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Just a Comparison (maybe some features that should get consideration in future model)

Discussion in 'Model S' started by AC1K, Aug 4, 2013.

  1. AC1K

    AC1K Member

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    #1 AC1K, Aug 4, 2013
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2013
    Hyundai Equus Ultimate Vs Model S Performance


    $72K CAD Vs $135KCAD

    Things Missing from the MS that the Equus has

    Heated, Cooled, massaging Front seats
    Heated, Cooled, massaging Rear Seats
    swiveling headlights
    reclining rear seats
    refrigerated compartments
    independent rear audio/visual entertainment
    rear climate control
    power rear window shade
    front cornering camera

    Base model standard features on the Equus (Base price is $62K)
    608W 17 speaker Lexicon sound (Lexicon only makes systems for Hyundai and Rolls Royce, its a massive improvement on the $2800 system tesla offers)
    wiper deicer
    Fog lights
    power folding mirrors
    245 front and 275 width rear tires (staggered setup)
    12 way power driver seat
    illuminated door scuff
    zonned front and rear climate control
    quality floor mats (not the crap tesla provides)
    power head rests
    air suspension (option on the MS)
    lane departure warning system (personally wouldn't need this as i dont drift all over the road but its still standard equipment and should be on the MS as well)
    front and rear parking sensors
    Smart cruise control (matches speed of vehicle infront)

    Performance is somewhat similar
    429HP vs 416HP, MS is slightly faster
    both handle terrible
    both are 5/5 crash rating


    I just think that Tesla should be offering more as standard equipment.
     
  2. Stoneymonster

    Stoneymonster Active Member

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    IMHO Hyundai has to have those things in order to come close to getting people to pay that price for, well, a Hyundai.
    I don't need or want most of that stuff, but I do want what is included in my car to be high quality. The Jury is still out on that one.
     
  3. cgiGuy

    cgiGuy Member

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    0-60 on a P85 is 3.9, so I wouldn't say "similar" performance so much.

    Plus, people don't look at this and an EV as starting at the same baseline. There's a reason they're after an EV, whatever it might be. So, that's their #1 priority. Couple that with the performance/tech of the car and everything else starts trickling down the list of things they care about..

    I also don't need most of what you listed..
     
  4. onesixeight

    onesixeight Member

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    I agree that I wish the MS has more options like active cruise and blind spot detection. But within that price difference, Tesla is offering something that isn't available from any auto maker at any price tag - EV motor with 275 miles of range. That to me is worth the premium.

    BTW, I would never buy the Equus...to me even with all those features, the driving experience is horrible. If all you want is gadgets then its a perfect car, otherwise its poor money for the overall package
     
  5. ckessel

    ckessel Active Member

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    That's a fairly outdated view at this point. Hyundai makes some very nice, competitive cars these days. My friend has a Sonata and it was a fairly clear winner over the competition he drove.

    Uh, no. I had almost no interest in Tesla because it was an EV. Several people that have driven my Tesla that are interested like how it is as a car and also have zero interest in it simply because it's an EV.
     
  6. Stoneymonster

    Stoneymonster Active Member

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    To each their own I guess. We looked at and test drove the Genesis before gettng the Model S, and I thought it was junk.
     
  7. trils0n

    trils0n 2013 P85

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    Both handle terrible? My Model S drives beautifully. A joy to drive. Like it better than very nice driving BMWs.
     
  8. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    On this metric, it looks like non-Sig is a better bar for comparison:
    2012 Hyundai Equus Ultimate First Test - Motor Trend
     
  9. ckessel

    ckessel Active Member

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    You do realize you're comparing a car that starts at 35k to a car that starts at 70k? If the Model S didn't trump the car in driving, especially given the Model S "standard" features, Tesla would already be bankrupt.
     
  10. AC1K

    AC1K Member

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    #10 AC1K, Aug 4, 2013
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2013
    its not specifically for you to have standard features, just like most people dont require FLAC or OGG support, but some people do (like me so i dont have to convert endless amounts of music)
    if heated wipers are found on almost every single car in canada (even a Kia Rio mid trim model) i think the model S should have it too being $120K+ CAD

    also with the whole "brand name" argument, Tesla isnt a well known high end brand either, for several months, hyundai took 4th place in sales (overtaking ford), they could not possibly be "crap" and jump from 11th place to 4th in a matter of 2-3 years.

    well there is a substantial price difference, since the tesla is double the price i expect double the performance, so the Hyundai performs adequately i would say.
    i did not buy the Model S because it was an EV, i bought it because it was the only car that was an "upgrade" to my own. My reasoning is, if the new car isnt better than your current one, then why would you "downgrade" to a new one?
    also as stated earlier, the standard features are just found on most other cars, this list was not made specifically for you. im sure there are features on your smartphone that you dont need but are still there because other groups of people need them.
    the heated wipers/heated mirrors/etc is something i definitely need because i live in Canada
    also in the snow a limited slip differential makes a HUGE difference

    Yeah i guess, but that makes the MS look even worse in standard features

    no, the MS feels like a floaty tub of jello, its just too heavy, its fine for just normal driving but taking corners fast or incase of emergency abrupt maneuvers it does poorly,
    maybe im just used to driving light and nimble cars, my first car i bought on my own was a protege5 which i modified the suspension on to eventually handle better than a mazdaspeed protege, the mazdaspeed protege was the successor to the mazda MP3, the MP3 at the time could outhandle a porsche 911 turbo on the track (but not out accelerate obviously). That car could corner so hard i would get scared before the tires even squealed (taking a 90° dual turning lane corner at over 95kph)


    Basically what im trying to get at here is i think the Model S should have the standard features of most other cars in its class (not nickle and dime for everything), as well as features you could not have on a regular ICE vehicle, and more innovative items not found on any car.

    i just hope they dont innovate at the beginning and ride off that for years to come without improvements and continually release the same stuff over and over again
     
  11. SwedishAdvocate

    SwedishAdvocate Active Member

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    Yes… Why would you?

    Ever heard of a little something that’s usually referred to as Global Warming?
     
  12. TokyoRush

    TokyoRush Member

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    I'm confused AC1K. I think you made a bad choice if you think that all of those features are useful and the MS drives poorly. I'm... well... shocked.

    Most of us feel the Tesla drives every bit as well as the best BMW have to offer and most of the reviewers seem to agree. It is certainly not "Floaty" and tears up corners in a well planted way.

    Yes, an old 918 Porsche or Miata, or the like may be much lighter and fun to toss around in a way that no large 5 passenger car is, but most of us out there prefer the balance Tesla has built in.

    But what I think (or anyone else) is besides the point. If you don't like the way it drives, don't like the options, and feel that a 20000$ Mazda rides better - why the heck did you buy this thing? I'd sell it now and buy yourself a few Hyundais.

    I've driven a number of Equus's (sp?) and find them VERY floaty, poorly designed, with features I wouldn't use and the ones I would use are unusable (just try to get the thing to sync with an iPhone). Yuck.
     
  13. ckessel

    ckessel Active Member

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    It's more floaty and less planted that my RX8 was. Granted, different types of cars, but the Model S isn't a paragon of virtue in the handling department. It's good, don't get me wrong, but it's not top of class (well, maybe with the P85+ it is).
     
  14. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    My point was that on this metric, your original characterization was wildly inaccurate:
    For Tesla, the gap in 0-60 here is (roughly) the difference between an 85 and P85 -- to the tune of a 5 digit price difference. Yet you call it "slightly faster" when comparing the Hyundai with the P85.

    When I see wild inaccuracies like these, I tend to discount the rest of the content of the comparison without even spending more time on it.
     
  15. aznt1217

    aznt1217 Active Member

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    I thought the Model S handled like my AP2 s2000. This... is a compliment on every level possible. lol
     
  16. deonb

    deonb Active Member

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    There are 3 types of cars in the world:

    1) Cars that get you from point A to point B
    2) Cars that get you from point A to point B with style
    3) Cars that get you from point A to ... I couldn't care less where I'm going I just want to drive

    Equus is a good candidate for #2. If you think the Model S falls into the first or second category, it's probably not the car for you.


    And oh, sorry for responding so late after your post, we had some bees in the backyard so decided to take my doggies for a walk in a park instead. Closest park - 300 feet. However, took the Model S, so ended up in Canada instead. 250 miles later doggies have been walked and we're back at home.

    No, I'm not kidding.
     
  17. AC1K

    AC1K Member

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    if you think about it, theoretically the fastest, most responsive cars would have to be the most efficient as well, electric motors are our only only means to convert more than 95% of potential/chemical energy to kinetic (currently).
    Also the responsiveness is as fast as electrons can travel which is near light speed, no other method of travel is that instantaneous as far as "responsiveness" goes (no transmission, standard, DCT, sequential can match the smoothness)
    Loss of energy through conversion would make the whole system go slower and waste more of my money (transmission, drive shaft, more junk to spin, etc) so you would also need it to be the most simple with the fewest number of conversions.
    Battery > Amp Controler > Motor

    global warming was never on my radar, i do not have the power as 1 person to change anything (in a meaningful volume)

    TL;DR
    I wanted the fastest, most responsive, best gas millage, least amount of maintainence, cheapest (even if its in the long run), laziest (no shifting, 1 pedal driving) solution possible
     
  18. Stoneymonster

    Stoneymonster Active Member

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    Yeah, that's... not actually how things work. ;)
     
  19. richkae

    richkae VIN587

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    Everyone chooses whether to be part of the solution or part of the problem.
     
  20. AC1K

    AC1K Member

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    i probably worded that poorly, i ment the speed at which the vehicle can respond and provide max power to the wheels from coasting. Moving electrons is MUCH faster than volumes of gasoline, air, oil, tranny fluid, coolant, etc
    in the tesla its not even a 100-200 ms (as fast as the computer can tell the amp controller to send max power), with a standard ICE + AT or DCT its more than 1 second (pedal>computer>injectors+TB>power cycle>crank>transmission+shifting>drive shaft>diff>axles>wheels)
    same with engine braking, the Tesla is nearly instant the second you left off the pedal, the ice needs to downshift multiple times and there is a huge lag between power and vacuum as well as the braking force being totally inconsistant

    well in my efforts to advertise this car, i got the car (huge sacrifice), ive talked to over 200 hundred people now, showed my car to almost all of them, 30-35 people got test drives in my car,
    net result = 0 Tesla screwed the people over that were interested with the price increases for options, it costs $20K CAD MORE to buy the car which is ridiculous

    as 1 person, its pretty much useless unless you have so much money you can just buy everyone a Tesla
     

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