Ordered 60kw and having some doubts now.

[Alywa]

Didn't read any of the above posts but here's my 2c :

Get the 85.

You get tire upgrade

You get supercharging

You get a ~40% increase in battery size. That is HUGE

You get big performance upgrade (faster). Many car enthusiasts pay more than $10k just to make similar performance-only upgrades to their cars. This alone is worth the extra $$ let alone all the other things noted above.

Agreed completely. I went for the S85, figuring the above was easily worth 10K to me. If money was no object, I'd have gone for the P85+, but fact is I don't drive my cars really fast or in high performance modes very often. Aside from showing off and scaring my passengers, it just wasn't worth it to me. I understand others drive differently, which is why we have choices. Range, on the other hand, is worth a lot of $$ to me. Adding in supercharging and better tires it was a no-brainer.

OP... your commute will be fine with a 60, but if it is going to bother you upgrade to the 85.

 

[JohnQ]

To your specific question, base 85 vs. fully optioned 60, I would go for the base 85 with a few personal caveats. First, get the tech package … several "cool" features that are also useful like Homelink, memory seat settings, power tailgate, built in navigation. Second, everything else is truly optional though you should consider the leather and non-piano black trim depending on personal tastes.

By knocking out the air suspension, sound system and pano you knock $7,250 off the price, nearly the differential between the supercharged 60 kWh and the 85 kWh.

I

 

[Alfafoxtrot1]

I've drive a 60 from Deerfield to the Loop 2 - 3x/wk and I've been doing it since March. From the drivers' seat, you can't feel the difference between a 60 and an S85. The range is plenty for the commute. At most, my 60 mile round trip burns 80 miles of range, travelling in mid 70s. Also, there are plenty of charging stations in the downtown parking lots.

 

[Chas F]

I've owned a 60kWh for about 6 months now and my experience and rationale almost exactly mirrors those of DFibRL8R (see page 2). I would recommend you give more weight to the advice of those with actual experience with the 60kWh.
I originally believed that the 40kWh would have covered my commute and driving patterns (I still do actually), but ended up getting the 60 because I grew impatient over delivery. The one thing I didn't anticipate was how much more I would drive the car because of how much fun it is to drive. Also, there is an almost sub conscience resistance to driving a gas car because of the persistent mental calculation of $ spent in gas to travel anywhere meaningful. Now, my family and I travel across town to restaurant because it is what we want to eat vs picking one that closer because of $4 gas. I estimate that has added about 30% to my weekend driving. Didn't see that one coming. The 60 is still more than enough for me.
Granted, my daily commute is about 50 miles and I live in Florida, so weather is not as much a factor. My experience:

Do not miss the tech package. Only got the things I care about (leather, air suspension, pano roof). Love the car.
Each week day I charge to about 75% and end the day with about 100 mi range.
Weekends I charge to about 85% and end the day with an avg of 80 miles.
No appreciable battery degradation seen so far (10,000 miles).
The extra performance won't be missed. The 60 has more than enough acceleration to have a blast.
For longer trips, I plan around max range minus 30% to account for speed and weather.

If frequent long trips are in your profile, you may want to stretch for the S85. If, like me, you only do these once or twice a year, the 60 kWh should be more than enough.

 

[Zextraterrestrial]

Why not go for a loaner S85 with 5k miles or so? then the price will be the same as the 60.

How long do you plan on keeping the car? how many miles of range do you want at that time? My p85 is @ 245ish on a full charge with 1 year and 16k miles and the closest supercharger is 170 miles with hills so I will need 200+ miles of rated to do it. The other Sc's are about 200 miles and will be a PITA to get to in a couple of years

 

[scourge]

I appreciate all the feedback. Definitely lets me make a more informed decision. Having said that I'm starting to think a "base" 85 may be a slightly better value long term. Ditching the high power charging at home (does not seem as necessary with the added range) and the Pano Roof (nice but I am pretty sure i can survive without) covers about 50% of the cost delta. I'm thinking that the battery, tire upgrade, supercharger access and the warranty (i drive 25+K/year) are probably more worthwhile. Further down the road I'm guessing that resale value will be helped by the larger battery far more then having the cool glass roof or the second onboard charger.

 

[strengthcoach4]

I have the 60kW. I have 15,500 miles on my car in 5 months 3 weeks. I regret every minute of getting the 60. If Tesla had the option to upgrade to a 85 (Same vehicle, not trading in or selling as the hit on resale/trade in is absurd), I would upgrade in a instant. Put it on my Amex and get that 85kw battery in my car ASAP! I'd even take a referb 85kw battery pack.

I was quoted $20k to swap from 60 to 80 here at the Scottsdale Service Center.

 

[stevezzzz]

I appreciate all the feedback. Definitely lets me make a more informed decision. Having said that I'm starting to think a "base" 85 may be a slightly better value long term. Ditching the high power charging at home (does not seem as necessary with the added range) and the Pano Roof (nice but I am pretty sure i can survive without) covers about 50% of the cost delta. I'm thinking that the battery, tire upgrade, supercharger access and the warranty (i drive 25+K/year) are probably more worthwhile. Further down the road I'm guessing that resale value will be helped by the larger battery far more then having the cool glass roof or the second onboard charger.

I missed seeing the HPWC as part of your buying equation: trust me, for home charging you don't need it. A 14-50 in the garage is plenty fast enough for overnight charging of an 85.

There, you're all set: leave out the HPWC and second charger, the pano and the (mostly lame) upgraded sound system, and you've got a nicely appointed S85 for very little more than a 60.

 

[jthompson]

@scourge: One thing perhaps to think about. A number of folks are selling their 85s for P85s and their P85s for P85+s. You might keep an eye out for used 85. Also, perhaps check with Tesla Service Centers to see if they have any 85 loaners for sale (I profess to not know exactly how this works but I know a guy who did buy a P85 loaner and sold his 85 himself).

 

[scourge]

@scourge: One thing perhaps to think about. A number of folks are selling their 85s for P85s and their P85s for P85+s. You might keep an eye out for used 85. Also, perhaps check with Tesla Service Centers to see if they have any 85 loaners for sale (I profess to not know exactly how this works but I know a guy who did buy a P85 loaner and sold his 85 himself).

The folks at the store showed me some options on the S85 loaners. The problem is that they are all pretty much fully loaded with expensive stuff i have no use for. The discount for the mileage is not even close to making up for the difference. The cars I was shown that are around here in Chicago were all close to $100K with maybe a 3-4K off for miles driven. All the while I'm just really wanting to get Tech and Cold Weather Packs. Have you seen any "used" (private party sale) S85's around?

 

[paco3791]

I have a 60kWh with a 60 mile round trip, all highway, and even with only charging to 70% that is more than enough even in the cold. Even though I could have afforded the 85(or a P for that matter) it just didn't make sense for my usage. Personally I have absolutely no regrets with the 60, and with the Superchargers I've done a few road trips. What you are going to find on this site is that most people here will tell you to get the 85 or P85 or hey just get the P85+ since you only live once! But many of those answers may not be helpful to you ultimately it is going to have to be your decision and what you feel most comfortable with. What I will say is that with your commute you should have no problem with the range of a 60.

+1 to this. I have a 62 mile round trip commute in the Chicago area and I have 0 regrets with the 60. If your budget is tight I would strongly recommend you look at the Tesla Loaner purchase program. That's how I got my car and it was a great deal.

 

[Longhorn92]

I appreciate all the feedback. Definitely lets me make a more informed decision. Having said that I'm starting to think a "base" 85 may be a slightly better value long term. Ditching the high power charging at home (does not seem as necessary with the added range) and the Pano Roof (nice but I am pretty sure i can survive without) covers about 50% of the cost delta. I'm thinking that the battery, tire upgrade, supercharger access and the warranty (i drive 25+K/year) are probably more worthwhile. Further down the road I'm guessing that resale value will be helped by the larger battery far more then having the cool glass roof or the second onboard charger.

Seems like a sound decision to me. High power charger and twin chargers make sense only in very specific situations and are not really needed (especially in the Midwest where we currently do not have a network of high power public chargers). The 60 would be very adequate for your commute in the Chicago area, and if that is all you will truly be using the car for, then you shouldn't pay the extra; however, as others have pointed out, you will likely find yourself using your car for more than just the commute.

I made somewhat the opposite decision. I was deciding between a "base" 60 or a 40 with options, and I went with the 40 with options (everything except the twin charger and HPWC). I am very happy with my choice (especially after the deal Tesla gave us 40 owners); however, there have been times where more capacity could have come in handy. For example, I took my family to a pumpkin patch in Indiana about a month ago, and I had plenty of capacity to make it there and back. While we were there, though, my wife suggested that we go to another fun place a little out of the way before heading home. I did the quick calculations in my head and determined that we likely wouldn't make it, so we didn't risk the detour. Not a big deal, but the car range was definitely the deciding factor.

 

[PokerBroker]

Disclosure: I am a Roadster owner planning a Model S purchase next year.

My Roadster has never left me stranded with a top end of about 200 miles range. I use it as a daily driver and put about 500 miles/week on it. 95+% of my charging is at home.

The S60 would be plenty of range for my needs but I plan to purchase the S85 for:

1) Supercharger access for longer roadtrips. Standard charging away from home is adequate for adding a handful of miles, not for extending trips.

2) Better/longer battery warranty. Not as concerned with degradation (Roadster is only down 5% after 5 years), more concerned about long term functionality and crazy replacement cost.

3) Performance is just an added bonus.

You have to decide for yourself what benefits to others may benefit you as well! Either way, enjoy!

 

[PokerBroker]

Disclosure: I am a Roadster owner planning a Model S purchase next year.

My Roadster has never left me stranded with a top end of about 200 miles range. I use it as a daily driver and put about 500 miles/week on it. 95+% of my charging is at home.

The S60 would be plenty of range for my needs but I plan to purchase the S85 for:

1) Supercharger access for longer roadtrips. Standard charging away from home is adequate for adding a handful of miles, not for extending trips.

2) Better/longer battery warranty. Not as concerned with degradation (Roadster is only down 5% after 5 years), more concerned about long term functionality and crazy replacement cost.

3) Performance is just an added bonus.

You have to decide for yourself what benefits to others may benefit you as well! Either way, enjoy!

 

[theaveng]

I have a roughly 70 miles/day round trip drive that's 90% highway. At first glance it seemed like the 60kw variant will have just the right range

Deep discharge of Lithium batteries (below 20%) will shorten their life as Leaf owners are discovering. And charging above 80% is also a poor practice for similar reasons. So the 60 kW car really only has 125 miles of useful range if you keep the battery between 20-80% charge to extend its life.

Also the 60 kW car is really not that much less cost than the 85 kW car once you add the cost of the supercharger.

 

[montgom626]

I have no experience but would just suggest that if you can afford the 85 why not get it and remove the doubt? No point in having a 60 if it might not meet your needs. What if you need to run errands mid-day?

I agree, you will never have too much range.

 

[kjl]

I have two main concerns:

1. Being in Chicago the weather can be anything from +110F to -10F.
2. Most of my drive is down a pretty fast moving tollway where you need to be doing at least 80mph to keep up with the majority of traffic (especially when everyone is rushing to work in the mornings).

I would personally keep the loaded 60 over a pared down 85 with your needs. 70 miles is easy; not even a question. Worst case scenario, with heaters and seat warmer on, 80 mph, uphill in both directions, boat sails hanging out the windows, one missing tire, dragging an anchor, 70 miles is easily within the 60kWh's range.

I have a 60, and maybe twice a week I drive 48 miles in the early morning to surf, 48 miles to work (have chargers at work but I've never used them), ~10-15 miles to and from lunch, 10 miles home, maybe with another detour for dinner, for a total of ~120-130 miles or more, and that's well within the safe range of the car for me (not caring about speed or efficiency or watching the meter or being careful in any way, but just driving like I want to drive). The weather here is certainly less taxing than yours in Chicago, but if I can drive 130 miles on a standard charge on the 60kWh, 70 miles in worse climate shouldn't even be an issue.

I would say I only start paying attention to my energy usage if I know my trip is going to be > 130-140 miles or so (though that is in pleasant California weather).

 

[Gee-Man]

I have a 60, and I have no regrets. I bought the 60 to save a little money since I was loading up on quite a few options like the tech package and such. In that situation the 85 was really pushing the budget, plus it was harder to justify spending the extra money since we rarely take road trips (and even when we did, we almost always end up renting a car, even before I got the Tesla). I didn't get the HPWC either, just had my electrician install a 14-50 and it's not a problem for daily charging.

I'm in LA so the weather isn't the same factor, but my daily commute is about 50 miles round-trip, and the 60 handles it easily, with no range worries. On the weekends I end up using it even more than that, my wife prefers we take my car now for the entire family because of the smooth ride and the acceleration, not to mention the savings on gas. The most I ever did in a single trip was about 160 miles of mostly freeway driving, A/C on full blast, using no hypermile-ing or any other range-saving techniques whatsoever. That trip pretty much ran the battery down to about 5 miles of range left. So I suspect you'll be more than fine with 70 miles of daily driving.

 

[iridium]

I have a 60 as well and am perfectly happy with it. Like you, I probably struggled the most with the battery size decision. When I really looked at all the trips my family takes, I basically couldn't find one the 60 couldn't handle. And I figured even if I had to take the ICE once per year, the extra $8k for the bigger battery didn't make sense.

I have over 10,500 miles on mine and have never come close to having a range issue. With your commute you will have no problems. Just take a look at all the driving you do and the long trips you might make. If spending the additional money to cover every possible trip is worth it to you, go for it, otherwise don't worry about it.

FWIW, the closest I have come to an empty pack was recently. I drove to a supercharger 80 miles away. I intentionally charged it to only 120 for the return and drove like mad all the way home.. still ended up with 30 miles remaining.

 

[aaron0k]

I have a roughly 70 miles/day round trip drive that's 90% highway.

If it makes you feel any better about the 60, I do a 80+ mile commute daily in my 40kwh (range limited 60) with plenty to spare. I'll concede, I am in in California and do not have cold weather concerns.

Also keep in mind, WHEN Battery Swapping becomes a reality, you could theoretically' upgrade to a larger pack (and pay the difference) or just swap on extended trips. That's not an 'option' with some of the Car Upgrades; Tech, Pano, etc...