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New model S Long Rang no LFP?
- Thread starter Tekathan85
- Start date
GHammer
Dark Star
No, its not odd.
LFP batteries are less energy dense, so require more of them for less range, and much slower off the line. It sounds like you think that LFP somehow = markedly better in all aspects, and thats not the case.
The only model 3s and Ys that come with that battery are the shortest range ones, and in the US even the shortest range Y currently doesnt.
Since LFP doesnt have as much energy, it would actually be strange if Model S came with that battery type, not the other way around.
Thank you for explaining it to me. I actually did have that exact idea. New tech is always better in my mind, but it doesn't seem practical in this case.
ucmndd
Well-Known Member
LFP batteries are all about cost savings, not flagship performance. Less energy density, lower voltage, lower power output capacity.
An LFP battery in a LR Model S would sacrifice about 30% of its range and performance.
LFP batteries are actually old tech. China has been using them in EVs for almost 10 years. Due to patent issues, only China had access to the technology until last year. I think Tesla was the first non Chinese manufacturer to use the tech for lower range, cheaper cars.
As others have pointed out, premium, long range vehicles are going to use NMC cells.
Having said all that, battery cell technology is rapidly evolving and lots of new types of cells, and enhancements to the older chemistry is constantly happening. Rest assured that the Model S has the best technology Tesla has available.
ucmndd
Well-Known Member
All of Tesla’s LFP batteries to date come from CATL, keeping the Chinese dominance/lock-out of the market intact.
Although basically all of the Korean battery industry is well on their way to establishing their own LFP production as well.
You know how you see another miracle battery announcement every month with much fanfare? And you notice how that has been going on for years with usually not much actually getting to production? They sound something like this:
Charges in 5 minutes!!!
Lasts for a billion cycles!!!
Weighs a tenth as much as existing batteries!!!
All of these miracle battery announcements tout only one specific characteristic. This is because battery chemistry and structure choices always involve a balance of tradeoffs. And when something is great in one area, it usually has at least one drastic deficiency in another area that makes it impractical. Maybe it can only work in certain difficult temperature ranges. Or if it charges fast, it has a pathetically low number of use cycles, or the cost is insanely high or it's difficult to manufacture or whatever.
So that's what you've got with this. The NMC type has greater energy density to pack more total range in the car. But it's more expensive and degrades faster with less total cycles.
The LFP is less energy dense, but is cheaper and lasts for more cycles and can be charged fuller most of the time with less degradation.
There are use cases for each type right now.
Charges in 5 minutes!!!
Lasts for a billion cycles!!!
Weighs a tenth as much as existing batteries!!!
All of these miracle battery announcements tout only one specific characteristic. This is because battery chemistry and structure choices always involve a balance of tradeoffs. And when something is great in one area, it usually has at least one drastic deficiency in another area that makes it impractical. Maybe it can only work in certain difficult temperature ranges. Or if it charges fast, it has a pathetically low number of use cycles, or the cost is insanely high or it's difficult to manufacture or whatever.
So that's what you've got with this. The NMC type has greater energy density to pack more total range in the car. But it's more expensive and degrades faster with less total cycles.
The LFP is less energy dense, but is cheaper and lasts for more cycles and can be charged fuller most of the time with less degradation.
There are use cases for each type right now.
I’ve been reading up on battery chemistry. Found this interesting:
www.findmyelectric.com
Tesla Batteries: What Kind of Battery Does My Tesla Have?
What kind of battery does my Tesla have? What type of battery is in a Tesla Model S, 3, X or Y? Find out here!
www.findmyelectric.com
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