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Performance buyers who don't want Uberturbines/20s, what's your plan?
- Thread starter yeet
- Start date
Stew-2
Member
I’ve got a M3P on order and I’m not a big fan of the 20” uberturbines, I’m thinking of looking for someone who recently got a M3 with the 19” sport wheels who wants to swap.
Thanks for that! I was basing this one the warning at https://shop.tesla.com/product/model-3-19_-sport-wheel-and-summer-tire-package
I would hope the local Telsa dealer could replace the 20” for 19” before delivery. (At no charge). Has anyone tried that?
Yeah that warning isn't accurate. It used to be the case that only the P wheels had the slightly larger bore cut out for the first few millimeters, but now they all do. Even if you did get a set of older wheels, that issue could be overcome with a tiny spacer. Unfortunately the 18s don't clear the calipers nonetheless, but the 19s aren't a problem.
RedWhite19
Member
@yeet What I did was order smaller wheels before I even picked up the car. I chose 18x8.5" wheels with the correct machining + offset to mount directly on the M3P PUP hubs. I wasn't sure how I'd feel about that size. I figured I'd run one set of summer performance tires on them, and then if I wanted wider or 19s I could turn the 18s into my winter wheels.
Well, turns out the wheel+tire setup I choose feels just awesome to me for street driving. More grip, better steering feel, and smoother ride all at the same time vs stock. And I'm not stressing about potholes constantly. For street use I don't feel any need for wider, nor for shorter sidewall. (I did want more grip than the stock setup, and I got it now.) So I'm sticking with these 18x8.5" as my summer wheels. When this car eventually sees snow I'll get another set of 18s, currently leaning towards narrower e.g. 18x8".
I bought aftermarket wheels because it's widely reported that the base Model 3 18" wheels don't clear the M3P PUP brakes. When I downsized wheels before (e.g. for a winter setup, or because my Model S came with stupid fragile 21s that cracked on bad roads), I used alternate OE wheels from a previous generation or base model the same car.
I went for 245 width tires because I've always used that width on 8.5" wide wheels, and I wanted more rubber, not less. My other Tesla and my last ICE car both with 245 on 8.5" wide for what that's worth.
The wheels I chose were backordered when I ordered them, so the car arrived first and we managed to baby it for 1k miles without cracking the 20s before the 18s arrived. (Yes big Tesla OE cast wheels on rubberband thin tires will crack on the roads where I live / drive, I know this from experience.)
Here's my setup and driving impressions:
Pic with lug nut covers
Day 1 impressions (still too much new tire grease to judge grip)
Early thoughts and comparisons with some past tires
After further wet driving (early grip and traction impressions as new tire grease is wearing off)
Verdict after proper twisty road driving
Well, turns out the wheel+tire setup I choose feels just awesome to me for street driving. More grip, better steering feel, and smoother ride all at the same time vs stock. And I'm not stressing about potholes constantly. For street use I don't feel any need for wider, nor for shorter sidewall. (I did want more grip than the stock setup, and I got it now.) So I'm sticking with these 18x8.5" as my summer wheels. When this car eventually sees snow I'll get another set of 18s, currently leaning towards narrower e.g. 18x8".
I bought aftermarket wheels because it's widely reported that the base Model 3 18" wheels don't clear the M3P PUP brakes. When I downsized wheels before (e.g. for a winter setup, or because my Model S came with stupid fragile 21s that cracked on bad roads), I used alternate OE wheels from a previous generation or base model the same car.
I went for 245 width tires because I've always used that width on 8.5" wide wheels, and I wanted more rubber, not less. My other Tesla and my last ICE car both with 245 on 8.5" wide for what that's worth.
The wheels I chose were backordered when I ordered them, so the car arrived first and we managed to baby it for 1k miles without cracking the 20s before the 18s arrived. (Yes big Tesla OE cast wheels on rubberband thin tires will crack on the roads where I live / drive, I know this from experience.)
Here's my setup and driving impressions:
Pic with lug nut covers
Day 1 impressions (still too much new tire grease to judge grip)
Early thoughts and comparisons with some past tires
After further wet driving (early grip and traction impressions as new tire grease is wearing off)
Verdict after proper twisty road driving
heavyD
Member
I must say the Uberturbines are not exactly a pretty wheel and they also hide a lot of the red calipers compared to the older wheels.
SantaCruzOMB
Member
I currently have a 2020 M3P and ordered a 2022. I'm trying to decide between selling that car with the uberturbines and keeping my old wheels or getting 19" forged wheels for the 2022. I'm leaning towards 19's because I'd be shaving off 10lb per wheel, would likely drop .1 seconds 0-60 and would save about $300 when I need to replace the tires. I keep reading that the uberturbines grow on you but I doubt that will happen.
This forum and others seem to reflect that the "market" price for a full set of Uberturbines with P-Zero summer tires and bluetooth TPMS is only $2000 to $2800. I see a lot posted for $2800-$3000 and then a bunch of "bump" and "lowered to xxxx." It also depends on region. California is dense market with lots of buyers and summer tire friendly weather. Anywhere east and north is less promising. In my market, it was looking like $2500 would be the best I could do, if I got lucky.
I need to swap the summer tires for all-seasons anyway, so for a minute I was thinking of getting 19x8.5" wheels as well. It would have cost $2500-$3000 for the wheels, and the $400 for new TPMS, and then $1100 tires (cheaper than the 20" tires). So it was looking like it'd cost an extra $2k to downsize the tires (after recouping about half that by selling the take-offs).
Instead, I decided I'll keep the Uberturbines and just swap the tires. A set of take-off P-Zeros only fetches half-price at best, so I'll take what I can get on those. Seems like a lot of people need one replacement in a hurry, so depending on shipping costs, I might do better to sell them individually when someone needs one tomorrow.
Also, for what it's worth, I was disappointed at the modest performance improvement that much lighter wheels would provide. $2k for 0.01sec to 60mph is a terrible value, IMHO. It sounds like some smaller wheels provide better efficiency, but others are less aerodynamic, and some people drive like grannies and others bought the P for a reason. So it was really tough to predict the value proposition of changing the wheels and hoping to recoup the cost through increased efficiency. How many kWh/mile/$/mo would it take to recoup $2k??
Hopefully properly inflated Michelin Pilot Sport all-seasons in 245/35R20 (slightly wider than OEM, same as the Track pack tires) will help the Uberturbines service the roads in the nation's capital, and I won't soon be in the market for more take-off Uberturbines. They will have a 95Y load rating instead of the P-zero's modest 92Y rating.
I need to swap the summer tires for all-seasons anyway, so for a minute I was thinking of getting 19x8.5" wheels as well. It would have cost $2500-$3000 for the wheels, and the $400 for new TPMS, and then $1100 tires (cheaper than the 20" tires). So it was looking like it'd cost an extra $2k to downsize the tires (after recouping about half that by selling the take-offs).
Instead, I decided I'll keep the Uberturbines and just swap the tires. A set of take-off P-Zeros only fetches half-price at best, so I'll take what I can get on those. Seems like a lot of people need one replacement in a hurry, so depending on shipping costs, I might do better to sell them individually when someone needs one tomorrow.
Also, for what it's worth, I was disappointed at the modest performance improvement that much lighter wheels would provide. $2k for 0.01sec to 60mph is a terrible value, IMHO. It sounds like some smaller wheels provide better efficiency, but others are less aerodynamic, and some people drive like grannies and others bought the P for a reason. So it was really tough to predict the value proposition of changing the wheels and hoping to recoup the cost through increased efficiency. How many kWh/mile/$/mo would it take to recoup $2k??
Hopefully properly inflated Michelin Pilot Sport all-seasons in 245/35R20 (slightly wider than OEM, same as the Track pack tires) will help the Uberturbines service the roads in the nation's capital, and I won't soon be in the market for more take-off Uberturbines. They will have a 95Y load rating instead of the P-zero's modest 92Y rating.
SantaCruzOMB
Member
Yes I think the performance gain is most likely going to say the decision. It will probably only cost 1-2k after offsetting with selling the uberturbines. Range probably won't benefit on the highway but it should be better around town also.
heavyD
Member
I would just use them for winter wheels. Shame they are 20" though as your winter tire choices aren't nearly as good in this size.
lUtriaNt
Member
im keeping the ubers and taking off the pzero. ive a 2020 m3p and the michelin ps4 summer tire is a beast! ive gotten used to driving with them and their grip is insanely excellent. ive only read the pz is a much inferior tire.
For what it's worth, when I say that my lightweight 18" wheels "perform better" than the Uberturbines, I'm talking about how they feel in the twisties, not 0-60 numbers. I don't know and personally don't care if the change made a small difference to 0-60.
Also I'm not talking about a measurable racetrack time improvement, I don't track my M3P, no idea if there would be consistently measurable lap time improvement. Tire model and wheel+tire width would be far bigger factors in lap times than wheel diameter (assuming tire diameter stays about the same).
What I'm talking about is how the steering feels. It's notably better with the lighter wheels. The difference was clear to me, not subtle. The car feels like it changes direction easier. I don't know a better way to describe it. Plus the tires I chose perform (grip) better than the OE tires, but of course one can change tires without changing wheels.
Lastly I'll mention that my overall efficiency/range seems to have gone up a little with the change. My 18" wheels are not aero, but I think flat tire sidewall is more aero than wheel spokes, so in general smaller wheel + taller sidewall is more aerodynamic than big wheel + short sidewall. Plus smaller wheel + taller sidewall is usually lighter overall which certainly helps start/stop efficiency. (Definitely way way lighter vs the Uberturbines!)
Tire rolling resistance can also make a real difference of course, but in my case I stayed in the 300-ish TW "max performance" tire category. I doubt my new tires are any more efficient than the OE PZ4, I think all my efficiency gains are from lighter wheels + taller sidewall.
(Disclaimer: I don't track my efficiency super closely. What I noticed is I started getting closer to EPA rating with the new tires, and I seem to have an easier time reaching or exceeding EPA when I want to. I've not made any attempt at a controlled experiment though.)
Also I'm not talking about a measurable racetrack time improvement, I don't track my M3P, no idea if there would be consistently measurable lap time improvement. Tire model and wheel+tire width would be far bigger factors in lap times than wheel diameter (assuming tire diameter stays about the same).
What I'm talking about is how the steering feels. It's notably better with the lighter wheels. The difference was clear to me, not subtle. The car feels like it changes direction easier. I don't know a better way to describe it. Plus the tires I chose perform (grip) better than the OE tires, but of course one can change tires without changing wheels.
Lastly I'll mention that my overall efficiency/range seems to have gone up a little with the change. My 18" wheels are not aero, but I think flat tire sidewall is more aero than wheel spokes, so in general smaller wheel + taller sidewall is more aerodynamic than big wheel + short sidewall. Plus smaller wheel + taller sidewall is usually lighter overall which certainly helps start/stop efficiency. (Definitely way way lighter vs the Uberturbines!)
Tire rolling resistance can also make a real difference of course, but in my case I stayed in the 300-ish TW "max performance" tire category. I doubt my new tires are any more efficient than the OE PZ4, I think all my efficiency gains are from lighter wheels + taller sidewall.
(Disclaimer: I don't track my efficiency super closely. What I noticed is I started getting closer to EPA rating with the new tires, and I seem to have an easier time reaching or exceeding EPA when I want to. I've not made any attempt at a controlled experiment though.)
Eury
Member
I pick up my 3 Performance tomorrow. I have a new set of TSportline TSS 18" wheels with Continental DWS06+ mounted sitting in the garage waiting for it. I commute from NH down into Boston, the 20" wheels are a non starter for me. I've already broken wheels and killed tires on another car with 20s going down there, these will be listed for sale as soon as I swap the Uberturbines on Thursday.
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