Model 3 SR+ LFP Battery Range, Degradation, etc Discussion

[pipp]

Hi guys, I just picked up a RWD M3 yesterday, and am just trying to make sense of the best practices for charging given my current living situation. Living in an apartment complex, there are outlets in the garage. I drive less than 15 miles each day. With that information, I should be able to charge at night on the 110 to keep it topped off almost every day, and I would be confident to get it to 100% over the weekend. There are super chargers very close by, however.

So my question is should I go with this plan of 110V charging primarily, and use the SC only when necessary, or can I use the SC maybe once a week to get to 100% and be done with it that way? I don’t know if using the 110V every day (and not getting to 100%) will mess up the battery, or if NOT charging during the week and just charging at the Superchargers once a week to 100% is better?? Thanks in advance.

I rarely charge to 100% any more. I charge to 55%. (though, when I was using 110 volts the first 3 months I had the car I was charging to 100%). I am reasonably confident that my battery is not negatively impacted by this. The only question for me is if the battery management system is thrown off when it calculates what mileage range my car has left in the battery. Yesterday at 55% it calculated my range to be 132. 132 is 55% of 240, which is 13 miles less than when I originally bought the car 1.5 years ago. I wish the range still calculated at 253 (or, at 55%, 139.5), but as it is I think the range loss (roughly 5% in 1.5 years) is well within normal expectations.

Last July I ran the battery down to about 6 miles of remaining range, no telling how much more I could have gone. But that means to me that I can count on the car to calculate my range correctly to within 6 miles, which to me is close enough for horse shoes and hand grenades, as I almost never use up enough battery to fall below 60 miles of range.

So as far as I am concerned, I’m giving the battery less stress by keeping the charge at 55% or less, and the BMS doesn’t appear to be bothered that much by the fact I don’t charge to 100% once a week. And when I go on trips I’ll go ahead and charge it up to 100%.

So bottom line, don’t bother with the supercharger unless you’re going on a trip.

 

[acaurora]

We live in a condo and I have permission to charge at 120v/8A and I have to report my consumption to Strata Council, who bills us at their billed rate (~$.10 kwh). I get about 1.3% increase in SOC per hour of charge at 8A/120v. I have always charged the car to 100% at every AC charge session, time permitting since purchase. We are now in our vacation house and we charge to 100% daily using a NEMA 6-20 outlet (16A at ~235v). Our car now has just over 17k miles on it and reports 265 miles range at 100% SOC. IMHO, charging to 100% daily using AC charging has no deleterious effects on the battery, and the range loss seems to be entirely due to the age of the battery (March 2022 build). Using SCs weekly to 100% is going to be time consuming and not very cost effective.

I wouldn't worry about regular AC charging and about charging to 100% regularly at your condo, and that's the way to go IMHO.

Thanks for sharing your experience, that seems like the plan I will take then - going to get a 12/3 15 amp extension cord (the garage's only outlets are at the top mounted by the garage door opener...), set the car to 8A, and let it do its thing.

 

[RichAZ/CapeCod]

...
1. Use the 110V to charge whenever I can, which may mean may not get to 100% before unplugging, and use SuperCharger if needed. Charge via 110V to 100% on weekends (I know that I can achieve this given my commute)
...

Just back from a shopping ride (to Costco) in our MY LR. Went from 81% SoC to 50% SoC. Plugged it back in to its usual 120v outlet. 16 hours till back to 80% (next morning). So, yeah, you can use a 120v outlet unless you are a commuter who travels long distances on a daily basis.

Rich

 

[Baluchi]

In your situation, I think I'd set the charge limit to 85% daily and plug into the 110v outlet. Then bump it up to 100% every week or two to keep your BMS calibrated. Use the supercharger only as needed.

Sounds like you don't need to be at 100%, so there's no sense in keeping the battery fully charged too often.

 

[lowercase]

> I charge to 55%. (though, when I was using 110 volts the first 3 months I had the car I was charging to 100%). I am reasonably confident that my battery is not negatively impacted by this. The only question for me is if the battery management system is thrown off when it calculates what mileage range my car has left in the battery.

Yes, the BMS will not be properly calculated. Which is fine, unless you run the battery down to empty, you might be surprised to discover you run out of power before it hits zero.

 

[zero1234]

I did some testing recently and realized my 2022 model 3 RWD LFP cannot heat the battery up before supercharging - 8 months of the year. No matter what the temperature outside, or how long the car has been preconditioning for, it maxes out internally at around 20° C instead of 40° C which is what it needs (these are battery temps not cabin/outdoor temps) On days when its -30 i get the same internal temps from warming for 10 minutes than days when its 0° outside and the battery has been preconditioning for 4 hours. Tesla says there is no problem with the car, and acknowledges I cannot reach higher than 60kw . Can someone help me here? No one in my area is experiencing this with their model 3’s.

 

[Jboll]

Hello,
I search the LFP 55kWh degradation graph with the car aging axis and not mileage (battery range vs age). Have anyone seen this graph ?

If LFP degradation is mainly calendar it will be nice to trace it

 

[Randy-12]

I did some testing recently and realized my 2022 model 3 RWD LFP cannot heat the battery up before supercharging - 8 months of the year. No matter what the temperature outside, or how long the car has been preconditioning for, it maxes out internally at around 20° C instead of 40° C which is what it needs (these are battery temps not cabin/outdoor temps) On days when its -30 i get the same internal temps from warming for 10 minutes than days when its 0° outside and the battery has been preconditioning for 4 hours. Tesla says there is no problem with the car, and acknowledges I cannot reach higher than 60kw . Can someone help me here? No one in my area is experiencing this with their model 3’s.

Have you tried using a 3rd party app to verify your findings? If so make a service request with Tesla and share those findings with them.

 

[Niroc]

After about a year, my 2022 RWD with LFP battery now shows 265 rated miles when charged to 100%. This is 2.6% lower than the 272 rated miles at 100% when new.

Car has about 14,000 miles. Mostly charge to between 65% and 70%, but charge to 100% approximately once per week, generally when the next day is expected to use more than 30%.

To give this perspective, I had a 2019 M3 SR+ with NCA battery. After 18,000 miles I went from 240 to 218. I always babied that battery. That is why I am excited about getting an LFP and not worry as much about the 25-80% rule

 

[KenC]

Hello,
I search the LFP 55kWh degradation graph with the car aging axis and not mileage (battery range vs age). Have anyone seen this graph ?

If LFP degradation is mainly calendar it will be nice to trace it

Degradation Shows two charts, though I don't know what the difference is. I would have guessed the first was a subset of the second graph; but it actually looks the opposite, the 2nd seems to be a subset of the first.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Degradation Shows two charts, though I don't know what the difference is. I would have guessed the first was a subset of the second graph; but it actually looks the opposite, the 2nd seems to be a subset of the first.
View attachment 909033
View attachment 909034

These curves are really a mess! Why is there a best fit line when there should be three best fit lines?

 

[Jboll]

Degradation Shows two charts, though I don't know what the difference is. I would have guessed the first was a subset of the second graph; but it actually looks the opposite, the 2nd seems to be a subset of the first.
View attachment 909033
View attachment 909034

Thanks for the graphs but they have both odometer on horizontal axis, i search the same graph but with car age (in months) instead of km

 

[TSLM3CAN]

I m at 40,000km 25,000 miles in about 1 year. 100% Range at 425km 264miles;
M3 LFP battery.
Looks like degradation more with calander aging.

 

[Krisja]

I am at 28,000km (17,400 miles)
New car started at 424 km or 263 miles
Now at 408 km or 253 miles

Results in a degradation of 3.77%

 

[ramanv]

I have a 2020 M3SR+. When I looked at the energy app I see this.

Average: 186 Wh/mi
Projected: 213 miles.

Does this mean my battery has degraded by 25%? If so how can I improve?

Thanks

 

[vsg055]

Update: I am now at 31000 KM with around 9 months of ownership. Tesla Model 3 2022 RWD/LFP. Range when I bought the car -438Km. Now it shows 427km with 100% charge. I charge at home with nema 14-50. Have done a bunch of road trips (Around 12k supercharging kms out of 31k)

 

[lowercase]

Update: I am now at 31000 KM with around 9 months of ownership. Tesla Model 3 2022 RWD/LFP. Range when I bought the car -438Km. Now it shows 427km with 100% charge. I charge at home with nema 14-50. Have done a bunch of road trips (Around 12k supercharging kms out of 31k)

That's pretty good, I'm at 10 months of ownership, only 8500km, and my estimated max range is 426. I charge at home with 110V and rarely charge to full or supercharge.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

That's pretty good, I'm at 10 months of ownership, only 8500km, and my estimated max range is 426. I charge at home with 110V and rarely charge to full or supercharge.

These LFPs are doing way better than the NCAs. It was not uncommon for a 400km vehicle to be below 340km after less than a year.

 

[Randy-12]

I also am at 10 months. I also charge over 95% of the time at home on 110V the rest is either L2 or Supercharger.
I always change to 100% at home.
Car is now at 426 KM's which makes it about a 2.7% off from when new.

Car is inside at night but outdoors all day (± 12-15 hours) so the battery does get cold soaked.
Temps from last year are anywhere from +30°C to -35°C. The last 3-1/2 months the car has not seen any + temps
Don't known how much the temps factor into the battery life...well except for piss pour range in the cold.

 

[AAKEE]

These LFPs are doing way better than the NCAs. It was not uncommon for a 400km vehicle to be below 340km after less than a year.

One thing that is possible is that Tesla/the BMS has harder to measure the capacity as the SOC is hard to read exact on LFP. The BMS get the safe point at each full charge, but all other datapoints is less exact. Might have a impact on the usual way of calculating the capacity.
It would be very interresting to see a 100-0% drive on a LFP car that is 1 year old or more (The total ODO is not important here).

It could give us very usefull data about how the LFP-s really degrade.