New model X and S line up! Cheaper model X!

[brkaus]

What do you guys expect? Tesla only to raise their prices?

The Model X I purchased in December is roughly $5k less now. Good for Tesla if they can sell it for less. I'm happy either way and love the car regardless.

Yup. I expect prices to keep going down for a while. They have repeatedly stated electric cars will eventually attain cost parity with ICE cars. That will not happen by costs going up.

Prices will continue to slowly drop while features are added. Once things are in a groove, prices would act more like traditional cars.

It's just the cycle we are currently in for EV development.

 

[ecarfan]

I just ordered my X a couple
Days ago. A little upset I wasn’t told this could be a possibility. Do the sales folks not know? What are the thoughts on continuing w/ my current build or asking to change?

The Tesla sales people are never told in advance about pricing or configuration changes. I’ve spoken to many of them over the years and they all clearly say something to the effect of “We don’t know until the public knows.”

Degradation should be lower because the battery isn't ever charged to 100%. But I don't expect them to "hide" the degradation only in the locked part and keep the unlocked part at a fixed number of miles. If the battery looses 5% overall, I would expect the unlocked part to drop 5% as well.

At this point, we have no idea if that will be the case. My personal opinion is that Tesla will not create “artificial” battery capacity loss in the new base S/X versions.

If I was buying a new S right now I would buy the base version, given how well developed the Supercharger network is and the fact that I do not live in a climate with truly cold winters. If I was buying an X right now, because I use it for towing, I would buy the Extended Range version, but if I wasn’t towing I would stick with the base version.

 

[ecarfan]

This change by Tesla seems pretty smart to me. It more clearly differentiates the S/X line from the Model 3, slightly lowers the base S/X price point, simplifies production thereby reducing Tesla’s costs, over time provides additional revenue as some S/X owners pay to upgrade their pack capacity, and adds additional revenue when the base version cars are traded in because Tesla can re-sell them as used Extended Range models.

This change also has no impact on Tesla’s 2170 cell production which is likely supply-constrained; every 2170 cell Tesla can produce is needed for Model 3 production and for Powerwall and Powerpack production. For reasons that are unclear to me, Reno Gigafactory expansion appears to be well behind the schedule that Tesla announced over 3 years ago; it’s not even halfway completed and there are no current signs of construction to expand it (have I missed that?). 2170 cells are a very valuable commodity and should not be used in products where they do not offer a competitive advantage.

It seems reasonable to assume that at some point Tesla is going to switch to 2170 cells for the S/X pack, but for now Panasonic seems to be able to supply as many 18650 cells at Tesla needs. And the new S/X base range is enough to beat the meager high-end EV competition that Tesla has to contend with currently: Jaguar i-Pace, Audi e-Tron, and Porsche Taycan (which is many months away from launch). It appears that none of those competitors offer more range than the base S/X, and they aren’t even close to the Extended Range S/X. So why should Tesla switch now to 2170 cells for the S/X pack, a change that would take cells from Model 3 and Tesla Energy products?

 

[jboy210]

I just ordered my X a couple
Days ago. A little upset I wasn’t told this could be a possibility. Do the sales folks not know? What are the thoughts on continuing w/ my current build or asking to change?

You could reorder, but you lose your $2,500 deposit.

 

[ccathcart609]

Would be worth the $500. Nervous they will want to take my $2500 deposit, then it’s more of a thought process if 5500 is worth the 25 miles.

You could reorder, but you lose your $2,500 deposit.

did you confirm this?

 

[ccathcart609]

You should upgrade it. Tesla is desperate for sales right now and will definitely do the right thing. I purchase the 75D last October and have regretted not getting the 100D. With the new price reduction, go big! You will not be sorry. I took my 75D on a road trip over the Christmas holiday from San Francisco to Las Vegas and the supercharging stops really adds up. I was jealous of the Model 3’s.

I actually had ordered the 100D (75 was not an option last week). So basically the difference is $9,000 from the 100 i ordered last week (295 miles) to the new 270 mile model X yesterday.

 

[Pollux]

Interesting. Just priced a max'd 2019 Model S Performance versus my December 2016 Model S P100D with most of the trimmings (I refused to pay for Full Self Driving).

Current max'ed out S Performance: $144K.

Dec 2016: $159,750 => $160K.

Because the new configurator is the Model 3-style configurator without a lot of detail, I can't tell whether the current S Performance has these things that I had in Dec '16:

Ultra high fidelity sound, subzero, premium upgrades package, enhanced autopilot, ludicrous mode, premium seats, 21" cool performance wheels and tires, 315 mile range -- all accounted for in both Dec '16 and Jan '19 configs

All-Wheel Drive -- not mentioned in Jan '19 config but I think it must have it
All-Glass Panoramic Roof -- seemingly pictured, no text to match, but I think it must have it
Red Brake Calipers -- show in picture but not listed in text, so probably part of the Jan '19 config
Black Alcantara Headliner -- not pictured or mentioned in text, I'm guessing it's included in the Jan '19 config
Supercharger enabled -- obviously must be but no discussion of whether charging is free or separately priced (I believe separately priced)

Smart air suspension -- not discussed in the 2019 config, should I assume that it's part of Jan '19 config?
Carbon Fiber Spoiler -- not pictured or mentioned in text, couldn't begin to guess whether it's included in Jan '19... I'm still waiting for the carbon fiber spoiler on my Sep '18 Model 3 Performance

Child seats in the rear -- available as an option in 2016, no longer mentioned
Glossy Obeche Wood Decor -- no longer an option, only the carbon fiber stuff that I dislike
High amperage charger upgrade -- I can charge my 2016 P100D @ 72A, nothing in the 2019 config says what it can charge at
Full Self Driving -- available as an option in Dec '16, no longer available as an option, which is for the best

So it looks to me as if a Jan '19 Model S Performance, max'd out, likely includes almost everything I got in the Dec '16 S P100D config, but at a savings of $16K. Plus maybe two years' improvement in build quality (maybe, just maybe, that's a big maybe).

Nice if you're buying now, not quite as nice if you're wondering what has happened to the resale value of your Dec '16 S P100D.

Alan

P.S. Feels like someone is building in some headroom for new, cool high-end options.

 

[rjdoc74]

Interesting. Just priced a max'd 2019 Model S Performance versus my December 2016 Model S P100D with most of the trimmings (I refused to pay for Full Self Driving).

Current max'ed out S Performance: $144K.

Dec 2016: $159,750 => $160K.

Because the new configurator is the Model 3-style configurator without a lot of detail, I can't tell whether the current S Performance has these things that I had in Dec '16:

Ultra high fidelity sound, subzero, premium upgrades package, enhanced autopilot, ludicrous mode, premium seats, 21" cool performance wheels and tires, 315 mile range -- all accounted for in both Dec '16 and Jan '19 configs

All-Wheel Drive -- not mentioned in Jan '19 config but I think it must have it
All-Glass Panoramic Roof -- seemingly pictured, no text to match, but I think it must have it
Red Brake Calipers -- show in picture but not listed in text, so probably part of the Jan '19 config
Black Alcantara Headliner -- not pictured or mentioned in text, I'm guessing it's included in the Jan '19 config
Supercharger enabled -- obviously must be but no discussion of whether charging is free or separately priced (I believe separately priced)

Smart air suspension -- not discussed in the 2019 config, should I assume that it's part of Jan '19 config?
Carbon Fiber Spoiler -- not pictured or mentioned in text, couldn't begin to guess whether it's included in Jan '19... I'm still waiting for the carbon fiber spoiler on my Sep '18 Model 3 Performance

Child seats in the rear -- available as an option in 2016, no longer mentioned
Glossy Obeche Wood Decor -- no longer an option, only the carbon fiber stuff that I dislike
High amperage charger upgrade -- I can charge my 2016 P100D @ 72A, nothing in the 2019 config says what it can charge at
Full Self Driving -- available as an option in Dec '16, no longer available as an option, which is for the best

So it looks to me as if a Jan '19 Model S Performance, max'd out, likely includes almost everything I got in the Dec '16 S P100D config, but at a savings of $16K. Plus maybe two years' improvement in build quality (maybe, just maybe, that's a big maybe).

Nice if you're buying now, not quite as nice if you're wondering what has happened to the resale value of your Dec '16 S P100D.

Alan

P.S. Feels like someone is building in some headroom for new, cool high-end options.

Subtract $3750 from your difference to account for tax credit reduction.

 

[Pollux]

Subtract $3750 from your difference to account for tax credit reduction.

Yes, I was just comparing list pricing.

If you want to get to net, you've also got to factor in any per-state incentives. Although the Federal credit is likely the dominant one.

A Jan '19 Model S Performance still seems like a relatively good deal to me!

Alan

 

[PrGrPa]

All this is good to hear. Sounds a bit like a SW-locked ~90D for $8,000 less than a 100D. I like the way the USA car configurator works. Much neater than the UK one. I still see the 100D and P100D options here.

 

[Vulcan]

It's still very confusing to adequately compare my 75D LEASED in September. It included PUP, Cream Interior, Midnight Silver Metallic paint and EAP. From my online account, it says the amount I financed was 97,200. I assume my real cost was this plus my 2500 down payment or a total of 99,700. I assume this includes the 6% Florida State Tax and the 1200 Delivery Fee and about $500 in licensing fees and the Fed Tax Credit.
I am trying to figure out what the new 100D base configured the same would be.
Any idea how much the base configured similarly would cost today, including the same Tax, Delivery, licensing, and current Tax credit?

 

[jeffro01]

While I'm happy with my X and it wouldn't have helped me anyways... I would have loved to get my X in the performance version without ludicrous... LOL Such is life...

Jeff

 

[rainforest]

Excuse me if this has been covered before, but what was the base price of the old MX75D, and what is the base price now of the software locked X. Wondering if the price has gone up or down.

 

[electricar]

Including the fact that the tax credit has gone down from $7500 to $3750, it now costs $10,000 more than it did a month ago to buy a car just like mine with the same paint, interior, and options that goes to 60 mph in 0.1 second faster and has 51 miles more range. Judging by what I am reading here it also looks like it costs at least $10,000 less to buy an identical 100D than it did a month ago. It sure looks to me like Tesla has significantly increased the resale value of the used 75D and reduced the resale value of the used 100D. The rest of the automobile industry learned a long time ago that large changes in price for the same car are a mistake due to all the consequences in the used market ( including, of course, lease returns ) and customer satisfaction that this causes. This is just another lesson that Tesla has chosen to learn the hard way. It is reminiscent of the way they learned that " alien dreadnought " factories are a bad idea and that it is better to produce a product of high initial quality than to struggle with high warranty costs and disgruntled customers. I am a stock holder and a car owner and I love most of their business model, but they are in the car business and some things in that business are the way they are for good reason.

 

[rainforest]

Including the fact that the tax credit has gone down from $7500 to $3750, it now costs $10,000 more than it did a month ago to buy a car just like mine with the same paint, interior, and options that goes to 60 mph in 0.1 second faster and has 51 miles more range. Judging by what I am reading here it also looks like it costs at least $10,000 less to buy an identical 100D than it did a month ago. It sure looks to me like Tesla has significantly increased the resale value of the used 75D and reduced the resale value of the used 100D. The rest of the automobile industry learned a long time ago that large changes in price for the same car are a mistake due to all the consequences in the used market ( including, of course, lease returns ) and customer satisfaction that this causes. This is just another lesson that Tesla has chosen to learn the hard way. It is reminiscent of the way they learned that " alien dreadnought " factories are a bad idea and that it is better to produce a product of high initial quality than to struggle with high warranty costs and disgruntled customers. i am a stock holder and a car owner and I love most of their business model, but they are in the car business and some things in that business are the way they are for good reason.

The interesting thing about additional range is that the benefit is only used "on the margin", meaning you only occasionally will use the extra range in exceptional circumstances (for most people who just have regular commutes to and from work). Problem though is that you pay a hefty price for that additional range that isn't regularly used. I have a LR Model 3 as well, but the most range I have ever used was about 200 rated km in a day - just a fraction of the 499km available to use. But in the case of the Model 3, the SR which I normally would have bought was not available.

My X is a software locked 60D, but unlocking the top of the pack seems useless as it charges so slowly and it's best not to charge to 100% anyway. I don't see why people would get the new extended range 100D under normal circumstances.

 

[jboy210]

did you confirm this?

They are pretty tough on the $2,500 deposit. The color combination we ordered was killed 2-3 weeks after we ordered our X. They changes it to a beige wood trim. I thought about cancelling and at least getting carbon fiber instead of the beige wood. but they said I would have to give up the deposit. Luckily I like the changed interior better than the original combination.

But, you should call them as see if you can change.

 

[MXWing]

Ludicrous all software option?

In the past it required hardware but Tesla has got to be making them the same.

Those P100D traded in later is going to do really well if Tesla just unlocks it with L before resell.

 

[SpudLime]

You should upgrade it. Tesla is desperate for sales right now

uhh what? You got a source on that? Or are you trying to add to the FUD?

 

[electricar]

The interesting thing about additional range is that the benefit is only used "on the margin", meaning you only occasionally will use the extra range in exceptional circumstances (for most people who just have regular commutes to and from work). Problem though is that you pay a hefty price for that additional range that isn't regularly used. I have a LR Model 3 as well, but the most range I have ever used was about 200 rated km in a day - just a fraction of the 499km available to use. But in the case of the Model 3, the SR which I normally would have bought was not available.

My X is a software locked 60D, but unlocking the top of the pack seems useless as it charges so slowly and it's best not to charge to 100% anyway. I don't see why people would get the new extended range 100D under normal circumstances.

You make a great points about " on the margin " usage and the lack of availability of a SR Model 3. I think, as ecarfan mentioned earlier, this extended range option is partly so they can convert the car to long range when trade in/lease return time comes. I find this and the additional $8000 to buy the long range version now both cynical on their part and an insult to their customers. After their home, a car is the second most expensive thing most people ever purchase and this Silicon Valley start-up mentality that it doesn't matter how you treat the customers won't work. Sure they need to generate a profit but this is not going to help given the competition from Toyota and the VW group ( who know a thing or two about building and selling cars ) that is just around the corner.

 

[flar]

Because the new configurator is the Model 3-style configurator without a lot of detail, I can't tell whether the current S Performance has these things that I had in Dec '16:

Some of these things are on the main Model S info page (not the order page). You have to click on the "Model S" text at the very top of the front page to get there. But, many of these are actually mentioned right on the ordering pages if you read through them.

All-Wheel Drive -- not mentioned in Jan '19 config but I think it must have it
All-Glass Panoramic Roof -- seemingly pictured, no text to match, but I think it must have it
Black Alcantara Headliner -- not pictured or mentioned in text, I'm guessing it's included in the Jan '19 config
Supercharger enabled -- obviously must be but no discussion of whether charging is free or separately priced (I believe separately priced)
Smart air suspension -- not discussed in the 2019 config, should I assume that it's part of Jan '19 config?

All-Wheel Drive is mentioned on the first ordering page under "Select Your Car" (and in the specs on the info page).

The info page indicates a "standard glass roof". No ordering options would indicate that it is the only config.

Current referral gives only 6 months of supercharging and this program was announced to be going away 2/1. The Model S info page also lists "six months free supercharging with referral" at this time and "Access to Tesla's global Supercharger network" if you click to expand the specs on the info page.

Alcantara not mentioned at all on the info page which lists a lot of detail about convenience and interior features so I'm guessing it is gone, but they also don't mention the seat materials so nothing conclusive there. On the other hand, one of the pictures in the "Built Around the Driver" section of the info page sure looks like Alcantara material on the A pillar.

The quarterly letter released today included a mention that they recently stream-lined S/X options to include air suspension.

Child seats in the rear -- available as an option in 2016, no longer mentioned

Specs list on the info page says "5 adults" under seating. I believe the rear facing seats were deleted a while ago?

Full Self Driving -- available as an option in Dec '16, no longer available as an option, which is for the best

It was quietly removed back in October, but Elon tweeted a response to people asking about it saying that it was causing confusion and they would offer it "off menu for a week". That week is gone, but it couldn't hurt to ask when placing an order.