Makes me sad to hear many reviews of the New S complain about build quality!

[timindp]

The chrome handles are a pain in the a living here in South Florida. Sitting in the sun, the handles get really hot to the touch. Build quality does not compare to Mercedes or BMW for the same price range. I have had all of them and I must say that the build quality is far superior on German cars than my Tesla. They cut too many corners to save weight, but I guess you are paying for the battery and tech. Once Mercedes and BMW figure out how to develop long range batteries and design an electric car for each of their models, Tesla will probably fizzle. Image an S Class or 7 Series with a 500 mile range for around the same price as the Tesla. I would go back to German if this ever happens.

 

[jebinc]

The chrome handles are a pain in the a living here in South Florida. Sitting in the sun, the handles get really hot to the touch. Build quality does not compare to Mercedes or BMW for the same price range. I have had all of them and I must say that the build quality is far superior on German cars than my Tesla. They cut too many corners to save weight, but I guess you are paying for the battery and tech. Once Mercedes and BMW figure out how to develop long range batteries and design an electric car for each of their models, Tesla will probably fizzle. Image an S Class or 7 Series with a 500 mile range for around the same price as the Tesla. I would go back to German if this ever happens.

I found that the German brands are great as long as the car is under the warranty period. YMMV.

 

[Trunk Gap]

Again, what does this have to do with the price of tea in China???
How many minutes I spent behind the yoke does not prevent me from pointing out that even the reviewer quoted by someone else hates the yoke. Nor did I ask you whether or not I should get one, so another comment from you neither here or there.

I see you've had your daily dose of Elon coolaid, chug on!

So one of us took the time to make a thread about a car they don’t own, haven’t driven, and aren’t interested in buying. Then proceeds to argue with a stranger about that car, again that they don’t own and have no experience with. Then gets salty when a discussion thread they started on a discussion forum turned into a…discussion.

While one of us owns said car, enjoys it, and simply stated such for those interested in a review from someone with actual experience with the car.

No kool-aid necessary friend, just facts.

Enjoy your taycan, it’s a great car

 

[whitex]

So one of us took the time to make a thread about a car they don’t own, haven’t driven, and aren’t interested in buying. Then proceeds to argue with a stranger about that car, again that they don’t own and have no experience with. Then gets salty when a discussion thread they started on a discussion forum turned into a…discussion.

While one of us owns said car, enjoys it, and simply stated such for those interested in a review from someone with actual experience with the car.

No kool-aid necessary friend, just facts.

Enjoy your taycan, it’s a great car

Experience with the car is completely irrelevant to watch a youtube video and point out what someone says in it. Notice I did not express my opinion in comment you replied to, only that the reviewer hated it. I wasn't even the one who linked that video review.

 

[lowtek]

The only problem I have with my Plaid is that for some reason I can only see the front of Taycans, have yet to see the back of one

 

[David29]

Of course, people will adapt to the Yoke. For those that buy the car, they will have no choice but to adapt to it. Aside from visibility being better, when you're going straight only, I simply can't find a reason why it's "better" than having a full steering wheel. I've never once thought about visibility of the screen being an issue in my current S. To its credit, I guess it will force people to drive with two hands on the wheel a lot of times, which could be safer in that particular respect.

While many will say they've gotten used to it and accept, I simply don't believe that any near a majority will prefer it over a full wheel. I would venture to say that a majority of drivers drive one handed with a large number of drivers simply resting their arm / hand on top of the wheel (count me as one of them). It's simply where I'm most comfortable driving. I've tried to drive my car as if the top wasn't there and for me, simply just uncomfortable. This just my take. But, maybe forcing people to use two hands more often will prove to be more beneficial???

On another note, I miss the days when Tesla offered configuration options. For my 2015, I was able to choose the items I wanted and not have to pay for the items I didn't want. I was also able to configure the colors of the interior the way I wanted them. I loved my dark headliner with light seats and no wood. While my Raven is an amazing car, I loved my 2015 interior configuration so much more. Never been a fan of wood in a car. I loved the panoramic sunroof I had in my 2015 that could open up. I had no need for the upgraded sound system and was able to save that money. For a car in this price range, I want options to make it the way I want it. Tesla used to offer. Most other manufacturers still do offer that capability. The lack of choices simply adds another element as to why, especially with the now increased pricing, won't buy another one. I use my car for work and spent A LOT of time in it. I want an interior that I love, not one that I've had to settle for while paying $140,000+ for it. I understand Tesla took away the choices to simplify and reduce costs and maybe that's fine for the cheaper Model 3 and Model Y, but for the flagship model in their line up that's more than double the price, saving a few bucks just isn't worth it. I believe most buyers that would purchase a car in this price range would gladly pay a few extra dollars to get what they want rather than have to settle for something less.

The biggest theme with Tesla that comes up over and over and over again is that "you'll get used to it". That simply means you'll accept something inferior or settle for something inferior. Again, for me personally, at this price point, I don't want to have to "settle". Unfortunately as time goes on, there are more and more items that we have to "settle" on. One or two things, ok, but, the "settle" list has grown too large for me. Tesla cars have many AMAZING features, many of which make "settling" worth it. I've loved my past cars and was happy to settle in not getting things I would have preferred due to getting the things it does have. The positives outweighed the negatives. With the new Model S, for me and my personal needs and preferences, at this point, sadly, the positive list no longer outweighs the "settle" list.

I also have a 2015 model S and feel much the same way. It is beyond me that tesla cannot manage to manufacture a car with a decent list of options.

 

[David29]

I found that the German brands are great as long as the car is under the warranty period. YMMV.

As a mild counter-point to that, I had Mercedes Benz cars for more than 40 years, before I had my Tesla. All of the MBs I owned were used cars because I could not afford a new one for most of that time, and only once or maybe twice did I get a short-term used-car warranty. I used authorized dealers for service in the beginning and occasionally over the years, but eventually found third-party service places that offered better value. What made that approach possible is that MB sold parts wholesale to other dealers and mechanics, and sold the service information (or it was available from other third parties). Plus many parts were also available from independent suppliers. In other words, the after-market ecosystem was strong for MBs, and probably remains so today. (I do understand that the repair information (aka service manuals) have been more difficult and more expensive to obtain in recent years, for many car brands.)
What is lacking for Tesla is that same strong after-market service and parts ecosystem. If it existed, the ownership of used cars after the warranty expires would definitely be more feasible and more economical.
On that note, I have been very curious about the Bosch service center that You-Tuber Bjorn Nyland often uses. They appear to be quite capable and to have access to parts, and Bjorn says that they are often less expensive than the Tesla service centers. Bjorn does not mention any problem with Bosch getting the Tesla parts and service info, So why is that an issue in the US, as I have read? Perhaps it is a result of EU regulations. And maybe the one place that Bjorn uses is not representative. In any case, I think Tesla cars can be, or could be, quite reasonable as post-warranty cars if the after-market business were stronger.
Here is one of several videos from Bjorn with his after-market service experience.

 

[Darren Donovan]

Completely agree with OP. Fortunate not to have any significant issues with my 2015, but will not be looking at another Tesla when replacement time comes if the current situation does not change. No question that Tesla is tops when it comes to acceleration, range, and charging network, but for many people those are not the highest priority items anymore. If I want an EV with 0-60 times in the 4s with 250 miles of range, there are a handful to choose from with more on the way.

My "next EV" checklist has evolved to include better build quality inside and out, a more luxurious interior, excellent customer service with a phone number I can call, an easy to use dash/console interface that is not overly screen dependent, and a round steering wheel with turn signal stalks.

0-60 times are vastly overrated. Gets boring after a couple times.
Per your checklist, the Lyriq seems like a good fit. At least on paper and in early photos.

 

[EVMeister]

0-60 times are vastly overrated. Gets boring after a couple times.

Speak for yourself.

 

[kizamybute']

Speak for yourself.

0-60 times are vastly overrated. Gets boring after a couple times.
Per your checklist, the Lyriq seems like a good fit. At least on paper and in early photos.

Certainly there are many that love the acceleration and for those in which acceleration is at or near the top of their must have list, Tesla is by far the best option. But, for the vast majority of the driving public, being able to accelerate to 60 MPH quicker than 4 seconds is not even on their list. Tesla doesn't advertise in a conventional manner, however, they get far more free advertising from articles written about its capabilities. Many of which are incorporated just for that reason, which is very smart of Tesla.

 

[jebinc]

Certainly there are many that love the acceleration and for those in which acceleration is at or near the top of their must have list, Tesla is by far the best option. But, for the vast majority of the driving public, being able to accelerate to 60 MPH quicker than 4 seconds is not even on their list. Tesla doesn't advertise in a conventional manner, however, they get far more free advertising from articles written about its capabilities. Many of which are incorporated just for that reason, which is very smart of Tesla.

I just like that instant "traffic insertion" aspect of the car's acceleration ==> Point and Shoot, as they say! Makes merging, passing or rapid insertion into higher speed left/HOA lanes a dream.

 

[kizamybute']

I just like that instant "traffic insertion" aspect of the car's acceleration ==> Point and Shoot, as they say! Makes merging, passing or rapid insertion into higher speed left/HOA lanes a dream.

I agree, I love it as well. My car is a slow poke at just 3.8 0-60 (LOL), but yes, I love the instant torque. At 1/4 throttle, I'm generally 10 car lengths ahead at take off from every traffic light. Not because I'm racing, but just because that's the way it is with EV's. I love it as well and agree whole heartedly. However, I never come close to using even the 3.8 0-60 capability I have. So for someone like me, who has maybe "floored it" 2-3 times since I bought it, having the ability to go 0-60 MPH in 1.9 seconds for $45,000 more dollars just doesn't rank on my list. I had a 2015 P90D. The only time I ever used it in that car was to show off to passengers who had never felt a car that could accelerate that quickly. Was a party trick that I never used in my every day driving. And back then, it was only a 3.0 second 0-60. That's why I "downgraded" to the Long Range this time around. But have never once felt like I'm missing something with my 3.8 second car. It's all a matter of preference for each particular buyer. Back when I was in my teens or 20's, I absolutely would have loved to have it. Back then, I was more than excited with my Camaro that covered 0-60 in about 6 or 7 seconds!!! Nowadays, even the cheapest econo cars are faster than that! My how times have changed!

 

[wdolson]

Doug DeMuro was generally very positive about the Model S Plaid. But he did point out build issues on the car he reviewed.

 

[headcase]

Based on my experience yesterday, I am cautiously optimistic that Tesla is trying to improve build quality this time around with the refresh S. But I'm as much of skeptic as the next guy until I see a long running trend. Time will tell.

 

[whitex]

Of course, people will adapt to the Yoke. For those that buy the car, they will have no choice but to adapt to it. Aside from visibility being better, when you're going straight only, I simply can't find a reason why it's "better" than having a full steering wheel. I've never once thought about visibility of the screen being an issue in my current S. To its credit, I guess it will force people to drive with two hands on the wheel a lot of times, which could be safer in that particular respect.

While many will say they've gotten used to it and accept, I simply don't believe that any near a majority will prefer it over a full wheel. I would venture to say that a majority of drivers drive one handed with a large number of drivers simply resting their arm / hand on top of the wheel (count me as one of them). It's simply where I'm most comfortable driving. I've tried to drive my car as if the top wasn't there and for me, simply just uncomfortable. This just my take. But, maybe forcing people to use two hands more often will prove to be more beneficial???

On another note, I miss the days when Tesla offered configuration options. For my 2015, I was able to choose the items I wanted and not have to pay for the items I didn't want. I was also able to configure the colors of the interior the way I wanted them. I loved my dark headliner with light seats and no wood. While my Raven is an amazing car, I loved my 2015 interior configuration so much more. Never been a fan of wood in a car. I loved the panoramic sunroof I had in my 2015 that could open up. I had no need for the upgraded sound system and was able to save that money. For a car in this price range, I want options to make it the way I want it. Tesla used to offer. Most other manufacturers still do offer that capability. The lack of choices simply adds another element as to why, especially with the now increased pricing, won't buy another one. I use my car for work and spent A LOT of time in it. I want an interior that I love, not one that I've had to settle for while paying $140,000+ for it. I understand Tesla took away the choices to simplify and reduce costs and maybe that's fine for the cheaper Model 3 and Model Y, but for the flagship model in their line up that's more than double the price, saving a few bucks just isn't worth it. I believe most buyers that would purchase a car in this price range would gladly pay a few extra dollars to get what they want rather than have to settle for something less.

The biggest theme with Tesla that comes up over and over and over again is that "you'll get used to it". That simply means you'll accept something inferior or settle for something inferior. Again, for me personally, at this price point, I don't want to have to "settle". Unfortunately as time goes on, there are more and more items that we have to "settle" on. One or two things, ok, but, the "settle" list has grown too large for me. Tesla cars have many AMAZING features, many of which make "settling" worth it. I've loved my past cars and was happy to settle in not getting things I would have preferred due to getting the things it does have. The positives outweighed the negatives. With the new Model S, for me and my personal needs and preferences, at this point, sadly, the positive list no longer outweighs the "settle" list.

If you want choices and a similar car starting at slightly similar price points (but the choices you make could add more), go with a Taycan. Starts at $75K after federal rebate, but you can customize more than Tesla ever offered. From custom interior options, to custom color (they will even pain to match a sample you provide if you want), to high tech options such as rear wheel steering (smaller turn diameter) or active stabilization (keeps the car flat through turns), or HUD display, or surround 360 view of your car and its surroundings. Drawbacks? Sure. It takes some time to wade through all the options and deciding what you want, and sometimes you realize you want 20K+ worth of add-ons, but you an scale back, especially if you only care about customized interior. I do see people on Porsche forums agonizing what options to choose before the build lock date, so you could call it a drawback. Spoiler alert - no, even the top tier loaded Taycan Turbo S today will not beat a Model S Plaid in a straight line, but it easily beats the Model S Raven Performance, and I suspect it will beat a Plaid on a curvy course too. Oh, and no fart mode option, no vaporware (future options you pay for now and wait for them to show up), nor Netflix or games, if any of those are that's important to you. Wait, I forgot, no yoke but instead a choice of different steering wheels, depending on your preference.

 

[whitex]

The chrome handles are a pain in the a living here in South Florida. Sitting in the sun, the handles get really hot to the touch. Build quality does not compare to Mercedes or BMW for the same price range. I have had all of them and I must say that the build quality is far superior on German cars than my Tesla. They cut too many corners to save weight, but I guess you are paying for the battery and tech. Once Mercedes and BMW figure out how to develop long range batteries and design an electric car for each of their models, Tesla will probably fizzle. Image an S Class or 7 Series with a 500 mile range for around the same price as the Tesla. I would go back to German if this ever happens.

There is an S class EV coming to the USA this year (already available in Europe), the EQS. Very similar to the Model S, but instead of Plaid level performance they go for luxury features, including high tech stuff. If an EQS shows up in the US before my Taycan order locks in, I might consider it despite its 4s 0-60, but will have test drive it see in in person to decide.

 

[kizamybute']

For those not racing on a race track on a regular basis, any car that accelerates from 0-60 in 3.0 seconds or less will be one hell of a "WOW" experience. Yes, the Plaid's acceleration is out of this world. But, for those looking for a very fast car that are not concerned with it having the title of "quickest accelerating car", the Taycan or Audi GT will give you the same "wow" factor and satisfaction from it's amazing performance. Heck, even the new Rivian Truck and 9,000 LB Hummer will accelerate to 60 in 3.0 seconds!! Which is faster than the original P90D that Tesla offered, which at the time, there were countless reaction videos on YouTube of peoples shock at how quick that car was. Hence, the point, that for most, accelerating to 60 in 3 seconds or less will be an amazing experience, whether it’s in 2.5 seconds or 2.2 seconds.

And, as far has the headache of having to decide which options are available, it's a one-time headache to create the masterpiece you want to your own preferences and specifications. Gladly worth the one time decision making to create something unique and that is your own when dealing with a car in this price range. Rather than just being in a car that looks EXACTLY the same as the $45,000 cheaper Long Range option, one that accelerates to 60 in 3.1 seconds. It also has "Insane mode" with the same acceleration as the original P85D / P90D. Still will snap your head back, send your phone flying from the front to the rear and take your breath away. Same type of experience, in an identical appearing car for $45,000 less. You can take that money and go buy a Model 3, or send your kids to college!! LOL And the LR has more range too. In my opinion, they made the new LR version just too good now to warrant the $45,000 upgrade, for anyone other than those going to the race track.

 

[BigNick]

There is an S class EV coming to the USA this year (already available in Europe), the EQS. Very similar to the Model S, but instead of Plaid level performance they go for luxury features, including high tech stuff. If an EQS shows up in the US before my Taycan order locks in, I might consider it despite its 4s 0-60, but will have test drive it see in in person to decide.

Four seconds flat 0-60 is still very quick and if luxury is a priority, the EQS might be a good fit.

I like the upcoming 2024(?) Cadillac Celestiq sedan but unfortunately it will have a Celestial price, exceeding Plaid by a Model 3 or two, and more in line with the new Roadster.

 

[TessP100D]

I agree, I love it as well. My car is a slow poke at just 3.8 0-60 (LOL), but yes, I love the instant torque. At 1/4 throttle, I'm generally 10 car lengths ahead at take off from every traffic light. Not because I'm racing, but just because that's the way it is with EV's. I love it as well and agree whole heartedly. However, I never come close to using even the 3.8 0-60 capability I have. So for someone like me, who has maybe "floored it" 2-3 times since I bought it, having the ability to go 0-60 MPH in 1.9 seconds for $45,000 more dollars just doesn't rank on my list. I had a 2015 P90D. The only time I ever used it in that car was to show off to passengers who had never felt a car that could accelerate that quickly. Was a party trick that I never used in my every day driving. And back then, it was only a 3.0 second 0-60. That's why I "downgraded" to the Long Range this time around. But have never once felt like I'm missing something with my 3.8 second car. It's all a matter of preference for each particular buyer. Back when I was in my teens or 20's, I absolutely would have loved to have it. Back then, I was more than excited with my Camaro that covered 0-60 in about 6 or 7 seconds!!! Nowadays, even the cheapest econo cars are faster than that! My how times have changed!

Quick? Imagine how I feel. 2017 MS P100D Is a rocket ship. Only juts now topped by the plaid. Of course the plaid is off the fable because of the stupid yoke. So there you go.

 

[manitou820]

Hopefully as Model 3/Y production moves out of Fremont, they will add more customization to the S and X. If not, Tesla needs to work with a third party to produce bespoke cars. I know Unplugged Performance is trying to do this, but their costs are way too high. Their Model S Apex with lots of customizations is $235k.

They could sell rolling chassis and allow third parties to customize the interior, paint, and wheels.