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Multi-Rider Doubles MPG: How would you make the 3 shell attract extra riders?

Discussion in 'Model 3' started by 22522, Jun 14, 2016.

  1. 22522

    22522 Member

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    #1 22522, Jun 14, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2016
    I have learned that Tesla owners care about the environment, and are better at math than some. Also reflected that the 3 is about as good as it gets from a drag/range perspective with coherent seating arrangements. This thread is to explore what derivatives of the 3 interior could be made to get 3 in the car,7 to make the energy intensity of a commute in a Model 3 better than any known form of mass transit.

    This spreadsheet shows energy intensity by mode: http://cta.ornl.gov/data/tedb34/Spreadsheets/Table2_14.xls
    Load factor is key (the load column says 1.6 for cars). A full car that parks at work, then drives home full as well, would be multiples better than any of the averages shown here.
    image.png
    I think people will ride in the same car day after day if one creates a Roseto effect experience - that means no yelling.
    Roseto effect - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    But all cars today require all passengers to yell if all other passengers are to hear. To be heard at 4 feet in a normal speaking voice, the background noise needs to be 53dB. All modern cars are over 60 dB at 70 mph.
    image.jpeg

    I see two ways to improve the model 3 for peer seated multi rider commutes: make it quieter than any vehicle known to mankind, or seat the second row facing backwards.

    What ways does this community see?
     
  2. Tiberius

    Tiberius Member

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    [​IMG]
     
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  3. JeffK

    JeffK Active Member

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    I'm not sure I understand the question.. The Model 3 will seat five and all the seats face forward. Did you have a question about that?
     
  4. cronosx

    cronosx Member

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    He states that if you flip the rear seats you can talk more freely
     
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  5. 22522

    22522 Member

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    Sure, people rarely commute with more than 2 to a vehicle. For some reason it is difficult to fill the rear seats on that commute. It does not happen. Even if the logistics work, the experience is too passive, or second class, or something. Maybe the rear seats are too excluded, left out, from conversations in the front?

    What would have to happen to the Model 3 to change that statistic? Use the overhead glass as a media display screen and let the seats recline - so commute time does not count as sitting?

    I am asking because I don't know the answer? [But I think no yelling acoustics 53dB would help.]
     
  6. JeffK

    JeffK Active Member

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    My ears face forward so if I was in a rear seat facing backwards I don't know that I'd actually hear the front seat better. Second, what if I'm driving children who should be seen and not heard. Won't they be a distraction to the driver who should be better focused on the road?

    I'd assume for even smaller children rear facing car seats would need to face forward in the seat while still facing the rear of the car.

    How do people complain about the driver's poor driving skills from the backseat if they can't see the road?

    With rear facing seats and the acceleration of a Tesla, won't the rear passengers be launched uncomfortably against the seat belt?

    If conversations are of such great concern, can you achieve this more inexpensively with microphones in the front that output to the rear speakers and similarly in the back to the front?
     
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  7. 22522

    22522 Member

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    Maybe just the middle rear seat faces backwards? Make it a rear center console that slides forward, sort of between the two front seats. With the fold up hinge on the front edge.
     
  8. JeffK

    JeffK Active Member

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    #8 JeffK, Jun 14, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2016
    So then it costs more because the rear seat isn't one large piece and you have a strange open space in front of the trunk between the two rear seats? I'm not sure that would work (actually I'm positive there's not enough space to do that) but it would definitely make manufacturing more complex.

    What's far more likely is if autonomous cars become super reliable then something like the mercedes concept would be more of a reality with the four seats facing each other.

    [​IMG]

    You'd still need a social and psychological shift in the public. Even if fully autonomous cars were out tomorrow, it'd be five to ten years before people might be totally comfortable turning their backs to the road.
     
  9. Tiberius

    Tiberius Member

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  10. MiamiNole

    MiamiNole Member

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    I think they should just flip the driver and front passenger seats and have all the passengers facing each other. Car rides these days are too impersonal anyways. Sitting face to face will allow meaningful discussions and interactions to happen. Let's bring the human back into our driving experience. Oh, what's that? How will they drive the car? Autopilot of course!
     
  11. FirstSea

    FirstSea Member

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    Perhaps the ideal would be with the rear seats facing backwards, yet I highly doubt that would become popular in the west. Such a design would work in a limousine, but in a sedan it would only alienate the rear passengers; I would never ride in such a car I would feel too awkward.

    I have ridden in cars with 1-5 people cramped in the rear seat, the conversation was never broken; sure everyone had to yell to be heard, but it worked. I would say that the best approach would be to make the car quieter or/and add better acoustics inside the car.
     
  12. CarlitoDoc

    CarlitoDoc Member

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    What Da........ +1 on Tiberius.
     
  13. N5329K

    N5329K Member

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    Reclining rear seats would make riding in back a pleasure, not a pain. As in, first choice not oh, OK. Some new cars manage this already. Tesla surely could, too.
    Robin
     
  14. JeffK

    JeffK Active Member

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    Reclining rear seats might make riding other things in the back more pleasurable too. ;)
     
  15. plankeye

    plankeye That Vegan EV Guy

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    Everybody will have their face buried in their phones (including the driver in many cases, unfortunately), so none of this matters.
     
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  16. MiamiNole

    MiamiNole Member

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    He didn't specify what type of "riding" he was talking about...
     
  17. Seir

    Seir Member

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    Just toss on VR goggles and have the choice to face or not face others, play a game instead maybe, problem solved all around.
     
  18. 182RG

    182RG Free The Service Manuals From Tyranny

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    #18 182RG, Jun 14, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2016
    Not all of us.
     
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  19. 22522

    22522 Member

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    Thank you. In the Mercedes arrangement, if the background noise is more than 53 dB they are yelling at each other.

    Attacking noise is likely easier than changing habits and risking weirdness.

    What would it take to make the interior sound level of a model 3 53 dB or less?
     
  20. Chewy3

    Chewy3 If MacGvyer had a beard

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    I have yet to be able to take anything from @22522 seriously...Gotta be some kinda troll but I just don't understand the joke
     
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