-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
NEMA 14-50 adapter no longer included with vehicles
- Thread starter electricjed
- Start date
Please not you said "outlets have exposed pins". Try and write what you mean this is a technical subject not a guessing game.
1) Nothing to do with an EVSE
2)Wrong, it adds multiple protections you do not understand
3) Like any industry and like the advent of the EVSE
4)Wrong. It has multiple fail safes a standard outlet does not have, have you read the standard from front to back? Do you understand the function of the relays, ground check, disconnect for arcing? Do you use your toaster outside in the rain? Do you know how many dogs chew EVSE cords and not toaster cords? Are you familiar with the GFCI settings on an EVSE and how they are designed differently than outlets.
5) Who is proposing that? Not me. A 5-15 is the worst possible solution for an EV and supplied only as a backup
How about some more details on your "simple cord" EVSE. Perhaps a drawing of how it is better and its features? I would like to see your circuit free design and its features and benefits listed side by side to a normal EVSE design. Can you do that?
Last edited:
Swampgator
Active Member
The derating is straight from NEMA and NEC. Breaker can only support 80% load. 80% of 50amp is 40 amps.
Tesla further derated it, UMC2 will only pull 32A on a 14-50. Sorry, I meant 31A, but displayed as 32A (shenanigans), what's one more amp? Should just make it 0A, that will be the safest.
The did not derate it the made it a 32A unit which is code for a 40A circuit in the US. There are no "shenanigans", where do you get your 31A rating from?
So if you do that test with the tin foil hat off and and accurate instrument you will get an accurate reading under the correct conditions. The amp level is determined by the pilot signal and is highly accurate but contingent on the cars onboard charger which honors said signal but can go lower. If I had a dollar for ever inaccurate amp reading on an EVSE I could buy a roadster. I suggest you become more qualified at making such readings and get some training before you design your new "simple" EVSE or continue to spread FUD and misinformation.
Maybe the pissing matches could be taken to PM's and certain unnamed individuals could stop crapping all over this thread in a futile "mine-is-bigger-than-yours" contest?
You don't know what I'm talking about. Try and measure the behavior of your car yourself.
Please be specific. Measure what behavior? An amp reading on an EVSE with an inaccurate clamp meter? Or with accurate equipment that shows a granular reading that is within spec of the EVSE? You seem to think Tesla is "derating" the EVSE, this is not true and the wrong term. They are providing a 32A unit that can run on a 14-50 with the 40A circuit exception that intelligently allows more people to have a circuit that will work in their homes for a very reasonable charge speed and cost factor for copper and other components not to mention usability and size. You on the other hand are implying they are "cheating" or being deceptive and for some crazy reason pulling off an amp which makes no logical sense. I have logs and measurements of tens of thousands of EVSE pilot signals and respective amp levels how many have you measured besides yours?
About to go on my ignore list. Gish gallop, just like last time. If you measure inquisitively, you will see.
So what do you want me to measure exactly and what is it you are claiming is wrong or deceptive? If your claim is about a 1A discrepancy then you do not understand why that is happening. Did you measure the pilot signal on your unit as well as the amp level? What make of clamp/meter did you use exactly? What was the SOC of the car at the time of the measurement? How about a picture of the unit being measured with the reading and equipment shown.
1) Not all clamp meters are accurate and often consumers often misread amp levels often
2) A pilot signal can vary slightly in some cases and I see misreads up to 4A all the time
3) 1A difference is more likely an error and is insignificant.
There is nothing wrong with your EVSE and Tesla did nothing to it other than make it to spec which is likely correct enough. Check the LEAF threads for the dozens of thread of misread EVSE amp levels.
Last edited:
Update: I was able to order it from Tesla website today. Earlier, I called up the nearest service center from where I will be picking up my car, but they said they don't have it in stock either.
originally posted on the investment thread
I just checked on the website store : you're right, there is now only the 5-15 adapter included. Sorry for calling false statement.
But, last time I checked : wall connector was 550 CAD$, is now 650$ CAD and mobile connector was 450 $ CAD, is now 275 $ CAD.... The 14-50 adapter is still the same price at 44 $ CAD.
So, while true that the 14-50 adapter is now not included, if you want your mobile connector to be your primary home connector, the total cost is 44 $ (CAD).....
So I see Tesla did this to encourage customer to go for the wall connector because of change in the electrical code requiring CGFI breaker on the 14-50 plug, not to try to save a couple $ on every sales.
I really don't see a problem here.
But thanks Brian for pointing this out, I mean, a thread for a ''missing'' 44$ CAD adapter on a 55 00$ CAD car, really?!
Oh I see now : my model was order on april 4th, the 14-50 was still included.
I just checked on the website store : you're right, there is now only the 5-15 adapter included. Sorry for calling false statement.
But, last time I checked : wall connector was 550 CAD$, is now 650$ CAD and mobile connector was 450 $ CAD, is now 275 $ CAD.... The 14-50 adapter is still the same price at 44 $ CAD.
So, while true that the 14-50 adapter is now not included, if you want your mobile connector to be your primary home connector, the total cost is 44 $ (CAD).....
So I see Tesla did this to encourage customer to go for the wall connector because of change in the electrical code requiring CGFI breaker on the 14-50 plug, not to try to save a couple $ on every sales.
I really don't see a problem here.
But thanks Brian for pointing this out, I mean, a thread for a ''missing'' 44$ CAD adapter on a 55 00$ CAD car, really?!
I was on the fence about this (my primary residence has AFCI breakers on about 10 circuits, and we get about 1 nuisance trip per year, usually from someone yanking the vacuum cleaner power cord out with the motor on while cleaning). But then I bought a weekend place that had been built in the mid 80's and did some renovation. All the wiring was original. I found:
- Wiring to an electric baseboard heater that had been cut to the wrong length, partially stripped (breaking the outer insulation and the insulation on the hot wire), then pushed back behind the heater to hide the mistake when the heater was screwed to the wall.
- Numerous NM cables seriously abraded where they were pulled too aggressively through holes in framing. Some had bare copper exposed on both conductors.
- Uninsulated, twisted-together neutrals in multiple switch boxes - some idiot ran out of wire nuts I guess?
- About a half-dozen remaining old toggle switches "backstabbed" with #14 wire (other switches had been replaced - the only newer work in the house - I assume the backstabs failed, as they do, and the switches became unreliable and got upgraded).
- Many old plastic switch and fixture boxes without integral cable clamps and with cable not secured within 6" of the box
- Tons of loose NM and SER cable run through ceilings, some tight enough to be readily pierced by a screw instead of moving away
- No nail protector plates anywhere
Arc-fault breakers will detect all of these problems. You will then see "nuisance" trips (because the problem is buried in the wall where it's not obvious) that you probably should not ignore...
Suffice to say I'm now a big enough fan of AFCI that I'm considering replacing my panel to get rid of its installed duplex breakers, so I can use them in all the single-pole spaces.
50A GFCI breakers, by the way, are a lot cheaper than they used to be since you can get them packaged with a cheap spa/pool subpanel at the orange or blue store. The whole assembly costs less than the breaker used to and can also serve as a disconnect for your 50A charging outlet.
davewill
Active Member
Interesting on the nuisance trips. My home has AFCI in all the bedrooms and I can't run a vacuum cleaner in them at all. They trip as soon as I turn it on. That three different vacuums over the years. You have to plug in the bathroom or the hallway.
Propensity to nuisance trip seems to vary from brand to brand - I have had good luck with Siemens/Murray and Eaton (Cutler-Hammer), not as good with GE and Square D. Eaton may make a "CL" series AFCI that will work and be legal in other brands of panels, their rep told me a few years ago it was on the way.
I personally find the newer Combination AFCIs ("CAFCI") less prone to nuisance tripping also, but your mileage may vary. Another consideration is that I'm in NYC where nearly all wiring is armored cable or conduit, which may provide some shielding against stray high frequency signals that might also give nuisance trips. And I'm the kind of jerk who follows the electrician around checking neutral and ground continuity and resistance before I make the last payment on the job, which may help too...
For whatever reason, the nuisance trips others seem to see just haven't afflicted me. Maybe it's a Square D thing?
Just waiting for them to make a cost-reduced HPWC, or should I just say WC. Doesn't seem like Tesla will ever again make a car capable of using it's 80A capacity.
It's not really option. The 14-50 is the standard RV plug and the standard 50 amp plug for any businesses that install exterior outlets for EV charging. It's what my company has and still has for ev charging in additon the the J1772 chargers that came later.
This is just a way for Tesla to charge more.
This is just a way for Tesla to charge more.
Similar threads
