It’s unfortunately not a matter of just trying to avoid slow traffic. I just drove home at 1 am, so obviously very light traffic, and the car changed lanes for no apparent reason 6 times within the span of 4 miles. It’s just bizarre and makes me turn off Nav every time. I’m not going to bother trying to give this thing another chance again until at least the next major update to the feature.
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Nav on AP with Auto-Lane Change unusable in current state
- Thread starter vikefan
- Start date
It’s unfortunately not a matter of just trying to avoid slow traffic. I just drove home at 1 am, so obviously very light traffic, and the car changed lanes for no apparent reason 6 times within the span of 4 miles. It’s just bizarre and makes me turn off Nav every time. I’m not going to bother trying to give this thing another chance again until at least the next major update to the feature.
Negative. Driving on Southern California freeways with clear markers. The phantom swerving / braking are known issues that have been reported by many users before, so if you’re not seeing it ever, consider yourself one of the lucky ones
I've noticed some of the same behaviors in Northern California. I'll be driving home in the HOV lane past a lot of traffic in the other lanes, but Navigate on Autopilot keeps asking to change lanes very early (into the slow traffic). It also tries to change me into the slow lane right before a merging onramp, which is another situation I try to avoid.
I haven't turned on auto-lane-change (without confirmation) yet for these reasons.
I haven't turned on auto-lane-change (without confirmation) yet for these reasons.
I have the same symptom on a particular stretch of the I15. Can be in a clear lane, running at the set speed, nothing in front of me, and it decides it would rather be in a blocked up lane to the right. Nowhere near where I am navigating off the highway (like 20miles away). In a center lane, not passing lane.
Cancel the lane change, 1 second later, starts again. Cancel it, starts again. Repeatedly. Indefinitely on that stretch. Experimented, and kept cancelling it every 2-3 seconds for about 2 miles, until I turned NOA off.
Always on the same stretch of 3-4 miles.
However, in general, pretty happy with what it does. Generally let it do its own thing, UNLESS it really is being a problem. It doesn't drive how I drive, but then neither does my wife.
Not tried it on the latest version yet.
Always wondered how it keeps track of which lane it's in relatively, when it's not always possible to see all the other lanes, and avoid getting in the express lanes (not got stickers yet). Perhaps on this particular stretch it loses track of which lane it is in, and want to get out of what it thinks is the HOV/Express lane?
The #1 lane is a passing lane, and people should only be using it to pass. Legally, we're supposed to pass on the left only. If no one is around you, there is no reason for you to be in the lane. Granted, very, very few people in California obey that traffic rule due to traffic and congestion.
I got release 2019.12.1.2 (from memory) while away on biz. Today I used NoA and to my great joy I immediately noticed many of the OP annoying NoA characteristics have smoothed out. Especially the phantom braking and seemingly random lane changing. Still, and though I have 'lane change without verification' selected it makes me torque the steering wheel before changing lanes. Even with constant hand on wheel I've not mastered this feature yet. I hope it's me but at this point, I doubt it.
Uh, this is most certainly not true. There is absolutely no one anywhere who’s ever been on a freeway (again, speaking for California here) who’s ever — EVER — only entered the #1 lane for passing only.
Enginerd
Member
One should absolutely never, under any circumstances, make universal categorical statements. They're always an exaggeration. Every time.
Well, count me as a person that disproves your statement.
If no one is around and you're sitting in the leftmost lane, you're doing something wrong and likely violating the vehicle code in CA as I understand it. If you're sitting in the left lane with well flowing traffic and not passing anyone, you're also likely in violation of the vehicle code. And, if you're sitting in the left lane and forcing traffic to pass you on the right, you're most definitely violating the vehicle code in CA, and doing something even more dangerous than the other aforementioned offenses.
https://www.mwl-law.com/wp-content/...AWS-IN-ALL-50-STATES-CHART-00214408x9EBBF.pdf
I think you, as a non-Californian, should maybe not try to argue about how people in California drive on the freeway with someone who’s lived in Southern California for four decades and driven for over two of them. I know exactly what the lanes are for and I know with 100% certainty that what you’re saying is simply not true here. People are not automatically expected to immediately get out of the #1 lane as soon as they’re not literally passing someone. The left lane IS considered the “fast lane” here, so while it’s expected that SLOW drivers move out of it, there is absolutely zero expectation that drivers who are driving sufficiently fast also move out of the lane. Period. I can tell you with absolute clarity there is no designated “passing only” lane on any freeway in Southern California.
I’ve stated numerous times I’m speaking about California only, so I don’t know about your area, but I’m talking about (Southern, more specifically) California. I don’t know if maybe you think all we have here are two lane highways each way, but in case you didn’t know, when I’m driving on the 5 freeway at midnight traveling from LA to Orange County, I’m on a freeway with 6 lanes in each direction with about 10 cars every 3 miles. It’s a completely stupid experience for me to be essentially the only car on the road with no one in front of me for miles, and for the car to continually beep at me to move out of the lane, especially when it moved me out of the #1 lane into lanes where there are the occasional slow drivers who then simply force me to move right back out again, which is why I want to stay there in the first place until I don’t have to.
What I’m saying here really isn’t/shouldn’t be controversial. Anyone on this board who also drives in California will back me up on this. Are you expected to use the left lane as a passing lane when you’re driving from Ventura to San Francisco and there’s a 4 hour stretch of the 5 freeway where there are only 2 lanes? Yes. Are you expected to also follow this when you’re driving down the 405 near Long Beach where there’s 6 lanes of either fully stacked traffic in all directions (during the day) or no traffic at all (late night)? Of course not.
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The LAW is to keep right, except to pass.
How you - or others - ignore that law (even when with good intentions) doesn’t change the law.
NOA is law abiding. Why wouldn’t it be?
I hear you. Believe me. In traffic jams (which, in SoCal is basically 24x7) we all default to marginally controlled chaos. It’s called survival - and I’m right there in the left lane with you.
But the law is the law - it doesn’t say “Stay right, except to pass, or unless there’s traffic.” So that’s what NOA is programmed for.
You’re right, in that’s not how it’s driven. I totally get it - but if I were coding this thing at Tesla, I’d have to “color within the lines” so to speak too ...
Ok well you can then continue to think that literally every single one of the millions upon millions of drivers in Southern California is “breaking the law” by using the #1 lane as simply another lane literally every single day. If you lived here, you’d know that, but instead you want to rely on a random Wisconsin online legal blog about what’s “generally” the common practice in the US at large.
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And so that you don’t just need to take it from someone who’s driven all over California for 2 decades, this is from Wikipedia on the “passing lane”:
“In California, at least, there is no prohibition against cruising in the left lane. However, similar to the states below, slow traffic must stay right.”
And this is from the CA DMV website (attached a photo for your benefit):
“
Choosing A Lane
Traffic lanes are often referred to by number. The left or “fast” lane is called the “Number 1 Lane.” The lane to the right of the “Number 1 Lane” is called the “Number 2 Lane,” then the “Number 3 Lane,” etc.
Example of numbered traffic lanes
Drive in the lane with the smoothest flow of traffic. If you can choose among three lanes, pick the middle lane for the smoothest driving. To drive faster, pass, or turn left, use the left lane. When you choose to drive slowly, enter or exit traffic on the right, turn right, park, or move off the road, use the right lane. If there are only two lanes in your direction, pick the right lane for the smoothest driving. Do not weave in and out of traffic. Stay in one lane as much as possible.”
“In California, at least, there is no prohibition against cruising in the left lane. However, similar to the states below, slow traffic must stay right.”
And this is from the CA DMV website (attached a photo for your benefit):
“
Choosing A Lane
Traffic lanes are often referred to by number. The left or “fast” lane is called the “Number 1 Lane.” The lane to the right of the “Number 1 Lane” is called the “Number 2 Lane,” then the “Number 3 Lane,” etc.
Example of numbered traffic lanes
Drive in the lane with the smoothest flow of traffic. If you can choose among three lanes, pick the middle lane for the smoothest driving. To drive faster, pass, or turn left, use the left lane. When you choose to drive slowly, enter or exit traffic on the right, turn right, park, or move off the road, use the right lane. If there are only two lanes in your direction, pick the right lane for the smoothest driving. Do not weave in and out of traffic. Stay in one lane as much as possible.”
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SammichLover
Banned
This is what I've found, too. I manual my "Mad Max" for now, including using the accelerator to move ahead a bit to line up the spot I see as a good place to go. Some times I don't even have to manual signal, Nav gets that the spot is there and does it's thing without me. Depends on how much time I've got left to get over if I feel I can wait for Nav to figure it out.
It is improving, I had given up on the original NoAP release and set it aside. I think the current version doesn't yet bring much value for me but at least I am ok with it being on. I expect the "adds value" to be further down the line, for me.
Now that I’ve been forced to copy and paste the CA DMV guidance on what the proper use of lanes is in California (which is super relevant and on topic for everyone else here I’m sure...), can we please return back to the actual point of this post?
Yeah I did try the lower settings as well, but I started noticing the opposite problem...the car would often keep me sitting behind a much slower vehicle even when there was opportunity to pass. Even when it does correctly trigger to pass, I’ve noticed that it doesn’t do this fast enough on approach to a slower vehicle to properly avoid having to slow down first.
The blog cites the relevant vehicle code in each state for the laws that pertain to "drive right, pass left." Makes them easily searchable.
I hear you when it comes to heavy traffic. A little 5 lane freeway stop and go is part of my daily commute. But, Autopilot has been programmed to obey the law. That means staying out of the #1 lane in well flowing traffic conditions (even includes an empty freeway/highway) except to pass, because it allows for faster (than you) moving traffic to safely pass on the left. Autopilot is doing the safe and legal thing.
And, born and raised Californian here.
And so that you don’t just need to take it from someone who’s driven all over California for 2 decades, this is from Wikipedia on the “passing lane”:
“In California, at least, there is no prohibition against cruising in the left lane. However, similar to the states below, slow traffic must stay right.”
And this is from the CA DMV website (attached a photo for your benefit):
“
Choosing A Lane
Traffic lanes are often referred to by number. The left or “fast” lane is called the “Number 1 Lane.” The lane to the right of the “Number 1 Lane” is called the “Number 2 Lane,” then the “Number 3 Lane,” etc.
Example of numbered traffic lanes
Drive in the lane with the smoothest flow of traffic. If you can choose among three lanes, pick the middle lane for the smoothest driving. To drive faster, pass, or turn left, use the left lane. When you choose to drive slowly, enter or exit traffic on the right, turn right, park, or move off the road, use the right lane. If there are only two lanes in your direction, pick the right lane for the smoothest driving. Do not weave in and out of traffic. Stay in one lane as much as possible.”
Pretty pictures.
http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/f...ivision=11.&title=&part=&chapter=3.&article=1.
California code, Division 11, Chapter 3, Article 1 states:
"(a) Notwithstanding the prima facie speed limits, any vehicle proceeding upon a highway at a speed less than the normal speed of traffic moving in the same direction at such time shall be driven in the right-hand lane for traffic or as close as practicable to the right-hand edge or curb, except when overtaking and passing another vehicle proceeding in the same direction or when preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway."
So, stay right except to pass.
I'm not saying nobody does (or even shouldn't) drive in the left lane, especially in that awful Socal traffic, but the law as written is to stay to the right, and that's what NOA is pushing you towards. That's all I'm trying to say.
Pretty pictures.
http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/f...ivision=11.&title=&part=&chapter=3.&article=1.
California code, Division 11, Chapter 3, Article 1 states:
"(a) Notwithstanding the prima facie speed limits, any vehicle proceeding upon a highway at a speed less than the normal speed of traffic moving in the same direction at such time shall be driven in the right-hand lane for traffic or as close as practicable to the right-hand edge or curb, except when overtaking and passing another vehicle proceeding in the same direction or when preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway."
So, stay right except to pass.
I'm not saying nobody does (or even shouldn't) drive in the left lane, especially in that awful Socal traffic, but the law as written is to stay to the right, and that's what NOA is pushing you towards. That's all I'm trying to say.
Ty for quoting a bit that literally says to move over if traveling “AT A SPEED LESS THAN THE NORMAL SPEED OF TRAFFIC.”
Nowhere does that imply the lane is a passing lane only. What’s wrong with you?
Before you started this ridiculous argument, I said I was traveling at 80 mph in the #1 lane late at night with extremely light traffic. Therefore, I was not traveling at a speed LESS THAN the normal speed of traffic, and per your own freaking citation, I shouldn’t be told by my car to constantly get out of the lane. How many more ways can this be said?
