I knew the Roadster 3.0 battery was almost there, but I wasn't available it was already available in small numbers. Good news for the Roadster world.
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Next gen Roadster
- Thread starter dsm363
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stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
I completely agree with this. I may be reserving a Model 3 today and have no plans to ever get a Roadster, but the Roadster was the EV that got me interested in EVs (and Tesla). Tesla wouldn't be here today (and arguably a good chunk of the modern EV market wouldn't either) without the Roadster.
James Anders
Member
I think the next gen Roadster will come after the M3 and MY (small CUV). It will be before a pickup truck because I suspect it will be based off of the M3 chassis and components.
Hmm... there are reasons to think that Roadster2 can be next after Model3. Issue is simple. Truck/Y/3/S/X - they all need huge investments and enormous development of industrial capacity. Those are mass market. And Tesla is now mostly focused on that, on enlarging their scale. There seems to be so great desire for M3 that "Y" will change nothing, except incereasing waiting times. If you can't produce enough 3s what for hurry with Ys?
While Roadster is different story. This is not mass market car, but has high margins which would help with investments into GFs and Tesla Assembly Lines.
Btw. I can't get rid of this idea in my head: Roadster 2 -> R2 -> since it has dual motors -> R2D -> and since it's so close -> R2D2
Who wanna Tesla R2D2? It can listen to you and drive itself
While Roadster is different story. This is not mass market car, but has high margins which would help with investments into GFs and Tesla Assembly Lines.
Btw. I can't get rid of this idea in my head: Roadster 2 -> R2 -> since it has dual motors -> R2D -> and since it's so close -> R2D2
Who wanna Tesla R2D2? It can listen to you and drive itself
Hmm... there are reasons to think that Roadster2 can be next after Model3. Issue is simple. Truck/Y/3/S/X - they all need huge investments and enormous development of industrial capacity. Those are mass market. And Tesla is now mostly focused on that, on enlarging their scale. There seems to be so great desire for M3 that "Y" will change nothing, except incereasing waiting times. If you can't produce enough 3s what for hurry with Ys?
While Roadster is different story. This is not mass market car, but has high margins which would help with investments into GFs and Tesla Assembly Lines.
Btw. I can't get rid of this idea in my head: Roadster 2 -> R2 -> since it has dual motors -> R2D -> and since it's so close -> R2D2
Who wanna Tesla R2D2? It can listen to you and drive itself
I agree with everything you said except the part about the next gen roadster being high margins. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the first Roadster a high margin car because of Tesla's lack of ability to produce key components in house?? If that's the case, then they should conceivably have most of those problems solved with their ability to make their own chassis, bodies, drive units, PCBs, battery packs, and most importantly and most recently, battery cells. shouldn't this all make the next Roadster much more competitively priced??
A roadster is a low volume car by nature. The Miata is the best selling roadster in history and it averages 37K a year. They have sold 1 million as of this year, but it took 27 years to get there.
The vast majority of the public want a car that will serve most if not all their needs and a roadster is a special purpose vehicle that can usually only carry two people and very little cargo. It's rare that it's the only car a person owns.
A second gen Tesla roadster will probably be a popular car for it's class, but only a fool would expect it to be as good a seller as the Model S or X, even if it was priced closer to the Model 3.
The vast majority of the public want a car that will serve most if not all their needs and a roadster is a special purpose vehicle that can usually only carry two people and very little cargo. It's rare that it's the only car a person owns.
A second gen Tesla roadster will probably be a popular car for it's class, but only a fool would expect it to be as good a seller as the Model S or X, even if it was priced closer to the Model 3.
Blackout
Member
I think Tesla current recipe would be great on a roadster... Having Dual motors and the battery on the bottom side of the car allowing a better weight distribution than anything else out there... They don't even need a 200 mile range car... They can probably do a chassis half carbon fiver half aluminium... Keep it short and light with ludicrous mode that would be Sick... The only thing I would add is the same motor on the back should be to the front and they shouldn't worry too much about the frunk space... No auto pilot too save weight (or maybe...), no bio hazard weapon... just 2 seats a 15in horizontal screen 2 holes for cup holders, same 1 speed transmission on a convertible car that has the option to have a hardtop like the Mercedes SLK or SL... I think that would be a possible 0 to 60 2.5 sec car...
I would call it model R 70D or maybe 50D
I would call it model R 70D or maybe 50D
It needs a 2 speed transmission. We can't have the 2 seat tesla halo car built for performance pull like crap after 90 and a top speed of only 155.
To add another very important thing, it needs much better tires. The tires on the model s are not wide in the slightest nor are they particularly sticky. On the roadster, we need something like the pirelli trofeo r's or the Michelin pilot sport cup 2's and they need to be at least around 275mm in the front and over 300 in the rear maybe around 315-325 so it can take full advantage of the torque. This would greatly help acceleration, braking, and handling.
On the handling front, teslas have a very low center of gravity so that helps but how is the air suspension? Can it be used to as good effect as some of the magnetic ride suspensions used on a lot of the supercars? What about braking? How are the brakes on tesla's cars? They don't have to be quite as big as normal supercars because of regen braking but they still need to be effective.
Blackout
Member
No auto Pilot would save weight...
But having auto Pilot would justify the expensive cost, and wouldn't add that much weight...so maybe add it as an option, but either the car comes with no sensors, or sensors...not like you buy the car with no autopilot but the sensors are there anyway to add the weight...
Maybe was more like maybe as an option...
Blackout
Member
Sorry, I'm not really following? how is a 2 speed transmission help with the top Speed?
You have a good point about speed after 90, which is why I would add the same motor on the back in the front as well more power in the front...
Maybe they can even do a configuration where the front motor is only operating at it's 50% which would be equal to the current setup they have for the model S. and then after 90 mph with the help of Ludicrous have all the current goes to that front motor and back tire at the same time...to add that extra power and increase that speed...
I think that could solve the problem where most fast cars are catching up to the Model S at the quarter mile, or longer...
They don't need to increase the top speed over 155 mph, what they need to master for now is how quick it gets there...
So your driving your car right? Top speed is faster in second gear than in first. That's why you shift. The tesla is limited to 155 because of motor rmp and a 9-to-whatever ratio.
The performance motor in the front would help if it were not for the battery. The P90DL can only actually put out around 530ish hp because that's all the battery can supply. Also that power drops off a you go up in rpm's. A more powerful motor up front would lose power as it gains rpm's just as the smaller one does. So you need a second gear.
You realize a 2.3l inline 4 cylinder mustang can almost go 155 right? 155 is slow for a performance car. it needs to hit AT LEAST 185. But at a car at the price point and the status of the next roadster, i would say 200 should be the mark. Almost every supercar, with the exception of the 2016 viper acr and the C7 corvette z06/7 due to non-active downforce, can hit at least 200.
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Blackout
Member
Several cars are limited to 155mph especially in Europe...I believe most people are interested in how fast it reached 155mph vs what is the top speed since they'll most likely never reach that top speed in their cars...
I don't know if it's me, but I am still not ok with the 2nd gear option, to me it would add more mechanical parts, more weight, not only that more gears would result in a reduction of efficiency...Heavier less efficient, that's like getting closer to what we are trying to get away from just to possibly reach a top speed that most people wont reach...
To me it's easier to draw the Power for the front motor straight from the battery, the battery is the whole length of the car you can have an output connector at the back (for the back inverter -> motor) and same for the front...(I'm not too sure how they are powering their current front motor, but I wouldn't be surprise if it's something like that...)
Now I'm working on another theory, how to continuously generate energy and recharge the battery while driving...lol but I gotta study more on how Regen works...
All the little batteries in the tesla battery are linked together so it doesn't matter where you draw the power from, it will be the same amount and it will still trail off as you go faster.
Rimac has put a 2 speed double clutch in their car and it workes perfectly. Without the gearbox the efficiency is 97%, with the gearbox it's 95%(or somethin like that), that's only 2%, and the weight gain is minimal. A two speed can be made very reliable and simple as well as take a lot of power. Ex: power glides. The second gear would be useful soon after the power start to fall off so for the tesla, soon after 90. This allows rimac to be one of the fastest accelerating cars beating the new Bugatti Chiron and only loading to the koenigsegg one:1 and regara.
Yes but a lot of cars are also not limited to 155. If the roadster has a world class quarter mile time and competes with the big 3 hybrid hypercars, that means doing the quarter @ around 150. So you would almost be hitting you top speed in the quarter and in the half or full, you would be trash.
Blackout
Member
The downside in using a double clutch system is you are limited in how much you can use it, and it's pretty expensive to replace...where as with the Ludicrous mode, you can just keep going on and on til your battery runs out, recharge then going on and on again...
I know what you hope for and I'm not against it, I'm just saying Tesla has a new way of thinking, away of the traditional way, The goal is not making the fastest car ever, the goal is to make a Fast electric car that is relatively cheap and can keep up with most expensive traditional supercar...It's one step at the time...
They'll get there, also on a circuit getting quicker to 155 mph is more important than top speed, and Porshe, Ferrari build cars for circuits, so a 2nd Gen Roadster would beat them at their own game...What you are talking about I see it happen on a 3rd Gen Roadster...like 185 mph and Up in pure electric with not too many traditional mechanical parts...
A good dual clutch has many gears(sometimes above 8) so it shifts A LOT and it lasts a good while in a ice car. This transmission would only shift once an ecceleration run. I would say it would out live the battery.
Tesla already made a fast, simple, and relatively cheep electric car, it's called the model s. The next roadster should be about crushing records for all types of cars, no compromise. That's what tesla does.
Sometimes the traditional way of doing it is the better way.
There are many circuits where cars that can, reach over 155.
Blackout
Member
Blackout
Member
I think this car might be more suited for you...and it will come before a 2nd Gen Roadster...
http://www.porsche.com/microsite/mission-e/international.aspx#/charging
Ya I have been interested in that concept but that's more of a competitor to the model s: 4 seats, 4 doors, more of a sports luxury car. But already is has less performance than the model s. They say 0-60 in less than 3.5s and 124 in less than 12s. Both of those are particularly good.
And to back up my previous point, both the 918 and the P1 hit around 155 at laguna seca, a track that doesn't have a very long straight and a lot of turns. That's why awd cars have an advantage
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
It largely depends on Tesla's goals with the Next Gen Roadster. If it is going to be a supercar killer on the order of $1 million, then yes, this might be true that it needs better top speed.
However, if it is going to be a premium roadster/convertible 911 competitor, then a high top speed isn't necessary. It just needs to perform well at legal speeds. The original Roadster had a top speed of only 125 mph.
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