Lucid Air vs. MS?

[JLC13]

Had a chance at a recent EV event to spend quite a bit of time sitting in and talking to the owner of a Lucid Air (I don't recall the trim level name but he said it was one step above the base model). Other than being a traditional sedan rather than a hatchback and therefore much less cargo capacity/flexibility, it seems to be very impressive.

Anyone here currently or recently own a Lucid Air and able to offer real world comparisons to the Model S? Now that Lucid - and just about everyone else - has moved to the Tesla charging standard and Tesla has opened up the supercharger network, non-Tesla vehicles seem much more appealing to me.

(Please no ranting and raving one way or the other - I'm looking for insight into features, operation, and quirks, both good and bad, that wouldn't be obvious in a test drive or simple walk around. I also only ever by used cars and probably won't be replacing my current MS for a few more years so I'm looking for more general observations, not very specific comparisons between the current model year vehicles.)

 

[Made in CA]

I was very, very close to buying a Lucid Air Touring earlier this year. I ended up buying a new MSP instead. The Air Touring is a great car and they are pretty close to the same price now.

My decision came down to:

1) Stability and Service availability. The Air is still pretty new and could have a lot of issues. The closest Lucid service center is 50 miles away in Beverly Hills. The drive there includes slogging down the 405. I did not want to deal with getting the Air down there if (when?) something went wrong. There is a Tesla store 6 miles from my house.

2) Suspension. This may sound dumb but I really want a height adjustable suspension on such a low car. The Air would have scrapped coming in and out of my driveway and that would have driven me nuts. Also - the new adaptive suspension in the MS is awesome IMHO.

3) Supercharging. Yes - Lucid and everyone else is moving to NACS but it is not there for Lucid yet.

4) Software stability and features. Tesla is just way out in front in this area.

5) Hatchback

6) Styling. Yes - this is subjective. The Plaid is my 3rd MS and I still think it a great looking car.

 

[JLC13]

Thanks for the point about the suspension. Does anyone know if at least one of the Air trim levels have air suspension? I certainly would miss that from my MS.

And while I appreciate your point about software stability, I have to chuckle a bit given some of the back and forth we've seen in that area from Tesla.

 

[Made in CA]

Air suspension is not available in any of the Airs. But, according to most of the reviewers, the suspension in the Air is superbly tuned and handles great. I can only say that it seemed to ride and handle great during my extended test drive. But in my non-expert hands the current MSP handles and rides just as nicely.

 

[Unclepaul]

Biggest issue seems to be that Lucid sells their cars below their cost of production, losing $ on every car they sell.
Tesla sells at market leading profits and are very profitable for the company.
Seems like Tesla will have a much better chance of surviving the competitive days ahead.
Tesla has the better FSD system and gathers more data than all the other EV companies combined.

No doubt this makes good value sense for the Lucid buyer, but worries about the company surviving to profitability is a concern.
See similar issues with Rivian.

 

[Trunk Gap]

It ends up being very simple for me any time I consider a Lucid. I have zero interest in a car that has asterisks with regards to longevity and support.
Lucid is going out of business.
There is simply no way, especially in this economic environment, that their current operating approach is sustainable. They need a huge infusion of capital that ain’t coming from anywhere but a hawkish PE firm who will pay them pennies on the dollar for their scraps.

To me, that makes them a non starter. Paying your CEO $300M to lose $300k per car with an ASP of $90k is just about the biggest red flag you could ever dream up, and it actually happened. Incredible destruction of opportunity. If you don’t care about that sort of stuff, it’s a fun product (that still to me is not better than the MS). Other than that - yikes.

 

[vcor]

I'm not a fan of Lucid (mainly due to styling), but I'm not that worried about Lucid going out of business. The Saudis seem to be willing to put unlimited funds to keep it going. So if you like the Lucid, you might pay $150K but you are getting a car that costs $400K or so to make. So it seems it is the deal of the century.

The same could be said of Tesla in the early days. My 2013 Model S which I bought for about $65K new, likely cost Tesla $300K or so to make. Another fantastic deal!

I do think Lucid learned many lessons from Tesla, but at the same time, it is a new company with technology not fully tested (i.e. longevity). Still as an early adopter, and if you're willing to deal with a few expected issues, a Lucid should be fine. It will get sorted out. Now Fisker is a different story!

 

[Tam]

Had a chance at a recent EV event to spend quite a bit of time sitting in and talking to the owner of a Lucid Air (I don't recall the trim level name but he said it was one step above the base model). Other than being a traditional sedan rather than a hatchback and therefore much less cargo capacity/flexibility, it seems to be very impressive.

Anyone here currently or recently own a Lucid Air and able to offer real world comparisons to the Model S? Now that Lucid - and just about everyone else - has moved to the Tesla charging standard and Tesla has opened up the supercharger network, non-Tesla vehicles seem much more appealing to me.

(Please no ranting and raving one way or the other - I'm looking for insight into features, operation, and quirks, both good and bad, that wouldn't be obvious in a test drive or simple walk around. I also only ever by used cars and probably won't be replacing my current MS for a few more years so I'm looking for more general observations, not very specific comparisons between the current model year vehicles.)

I have both a Tesla 2023 Model S and a 2022 Lucid Grand Touring. I enjoy driving a Lucid much more than a Tesla.

I am not a "car" person. I used to drive a Ford Escort, then upgraded to a Toyota Prius. I bought the 2012 Model S because of its smokelessness and range.

If I wanted financial stability and service convenience, I would have bought a Nissan Leaf, but the short range was a big turn-off.

Instead, I bought a Tesla at that time, and its financial status was terrible; it was about to go bankrupt time after time, and the service was too far, either 200 miles in San Francisco or 200 miles in Los Angeles.

I bought a Lucid in 2022 for its range, and its financial status and service are just like how Tesla was in 2012. Thus, this is not new to me.

I hate that Lucid is not a hatchback ( Its next 2025 Gravity SUV coming at the end of this year will be a hatchback), but it feels much more comfortable to sit in. Its cabin is very roomy for its occupants. It feels much more spacious and much more leg rooms to sit in a Lucid.

It does not have air suspension, but the ride is much softer, less bumpier, and much more comfortable than my Tesla air suspension. Its next 2025 Gravity SUV, coming at the end of this year, will have an air suspension.

I feel a Lucid takes curvy roads much better than my Teslas that I have driven. Driving on the winding road on the Appalachian Mountain was a joy.

It doesn't have its own charging stations but thanks to its long range, I could skip a couple of stations instead.

I took a round trip from CA to the East Coast and back with no problems and here's a sample of a range in a hot summer with 396.6 miles and about 60 more miles remain with 1 charge:

It has no sexy software stuff like a browser but I feel much more relaxed with a Lucid than a high-tech Tesla FSD.

Tesla seems to make cars for robots and it's hard to get in touch with a human. Lucid on the other, makes cars for humans and I can still call its Service Center to get an answer from a human.

 

[cptnslo]

Didn’t lucid hit the magic 5kWH/mi or something recently? I agree they NEED a solid plan because even if the Saudi’s have unlimited money eventually I figure they’d get tired of constant cash injections. I know lucid also does battery work with other brands which helps.
I think the front ends look amazing. Back end is NOT my cup of tea. The sapphire however is stunning in photos (haven’t seen one in person) but 250k is a lot to swallow when it’s not much faster than a plaid that’s 1/3 of the cost.
I know they’re hoping the gravity will be the saving grace for them but the problem is they don’t have an “entry level” vehicle that’s affordable. You can’t survive just selling upscale EVs.
Apparently they just trademarked the ocean name and all the fisker people on Reddit are freaking out

 

[Nolakai]

Lucid just opened a showroom in Pasadena. More are on the way, I expect. Probably not going out of business anytime soon.

 

[bobbyjae]

Lucid and Rivian make vehicles that people actually want (unlike Fisker). They will be bought out by another company before going out of business.

 

[Leftlane22]

I had a Lucid Air Grand Touring on order before switching and getting a Model S Plaid. I think the Lucid is sharp and 516 miles range on the 19s is seriously good. But, and a big but - EA can’t touch the supercharger network, and they don’t have nearly enough service centers around to take care of any volume of cars. It drives very nice, although I don’t like the spaceship whine built into the motors. Their software is very buggy and way behind the maturity of Tesla, but they do have CarPlay (although it’s weird because it doesn’t fit the screen correctly). The materials, fit and finish are orders above Tesla - way more luxurious and spacious. I was worried about them surviving too - and I really didn’t want to give any money to the murderous Saudis anyway. Their tech will save them even if they don’t survive as an actual car maker, because their engineering and efficiency is very good and somebody will buy them out.

 

[Yelobird]

With barely enough cash to float into 2025 and over 60% ownership by the Saudi’s nobody is going to buy this company. They are already tooling build lines in Saudi region and this will sail out of the US leaving anyone here on an island.

 

[Ben W]

I am also pondering the Model S vs Lucid Gravity decision, a year or two out. (To replace a 2017 Model 3 with FSD. The Model X is too big; and we already also have a Model Y.) Some considerations:

1. I hate supporting the Saudis, but supporting Elon lately is not that much more palatable. (Somewhat more, but ugh.)
2. Lucid currently has a better AV sensor suite; Tesla has better AV software + compute. Software is easily upgradeable; hardware is not. Where will Lucid's software + compute be in five years? Will Tesla be able to overcome the limitations (no lidar/radar) of their hardware suite to make L4 achievable?
3. I would definitely wait for HW5 (for Model S) and built-in NACS (for Gravity) before upgrading. Would also like to see a Model S body style refresh, V2G capability, and steer-by-wire.
4. Would FSD be transferable at that point? That may influence my decision.
5. I have a steep driveway, and the car will have to be able to navigate it without scraping the ground. Presumably both would be able to do this.
6. Company stability. We should know a lot more in a couple years, and this might also make the decision for me.

FWIW, I bought an early Tesla Roadster in 2008 (put down deposit in 2006) and bought one of the first 2012 Model S. So I'm quite used to living on the bleeding technological edge!

 

[Tam]

I am also pondering the Model S vs Lucid Gravity decision, a year or two out. (To replace a 2017 Model 3 with FSD. The Model X is too big; and we already also have a Model Y.) Some considerations:

1. I hate supporting the Saudis, but supporting Elon lately is not all that much more palatable. (Somewhat more, but ugh.)
2. Lucid currently has a better AV sensor suite; Tesla has better AV software + compute. Software is easily upgradeable; hardware is not. Where will Lucid's software + compute be in five years? Will Tesla be able to overcome the limitations (no lidar/radar) of their hardware suite to make L4 realistic?
3. I would definitely wait on HW5 (for Model S) or built-in NACS (for Gravity) before upgrading. Would also like to see a Model S body style refresh, V2G capability, and steer-by-wire.
4. Would FSD be transferable at that point? That may influence my decision.
5. I have a steep driveway, and the car will have to be able to navigate it without scraping the ground. Presumably both would be able to do this.
6. Company stability. We should know a lot more in a couple years, and this might also make the decision for me.

FWIW, I bought an early Tesla Roadster in 2008 (put down deposit in 2006) and bought one of the first 2012 Model S. So I'm quite used to living on the bleeding technological edge!

1) I respect your moral perspective in avoiding the Saudi.

I am more practical about needs.

The US hated the red Communist China and fought in Việt Nam to contain China. We ended up conducting business with the red China even now. We also normalize with Việt Nam even though we don't do that with Cuba.

Many MAGA crowds hate China but they still wear made-in-China MAGA hats and accessories...

2) Lucid has radars for Cross Traffic Protection. Not just for the front but also for the back! Numerous times, Lucid would save me when I backed out from a parking space (Automatic Brakings). I love the radars!

5) It's a challenge with steep drive way. I just have to make sure to drive diagonally and slowly.

 

[Leftlane22]

I would think the Gravity will be bigger than the X, no? It’s a 3 row SUV that should be longer and wider than the X, but I haven’t seen one in person so I can’t really tell from pictures. It looks pretty nice and the interior will be way nicer than an X or S.

 

[epicshooter]

Something to keep in mind about NACS support is the Lucid is not the same voltage architecture as Tesla, it charges slower at all superchargers than top end third party chargers. I know it has the range, better efficiency and if it is on the right charger it will charge faster than a Tesla, however finding those is still problematic. Full disclosure- Tesla owner, Lucid stock owner (only for the tech)

 

[LA2Naples]

5. I have a steep driveway, and the car will have to be able to navigate it without scraping the ground. Presumably both would be able to do this.

My neighborhood in LA has very steep inclines into each home from a shared alley. My 2023 S will only barely make it in on VERY HIGH setting with very careful and precise inputs and changing steering angle at impact coming out. My neighbor with Lucid scrapes horribly every single time, I cringe when I hear their Air exiting and entering. They have to back in to minimize scraping but scrapes 100% of the time.

 

[AMPd]

It ends up being very simple for me any time I consider a Lucid. I have zero interest in a car that has asterisks with regards to longevity and support.
Lucid is going out of business.
There is simply no way, especially in this economic environment, that their current operating approach is sustainable. They need a huge infusion of capital that ain’t coming from anywhere but a hawkish PE firm who will pay them pennies on the dollar for their scraps.

To me, that makes them a non starter. Paying your CEO $300M to lose $300k per car with an ASP of $90k is just about the biggest red flag you could ever dream up, and it actually happened. Incredible destruction of opportunity. If you don’t care about that sort of stuff, it’s a fun product (that still to me is not better than the MS). Other than that - yikes.

No worries, once their factory in Saudi Arabia is up and running they’ll hire enough slaves to really bring that cost down!

 

[NJturtlePower]

It ends up being very simple for me any time I consider a Lucid. I have zero interest in a car that has asterisks with regards to longevity and support.
Lucid is going out of business.

For me this is a non-issue because I typically only keep vehicles for 3-5 years. Tesla Model 3 owner (also had a 19' Performance 3) since 2018 and now and X.

That said, as much as I like the higher luxury build and features like massage seats of the Lucid I would not be interested in any non-Tesla until they come with the standard NACS port. Adapters are OK I guess as long as they gain Supercharger access ASAP, but why not just wait at this point since its right around the corner, 2025 for more brands.

Graphic attached is from Feb. 2024 but may already be outdated.

For those interested in the used market I think the Air Grand Touring is a crazy good value as do most reviewers. Literally 50% off the near top trim, hands down a better interior, I do prefer the S exterior style though.

I'll be looking hard at that new Lucid Gravity after my 3-4 year stint with my new 2023 Model X LR... already wishing for a more refined and comfortable suspension and upgraded interior.

Tesla is unmatched with software and performance for the price, but I'm not closeminded enough to swear off brands like Lucid or Rivian down the road.

Love me some Doug reviews too!