Losing enthusiasm for Model 3

[igotzzoom]

I know I'm probably going to get plenty of blowback on this post, but I don't really care. I admit that I was very excited and passionate when I originally put in my deposit online night of the reveal in 2016. That was now nearly two years ago. Since then, GM has brought a full-fledged long-range EV to market, and seems to have no shortage of them available. Yes, I know comparing the Bolt and Model 3 is an apples and oranges comparison. I get it.

Secondly, we're nowhere near the $35,000 real-world price that was promised, and it looks like it's going to be a long time until that's the case.

Thirdly, the Model 3 will soon no longer be the only game in town in terms of a reasonably affordable long-range (200+ mile) EV. It ceased to be that when the Bolt came out. At this point, I'm not asking for a refund, but I'm honestly not sure what I'm going to do when I finally do get my configuration invite. At this point, I'm not in critical need of a third vehicle in the household. I sold one of my other ICE cars in anticipation of the Model 3, in retrospect, somewhat naïvely thinking I would get it "any day now."

Now, I see announcements of the Hyundai Kona EV and Kia Niro EV. Both of those would fit my needs fine, and I find them more aesthetically pleasing that the somewhat awkward-looking Bolt. However, even my initial revulsion to the Bolt's styling has subdued somewhat. I no longer "hate" it. I still think it's awkward-looking, but I'm to the point where I'd consider it as a daily driver, regardless of styling.

I know none of the vehicles I've mentioned have that status or performance of the Model 3. But I'm to the point where I no longer care about having the "newest, shiniest" thing on the road. If I wanted that, I should have stood in line first day, which I didn't. But considering all of the quality issues I've heard about on the early-run models, I'm not sure I would have wanted one. I'm going to give it until mid-summer 2018 to see if I get my invite. If August '18 comes and goes and still no invite, at that point, I think I'm probably going to ask for my money back.

I'm still a believer in Tesla's mission and what Elon is doing advancing technology in multiple industries. However, I think his showmanship gets him in trouble sometimes in terms of over-promising and under-delivering. I wish he'd be a little more realistic in the timeline goals he announces.

 

[kingjamez]

There is still no announced EV that is as compelling from a feature and price perspective compared to the Model 3. The Kona and Niro are neat, but where are you going to charge them on a long trip? How far along is their autonomy program? Same goes for the Bolt and Leaf.

If you are impatient, go buy a used Model S. You can get them for less than a new Model 3.

-Jim

 

[SomeJoe7777]

You have a valid complaint RE: the timeline. You've been waiting a long time and will have to wait some more.

However, let's remember that the shiny and available EVs from GM, Hyundai, Kia, etc. have severe limitations that no one talks about. The notion that the Chevy Bolt is a "long range" EV is laughable to me. Ask a Chevy dealership salesperson how do you drive the Bolt from Houston to Dallas and back in one day -- a trip I've done many times in my Model S. Listen carefully for the crickets.

The Bolt, Kona, Niro, etc. all have the same problem -- while their battery may be large, they have no long distance charging network. The base model Bolt doesn't even have any type of fast-charge option. You CANNOT do any type of long distance trip unless you purchase the CCS charging add-on. Even that has problems -- it's less than 50% of the speed of a Tesla Supercharger, and has scarce availability.

Yes, Telsa doesn't have a standard range Model 3 available yet, which is part of why the $35K price tag isn't realized. At some point, it will be here though. And at some point, the Model 3 will greatly exceed the Bolt in production numbers. GM doesn't have a battery factory, so the total number of Bolts they can produce is limited to a ceiling of how many batteries they can obtain. They'll never get the costs down whereas Tesla eventually will.

I know this doesn't solve your problem, nor does it make the wait any easier. But just remember that while you might be questioning your enthusiasm for the Model 3, also shrewdly question the shiny and slick alternatives, which don't add up to nearly what their manufacturers would have you believe.


Edit: Corrected Bolt fast-charging information.

 

[insaneoctane]

...
Now, I see announcements of the Hyundai Kona EV and Kia Niro EV....

Do you see the irony of comparing your disappointment with the 2 year wait to recent "announcements"?

You mentioned the Chevy Bolt. You can buy that car today. You could have bought one a year ago! But, according to it's sales figures, for most people, it is not compelling enough.

Tesla has clearly lit a blazing fire under other manufacturer's asses. They already know how to bring a car to market, so their struggle will be with the EV design and charging infrastructure.

I guess we just pick our poison. By the way, I think Tesla will make significant leaps in the manufacturing department over the next few years while the incumbents figure out EV designs, but without charging infrastructure, they will always lose IMO.

 

[ggies07]

If I wanted that, I should have stood in line first day, which I didn't.

Hell, I put my reservation down in the middle of the day and I have to wait until the end of this year to get the base model. I feel ya. I have totally lost all enthusiasm for the car and company, as we had to wait 2 years before they started producing them and now another year because of f-ups.

 

[igotzzoom]

I hear what you're saying about the charging infrastructure, and without a doubt, it is a factor. But at the moment, there are still two other ICE vehicles in our household for longer trips, and if it was that much of a concern, I'd probably get a Volt. I just wish EM would be a little more realistic about projected timelines.

 

[SMAlset]

I tend to think with the Model 3 battery production issue close to being resolved we can pretty much depend on the delivery estimates given to date. I got my invite last month and would have received a First production car within the last timeframe update (owner, very back of the line). What is your delivery window timeframe? I'm assuming you are waiting for the Standard version? Being end of line Owner, my window for that was Early 2019.

Have you been in a Model 3 yet and driven one? I had the opportunity a few weeks ago at a owner meetup and have to say it's a car I very much will be happy to have when I'm next invited for the AWD version which I deferred to get. Love the way it handled, great acceleration which makes it as fun as the Model S we have and being smaller and lighter more zippier I guess. Plus the car is something I really love looking at...same as our Model S. If you don't really need a car yet, why settle for something that you sound like you are talking yourself into when if you can hold out you'll have it all.

I completely believe that Tesla will release the Standard version (unlike some doubters). Think the delay was totally due to the production problems they've had and the pressure it put on them financially. Elon steps up to help out people in Puerto Rico to get a hospital up and running electrically. He heard about the super high energy costs in Australia and is helping out with providing a solar power source to low-income housing. Very strongly feel that Tesla will be producing the Standard Model 3 version as soon as feasible for them and like I already said I think the current delivery windows are pretty good. It's always been Elon's and Tesla's plan for it to be available and don't think they will waiver from that commitment. My advice is to hang in there unless you really can't any longer. Every day I drive or am a passenger in our Model S, I just feel so great about it. Given how much time we spend in our cars I really feel like you should drive a car that really makes you happy to be in it.

 

[ABCTG]

They did send an email re the delay;

Thank you again for your continued support as a Model 3 reservation holder. In the past few months, we’ve made significant progress in production and have started delivering Model 3 to customers in over twenty states.

As we work hard to meet demand, we wanted to let you know that your estimated delivery timing has been adjusted to a slightly later window. You can log into your Tesla Account to view your current delivery estimate at any time.

Thank you for your patience. We can’t wait for you to get your Model 3. Here’s what Road & Track had to say about their first test drive.
Best Regards,
The Tesla Team

I do feel like they could have left out the link to what Road & Track had to say.

C'mon, as if anyone who put a deposit on a Tesla hasn't read every single article ever.

 

[Az_Rael]

. The Bolt doesn't even have any type of fast-charge option. You CANNOT do any type of long distance trip in a Bolt

The Bolt has a DC Fast charging option. It uses CCS. Here in California, there is a growing highway network of CCS chargers. Not as convenient as SC's, but it does exist. I wish Tesla had an adapter, honestly, would be helpful sometimes at CCS-only stations.

 

[igotzzoom]

I may still end up configuring and taking delivery. It's just that I'm not red-hot gung-ho like I once was. Hopefully my feelings will change if/when I get behind the wheel.

 

[SMAlset]

I may still end up configuring and taking delivery. It's just that I'm not red-hot gung-ho like I once was. Hopefully my feelings will change if/when I get behind the wheel.

You need to sit in one and better yet drive one. Surely being in Southern California you can find someone at a Supercharger or better yet go to one of the owner meet ups in Southern Calif. where more and more owners are bringing their Model 3s. Everyone I've encountered is more than willing to show off and/or give rides or even let you drive their car.

CLUBS or https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/groups/

Sometimes info about meetups is posted in the California general forum area: California

What better way to actually get feedback from other owners in person!

 

[igotzzoom]

You need to sit in one and better yet drive one. Surely being in Southern California you can find someone at a Supercharger or better yet go to one of the owner meet ups in Southern Calif. where more and more owners are bringing their Model 3s. Everyone I've encountered is more than willing to show off and/or give rides or even let you drive their car.

CLUBS

Sometimes info about meetups is posted in the California general forum area: California

To be perfectly honest, I'm not sure I care enough to go out of my way to do a test drive. I have no doubt it's an impressive driving experience. The question I have to ask myself is if it's worth taking on additional debt at this point in time. I have enough to make a substantial down payment, but not enough to buy one cash.

 

[SMAlset]

Well that's a whole different issue then. Instead of comparing other cars and kind of coming down on Tesla for not being able to meet goals they hoped would be possible, I'm seeing this as you don't feel comfortable paying even the base price. Maybe better if the thread started out that way.

 

[sreams]

I know I'm probably going to get plenty of blowback on this post, but I don't really care. I admit that I was very excited and passionate when I originally put in my deposit online night of the reveal in 2016. That was now nearly two years ago. Since then, GM has brought a full-fledged long-range EV to market, and seems to have no shortage of them available. Yes, I know comparing the Bolt and Model 3 is an apples and oranges comparison. I get it.

Secondly, we're nowhere near the $35,000 real-world price that was promised, and it looks like it's going to be a long time until that's the case.

Thirdly, the Model 3 will soon no longer be the only game in town in terms of a reasonably affordable long-range (200+ mile) EV. It ceased to be that when the Bolt came out. At this point, I'm not asking for a refund, but I'm honestly not sure what I'm going to do when I finally do get my configuration invite. At this point, I'm not in critical need of a third vehicle in the household. I sold one of my other ICE cars in anticipation of the Model 3, in retrospect, somewhat naïvely thinking I would get it "any day now."

Now, I see announcements of the Hyundai Kona EV and Kia Niro EV. Both of those would fit my needs fine, and I find them more aesthetically pleasing that the somewhat awkward-looking Bolt. However, even my initial revulsion to the Bolt's styling has subdued somewhat. I no longer "hate" it. I still think it's awkward-looking, but I'm to the point where I'd consider it as a daily driver, regardless of styling.

I know none of the vehicles I've mentioned have that status or performance of the Model 3. But I'm to the point where I no longer care about having the "newest, shiniest" thing on the road. If I wanted that, I should have stood in line first day, which I didn't. But considering all of the quality issues I've heard about on the early-run models, I'm not sure I would have wanted one. I'm going to give it until mid-summer 2018 to see if I get my invite. If August '18 comes and goes and still no invite, at that point, I think I'm probably going to ask for my money back.

I'm still a believer in Tesla's mission and what Elon is doing advancing technology in multiple industries. However, I think his showmanship gets him in trouble sometimes in terms of over-promising and under-delivering. I wish he'd be a little more realistic in the timeline goals he announces.

To be fair, the Bolt doesn't have a shortage issue simply due to lack of demand. Tesla is currently building far more Model 3s than Chevy is building Bolts. That should tell you something. Those other cars may fit your needs, but a great many people won't buy them because they like the 3 better.

 

[McRat]

I hear what you're saying about the charging infrastructure, and without a doubt, it is a factor. But at the moment, there are still two other ICE vehicles in our household for longer trips, and if it was that much of a concern, I'd probably get a Volt. I just wish EM would be a little more realistic about projected timelines.

I think a tipping point for many 2016 reservationists will be if the Model 3 gets a third 'bump' in the timeline shortly after the Q1 report. This will push many into 2019 for actual deliveries.

Q3/Q4 could be very interesting this year.

Tesla owners/friends might get AWD invites early this summer, prior to 2016 reservationist invites for any variants. And Tesla said foreign sales will start in 2018. How they divide up the queue will have a large effect on 2016 reservations. Note that employees and 2016/17/18 MS/X owners need to be serviced first if they continue with the existing queue pattern.

This is the latest word for the next 9 months of this year from Tesla:

2018

• All-Wheel Drive production begins
• Production of the Standard Battery begins
• International deliveries of left-hand drive vehicles begin this year

 

[RayK]

I may still end up configuring and taking delivery. It's just that I'm not red-hot gung-ho like I once was. Hopefully my feelings will change if/when I get behind the wheel.

And there's always Turo.com to see if somebody local to you is renting their car.

 

[igotzzoom]

To be fair, the Bolt doesn't have a shortage issue simply due to lack of demand. Tesla is currently building far more Model 3s than Chevy is building Bolts. That should tell you something. Those other cars may fit your needs, but a great many people won't buy them because they like the 3 better.

I see tons of Bolts around here in SoCal. I've heard nothing glaringly negative about the driving experience of the Bolt. If there's any resistance to it, it's for the styling.

 

[SomeJoe7777]

The Bolt has a DC Fast charging option. It uses CCS. Here in California, there is a growing highway network of CCS chargers. Not as convenient as SC's, but it does exist. I wish Tesla had an adapter, honestly, would be helpful sometimes at CCS-only stations.

Is this a new option? To my knowledge, early Bolts had no fast charge capability at all, not even a paid option.

Anyway, thanks for the note, I've edited my post to reflect.

 

[N5329K]

I hear what you're saying about the charging infrastructure, and without a doubt, it is a factor. But at the moment, there are still two other ICE vehicles in our household for longer trips, and if it was that much of a concern, I'd probably get a Volt. I just wish EM would be a little more realistic about projected timelines.

This was my position. The ability to drive Model 3 long distances via the SC system was a plus, but not a huge plus. Not with other cars on hand that could handle the occasional long drive without a problem.
Also, once the rollback in base model production was announced, the issues that are coming up with Model 3 - both those that were designed in and those they are still discovering- put me over the edge (great looking car, important company, but...) and I decided to cancel. I have no interest in a premium Model 3, and no confidence that I'd see a base Model 3 this year, or even early next (April 1 online reservation). And like you, I'm also seeing a widening field of options that might suit me fine, or even better.
I'd hang on and see when the base model might actually go into production, and decide then whether it's still the car you want. And go sit in a Model 3. Drive one.
Do the same as competition shows up in your local dealerships. Then decide to follow through with the 3, or cancel and buy something that's better for you.
Robin

 

[sreams]

I see tons of Bolts around here in SoCal. I've heard nothing glaringly negative about the driving experience of the Bolt. If there's any resistance to it, it's for the styling.

Another negative is very narrow front seats. And no charging network.

GM doesn't produce a lot of these, and yet they are readily available. Whatever the reason, people aren't buying them.