

[Ostrichsak]

I've seen some discussions on those points - I was of the understanding (please correct me as necessary) the third-party replacement was dependent on grabbing vehicle-specific certs off the existing MCU hardware (which was not guaranteed to be available) and only possible if the MCU board was physically on the third-parties bench (which may be a non-starter for some owners).

As far as number replaced, I have not seen any stats to claim a majority of warranty vs new vs refurbs.

I haven't seen any hard data either (doubtful Tesla will release that unless the class action lawsuit goes to discovery) but through reading posts here it seems that most are covered under warranty and I'm sure many don't even bother posting due to it being covered. I don't post up every time I get something replaced under warranty because.... well... what's the point? I mean if it's topical, sure but just starting a post to say "Telsa replaced my driver's side door handle under warranty today" seems kind of pointless.

I also haven't done a deep dive because I haven't experienced the issue but from what I've read it seems as though you need to pull your MCU (lots of videos available and sound relatively painless if you're handy) and then physically ship it to someone to repair. It seems as though turn-around times are around a week with transit and what not.

Sure it's not ideal but if I'm out of warranty I'm glad this option exists. I'd pay thousands to Tesla and be out a car at least a month as fast as our service centers are in this area. Not to mention I'd have to suffer the brain damage of trying to communicate with our local service center. No thanks.

While I think this was scary when it first start cropping up it seems as though the repair now isn't the worst thing ever. There's far more expensive items that can fail out-of-warranty in reality.

Not to mention the MCU1 cars have been around long enough to not only know what the common failure is but also have a repair in place. Time will tell what the weak link will be on the MCU2 or what it might cost to repair or if there will even be an aftermarket solution anytime soon.

Again, I'm not saying that I see ZERO benefit of the MCU2. That's not the case. There's obvious performance benefits. I'm just debating that the cars the MCU2 come in are worth the added buy-in that some around these parts preach about in some threads. Hell, if the MCU2 upgrade path ever arrives (might be accelerated over this eMMC issue if it ever hits Tesla financially) maybe I'll have a solution for a couple of grand to just upgrade it through Tesla when mine craps out. If they won't, I'm sure the aftermarket will since there's an untapped market.

tldr; I don't see the eMMC issue being such a big deal that a $20-25k more expensive car makes up that gap in "peace of mind" over getting a new MCU2.

 

[Chaserr]

MCU2 is Tesla's current hardware defined cutoff for cars that do / do-not get the latest features. Games may not be important to you, but look beyond the games at the underlying reason only MCU2 gets them. It has more memory, fewer worries of failing from too much EMMC memory use per update, and is QA tested by software engineers BEFORE they send it to your car, not after. I wouldn't recommend buying a car that is already deprecated and MCU1 is absolutely a deprecated format. I can't stress how important it is that you want a car that has hardware still being QA tested before each update; having a pre-AP car I can tell you even when new things are included tesla no longer tests them on older hardware, so MCU1 will quickly begin to irritate you. Don't make that choice, start with an up to date vehicle - range is great on every MCU2 car, performance is great on every tesla, but MCU1 is steadily getting worse with each update and there is still no ETA on a definitive decision whether we will ever be permitted to upgrade to MCU2 or not. Someday many years from now there may be an MCU3 that causes them to shift focus again, and you can re evaluate the usefulness of updates that may or may not degrade MCU2s performance... but why not wait and see if that happens in 5 or 6 years rather than knowing it is already happening to MCU1 right now?

 

[SilverGS]

I can't stress how important it is that you want a car that has hardware still being QA tested before each update; having a pre-AP car I can tell you even when new things are included tesla no longer tests them on older hardware,

I'm just curious to know how you know this for a fact.

I can't imagine that there is zero testing done on MCU1 hardware when we are still getting OTA updates as recently as the 2020.4.2 firmware version that added more voice commands and reading/replying to SMS.

 

[dubzz24]

I went through a similar decision process last summer and came to the same conclusion. My priorities were: 1) condition, 2) options (including model / battery size).

I value performance and knew I needed a PsomethingD model. There was no way I could afford a new P100D, so started looking at P85Ds which happened to be much better value than any MCU2 cars. What am I missing for tech? Netflix and youtube? No sentry mode and a "lesser" AP that works just as well for my uses as the new models. If ever my MCU fails, even if I have to pay for a repair at a dealer, I'll still be well ahead. No regrets at all.

 

[Chaserr]

I'm just curious to know how you know this for a fact.

I can't imagine that there is zero testing done on MCU1 hardware when we are still getting OTA updates as recently as the 2020.4.2 firmware version that added more voice commands and reading/replying to SMS.

It's an unfortunately more and more obvious observation as time goes on. Your example is a perfoect one because it highlights exactly what I am saying. Text messaging was clearly never tested on pre-AP hardware; it's too comically broken to have been passed by anyone whose job was to QA test that function. The older your hardware gets, the less likely it is to be tested so buy the latest hardware to avoid this for as long as you can. MCU1 hasn't had functional update notes for more than a year; it's not a big issue but again something a cursory QA pass world notice in under a year.

 

[EVortex]

Lots of good points on both sides. I think having the most current hardware is advantageous, but each person considering a purchase should set their own maximum price for desired options. Maybe you can find a good deal for a car with the features you want for a discounted price that works for you. If you don’t care about MCU2 and HW3 for native FSD then save some money or allocate it to other features you do care about. I personally have an early MCU2 Model S and just upgraded to HW3 and I believe future OTA upgrades on this platform will be significant to me. I would be willing to pay maybe $5k more for this, but probably not $10k - that’s just me.

 

[MorrisonHiker]

It's an unfortunately more and more obvious observation as time goes on. Your example is a perfoect one because it highlights exactly what I am saying. Text messaging was clearly never tested on pre-AP hardware; it's too comically broken to have been passed by anyone whose job was to QA test that function. The older your hardware gets, the less likely it is to be tested so buy the latest hardware to avoid this for as long as you can. MCU1 hasn't had functional update notes for more than a year; it's not a big issue but again something a cursory QA pass world notice in under a year.

I've posted in a few other threads that I found this out myself. Text Messaging works for my Android 8 phone in MCU2 cars but in MCU1 cars, it says I need Android 9. There is an Android 9 update for my phone. I tried installing it but ran into some Windows issues. lol. Fortunately, I'm upgrading to another phone in a few weeks anyways.

BTW, with the latest 2020.4.1 update, the release notes worked fine on both MCU1 cars!

 

[ucmndd]

MCU2 is Tesla's current hardware defined cutoff for cars that do / do-not get the latest features.

That's weird, I got a software update with a bunch of new features just last week.

You're stating this as fact without any factual knowledge and obvious evidence to the contrary.

 

[SilverGS]

It's an unfortunately more and more obvious observation as time goes on. Your example is a perfoect one because it highlights exactly what I am saying. Text messaging was clearly never tested on pre-AP hardware; it's too comically broken to have been passed by anyone whose job was to QA test that function. The older your hardware gets, the less likely it is to be tested so buy the latest hardware to avoid this for as long as you can. MCU1 hasn't had functional update notes for more than a year; it's not a big issue but again something a cursory QA pass world notice in under a year.

My car is AP1/MCU1 and the SMS messaging works amazingly well, including a bunch of new voice commands. I can't see how this was not tested on an AP1 car if you're saying the hardware cutoff is MCU2.

 

[glide]

I'm pretty sure the OP is asking about a Tesla vehicle. Let's keep this thread focused on his question unless I misunderstood and he's asking about non Tesla vehicles.

I’m asking what ”luxury” features OP thinks are present in any Tesla vehicle.

 

[glide]

Agreed, but referencing "luxury" in the Tesla universe. I am coming from an BMW X5 and i can make a list of features I'll be missing out on, but I'm wondering if going with a Model S will ease that transition or should I go with the more "rugid" Model Y, lol.

The only “luxury” features available in a Model S vs a Model Y are heated steering wheel and air suspension. If you consider those to be “luxury”.

The Model S door handles are a complete liability so I’m not including those.

 

[Chaserr]

That's weird, I got a software update with a bunch of new features just last week.

You're stating this as fact without any factual knowledge and obvious evidence to the contrary.

For anyone thatdoes not have "any factual knowledge" of the wide chasm between MCU1 and MCU2, I recommend looking at the differences between them and see the evidence for yourself. The split between them is immense and will only grow with each feature update. Existing feature disparity is a significant reason to purchase the latest hardware, and even basic usability / lagginess of the OS should be considered. I suggest everyone that isn't aware of how significant the differences are right now test both back to back and side by side. You'll choose MCU2 in a blind taste test. I'd say that is the single best reason to only look at new Teslas right now, even if you are completely uninterested in the improvements in range and performance over the years or the drastic changes to AP hardware more recently.

The guaranteed hardware death of MCU1 is another reason to reconsider. EMMC death is still an unaddressed problem, Tesla made it "better" but still excessively logs everything as a unique write which is the reason MCU1 has such a short life. MCU2 has the same underlying problem but uses better chips AND has so much more memory that the lifetime is probably over 20 years ina worst case scenario. It's more difficult to test this blind but a search for EMMC will produce a lot of stories why you don't want to buy a used car with this dying hardware.

 

[ucmndd]

For anyone thatdoes not have "any factual knowledge" of the wide chasm between MCU1 and MCU2, I recommend looking at the differences between them and see the evidence for yourself. The split between them is immense and will only grow with each feature update. Existing feature disparity is a significant reason to purchase the latest hardware, and even basic usability / lagginess of the OS should be considered. I suggest everyone that isn't aware of how significant the differences are right now test both back to back and side by side. You'll choose MCU2 in a blind taste test. I'd say that is the single best reason to only look at new Teslas right now, even if you are completely uninterested in the improvements in range and performance over the years or the drastic changes to AP hardware more recently.

Cool, but moving the goalposts and completely unrelated to what you originally said:

MCU2 is Tesla's current hardware defined cutoff for cars that do / do-not get the latest features.

Which just plain isn't true. Words matter.

The guaranteed hardware death of MCU1 is another reason to reconsider. EMMC death is still an unaddressed problem,

We covered this. It can be addressed now by multiple third parties for about $500.

 

[Chaserr]

I agree, and more than words, features matter. MCU1 doesn't get all the latest features. It's the DO-NOT GET half of the do/do-not side of the comparison tests. It's absolutely worth getting the latest hardware.

$500 is cheaper than Tesla's $3000 price, good to know for anyone already an owner, and something that should be budgeted by anyone willing to accept the reduced capacity and chunky underperformance of MCU1. For about the same pric eyou can actually fix the real problem by paying someone to root your car. Tesla still hasn't figured out what a TMPFS is or how important that little software tweak is to increasing the lifetime of MCU1 1000 times over. Rooting is a cheap way to extend the life of your EMMC longer than the rest of the car (assuming the chip isn't already too damaged).

I should add for anyone doing the comparison - if you come across an old MCU1 car running v8.1 or older, you've found a holy grail. Don't let them update and enjoy that car for what it is. Its features will be set in stone forever so keep that in mind if "new" is important to you - but it shouldn't be for anyone considering MCU1 regardless as "new" is already significantly less than MCU2 and the degree will only accelerate as MCU1 runs out of room to add more. Version 8.1 was exceptionally responsive and had a Model S/X specific user interface with a few more customizability options. v9 and later are the point at which things really started disappearing or becoming less QA tested and glitchy.

 

[realvvk]

The most important is AP. AP1 is vastly better than no AP. MCU version makes no difference to me at all.

 

[Alysashley79]

Agree, although I think the question is more in relation to the 3/Y. I can't really think of any "luxury" features present on the S that aren't also there on the 3/Y other than the aforementioned heated steering wheel or air suspension.

the model S just has a difffent feeling. If you’ve never owned a Tesla. The 3 imo would be fine. Having driven two different performance model s. The 3 felt more like my Toyota than a Tesla to me. I recently test drove a perf model 3. My 4 year old S grips the road better. Has a faster take off and seemlingly sails QUIELTLY down the road. The 3 was very loud inside. No power trunk. And I hated the mcu. It’s a little smaller than the mcu in the s but one third is taken up as the 3’s instrument cluster.

I honestly went in today thinking I’d come out with an order on a 3. Nope. Happily skipped out to my 4 year old model s and drove off.

 

[Toasty_OH]

IMO, the S simply looks damn good. Way better than the 3. I'm intrigued by the Y but it shares the same looks at the 3. The Model S shares some of the beauty of Aston Martin design which I've always appreciated. The interior is more luxurious too. An actual dashboard with useful information in front of the driver as well as a larger control screen that is integrated into the car is a much better look than a 15 inch LCD just plopped in the center of the car. The Model 3 is function over form. The S is a sweet combination of both.