Phantom braking so bad I want to return my car

[sleepydoc]

Is it really not widespread? Because based on what I'm reading here and on the FB group, it seems it's a big problem for a lot of folks? And obviously there's that NHTSA investigation.

It is widespread, some people just feel compelled to defend Tesla at all costs. It’s quite baffling, really.

I would clarify that the NHTSA investigation is about the emergency braking system, not TACC (at least to my understanding)

 

[PACEMD]

Is it really not widespread? Because based on what I'm reading here and on the FB group, it seems it's a big problem for a lot of folks? And obviously there's that NHTSA investigation.

Widespread internet angst and reality are very different things. One does not quantify the other. I myself have only had "phantom braking" 3 times in 42,000 miles.

 

[Fourdoor]

More like it is not as wide spread as few here trying to convince otherwise.

Or it was wide spread amongst vision only cars and the radar equipped people don't understand why we are whining so much...

Keith

PS: I can admit it is getting better over time... can you admit that it was a problem for vision only cars when the switch was first implemented?

 

[sleepydoc]

Or it was wide spread amongst vision only cars and the radar equipped people don't understand why we are whining so much...

Keith

PS: I can admit it is getting better over time... can you admit that it was a problem for vision only cars when the switch was first implemented?

I’ve never seen @WhiteWi admit any fault with Tesla. “You’re holding driving it wrong”

 

[WhiteWi]

I’ve never seen @WhiteWi admit any fault with Tesla. “You’re holding driving it wrong”

Can you list what are the faults with Tesla in your opinion? I would gladly listen what you got to say. Also I never said Tesla is prefect for everyone bc there is no such thing as prefect for everyone. For me Personally Tesla is the best car I have owned and I owned 17 cars so far. From Ford, Jeep, Chrysler, Ram, Mazda, Nissan, Mitsubishi, Audi, VW and Tesla.

 

[boulder.dude]

Can you list what are the faults with Tesla in your opinion? I would gladly listen what you got to say. Also I never said Tesla is prefect for everyone bc there is no such thing as prefect for everyone. For me Personally Tesla is the best car I have owned and I owned 17 cars so far. From Ford, Jeep, Chrysler, Ram, Mazda, Nissan, Mitsubishi, Audi, VW and Tesla.

Here’s the list:
1. Phantom braking

 

[TheLex]

Can you list what are the faults with Tesla in your opinion? I would gladly listen what you got to say. Also I never said Tesla is prefect for everyone bc there is no such thing as prefect for everyone. For me Personally Tesla is the best car I have owned and I owned 17 cars so far. From Ford, Jeep, Chrysler, Ram, Mazda, Nissan, Mitsubishi, Audi, VW and Tesla.

I'll take a stab at this. For one, Tesla customer service is severely lacking. From not answering phone calls to the salesroom (even after leaving a message), to poor customer service at their service centers, the customer experience is severely lacking. The phantom braking issue seems to be the main complaint on this forum, but there are quality control issues such as misaligned panels, missing parts, etc.

I would also submit that at its price point (starting basically in the mid to high $40k range, and going well up into the mid-$100k area, the cars you've had experience with (except for Audi if it was purchased new and one of their higher end models), simply do not compare to the Tesla price point. If I'm dropping $100k plus (and I have done this), before Tesla I was buying Porsche, BMW and Mercedes. And I daresay the customer experience at these dealerships (let's not forget Lexus), is far far better with those legacy brands.

I understand that Tesla is still "new" and it's using cutting edge technology. But customer service is not technology. It's just that - service. Answering the phones is basic customer service. Returning phone calls is basic customer service. I won't even get into the coddling that customers experience at some of the higher end brands can provide.

So let's not be rah rah rah, and apologists for Tesla just because it's the cool and new thing with cutting edge tech. Tesla needs to step it up and provide much better customer service and fix their quality control issues. The phantom braking issue needs to be fixed yesterday. When even cheap Japanese cars like Subaru can get it right, there's no excuse for Tesla to continually fumble this.

 

[sleepydoc]

Can you list what are the faults with Tesla in your opinion? I would gladly listen what you got to say. Also I never said Tesla is prefect for everyone bc there is no such thing as prefect for everyone. For me Personally Tesla is the best car I have owned and I owned 17 cars so far. From Ford, Jeep, Chrysler, Ram, Mazda, Nissan, Mitsubishi, Audi, VW and Tesla.

1. Phantom braking
2. The lack of a consistently functional adaptive cruise control like every other car on the market has (see number 1)
3. An interface that makes it easier to access games than the climate controls
4. The lack of suspension

 

[Fourdoor]

Can you list what are the faults with Tesla in your opinion? I would gladly listen what you got to say. Also I never said Tesla is prefect for everyone bc there is no such thing as prefect for everyone. For me Personally Tesla is the best car I have owned and I owned 17 cars so far. From Ford, Jeep, Chrysler, Ram, Mazda, Nissan, Mitsubishi, Audi, VW and Tesla.

Mostly it boils down to either #1 not having features that are standard in other cars even as an option, or #2 fumbling the implementation of features that other cars do with ease.

Examples of #1 are rear cross traffic alert, blind spot indicators in the mirrors, birds eye view for parking, gauge cluster or HUD in front of driver, Android Auto / Apple Carplay, there are others that I can't think of right now but I am sure other people in this thread can come up with some.

Examples of #2 are customer service, soft paint, adaptive cruise control, automatic high beam headlights, automatic rain sensing windshield wipers, suspension tuning, and once again others that I am forgetting that other people in the thread will fill in.

The frantic beeping of the blind spot warning did save me from an idiot without his headlights on at dusk when I was changing lanes tonight, but if I had a light in the mirror I would never have tried to change lanes into that spot.

Keith

 

[WhiteWi]

I'll take a stab at this. For one, Tesla customer service is severely lacking. From not answering phone calls to the salesroom (even after leaving a message), to poor customer service at their service centers, the customer experience is severely lacking. The phantom braking issue seems to be the main complaint on this forum, but there are quality control issues such as misaligned panels, missing parts, etc.

I would also submit that at its price point (starting basically in the mid to high $40k range, and going well up into the mid-$100k area, the cars you've had experience with (except for Audi if it was purchased new and one of their higher end models), simply do not compare to the Tesla price point. If I'm dropping $100k plus (and I have done this), before Tesla I was buying Porsche, BMW and Mercedes. And I daresay the customer experience at these dealerships (let's not forget Lexus), is far far better with those legacy brands.

I understand that Tesla is still "new" and it's using cutting edge technology. But customer service is not technology. It's just that - service. Answering the phones is basic customer service. Returning phone calls is basic customer service. I won't even get into the coddling that customers experience at some of the higher end brands can provide.

So let's not be rah rah rah, and apologists for Tesla just because it's the cool and new thing with cutting edge tech. Tesla needs to step it up and provide much better customer service and fix their quality control issues. The phantom braking issue needs to be fixed yesterday. When even cheap Japanese cars like Subaru can get it right, there's no excuse for Tesla to continually fumble this.

Cool. But if my Tesla has no need to be serviced or have any serious problems in over 3 years I have little interest about how great or bad customer services is. And what interaction I had were great in that regard. So once again just opinions. My Last Audi Q7 TDI was fully loaded and I didn’t find anything special about it for that price point beside the brand name and prefer my Tesla in every way and cheaper too both purchase price and long term expenses. Also yeah Audi Dealer ship were all up in my rear to make me feel taken care off while ripping me off with mega expensive services I had to do every year. No thanks they can keep that fake care act for themselves.

 

[WhiteWi]

1. Phantom braking
2. The lack of a consistently functional adaptive cruise control like every other car on the market has (see number 1)
3. An interface that makes it easier to access games than the climate controls
4. The lack of suspension

All your points are you personal opinion and not a problem for everyone. In fact all of them are no problems for my experience. See maybe it is not a Tesla faults but just difference in personal experience and expectations.

 

[WhiteWi]

Mostly it boils down to either #1 not having features that are standard in other cars even as an option, or #2 fumbling the implementation of features that other cars do with ease.

Examples of #1 are rear cross traffic alert, blind spot indicators in the mirrors, birds eye view for parking, gauge cluster or HUD in front of driver, Android Auto / Apple Carplay, there are others that I can't think of right now but I am sure other people in this thread can come up with some.

Examples of #2 are customer service, soft paint, adaptive cruise control, automatic high beam headlights, automatic rain sensing windshield wipers, suspension tuning, and once again others that I am forgetting that other people in the thread will fill in.

The frantic beeping of the blind spot warning did save me from an idiot without his headlights on at dusk when I was changing lanes tonight, but if I had a light in the mirror I would never have tried to change lanes into that spot.

Keith

Seems ya all complaining about things that you knew Tesla either don’t offer or you expected regular car when you bought Tesla. Easy to avoid if you did research. I purchased it with open mind and let it grew on me and I love the experience I get. If I was so disappointed as many of you seems are I would sell it ASAP especially with this crazy prices on used cars.
Soft paint, panel gaps lol I never ever even thought about it when I bought any of my cars. I walk around, look at the car if it looks good enough and no damage I am good to go. I am not going to stress over a car, life has more important stuff to worry about.
P.S.
Only thing I may agree that suspension is little bit harsh for my liking but I understand the reason why it is the way it is.

 

[sleepydoc]

I’ve never seen @WhiteWi admit any fault with Tesla. “You’re holding driving it wrong”

All your points are you personal opinion and not a problem for everyone. In fact all of them are no problems for my experience. See maybe it is not a Tesla faults but just difference in personal experience and expectations.

Thank you for proving my point.

 

[PACEMD]

Oh, you had a point? Didn't see that. Would you mind repeating that all over again? Ok, one more time, if Pete and Repeat sat on a ...............

 

[WhiteWi]

Thank you for proving my point.

You can’t claim fault with Tesla if that is just your personal dislike. Fault would be when bunch of people would get in to the accident bc of Tesla phantom brake for example. When faults happen they are recalled either Voluntarily by Tesla or forced by NHTSA. As I said I might not rave about suspension but I know why it is what it is. Stuff like HUD, lights in mirrors, cross traffic alerts, CarPlay’s or any other thing I can live without just fine and so far had no need nor missed in Tesla. I can tell about two faults I had. Year 2 HVAC actuator broke fixed by warranty claim, year 3 rear seat belt sensor went bad (used by my kids all the time) fixed by warranty. And that is about it. Zero expenses on maintenance or gas and I get 400kW of free charging during 12-6am a month. We drove our little M3 all over in past 3 years. GA-Florida, Ga-NJ multiple times again zero problems. Did I experience minor slow downs? You bet I did. Was it dangerous? Hell no. In most cases I knew what caused minor freak out. Also it has improved dramatically in past 3 years. I know one spot on Florida Interstate where car slows down a lot and wants me to get off the interstate and get right on it so it must be GPS mapping mistake or something. That is about it I can say or complain.

 

[advocate8]

Can you list what are the faults with Tesla in your opinion? I would gladly listen what you got to say. Also I never said Tesla is prefect for everyone bc there is no such thing as prefect for everyone. For me Personally Tesla is the best car I have owned and I owned 17 cars so far. From Ford, Jeep, Chrysler, Ram, Mazda, Nissan, Mitsubishi, Audi, VW and Tesla.

I agree that my last one, and M3P was flawless, never had issues, rarely had phantom braking.
Still, nothing personal, but ... That list is practically a perfect summation of the worst mainstream vehicle makers. If you remove Mazda and replace it with Fiat, it would be perfect. Not really a good set of yardsticks for a Tesla.

 

[WhiteWi]

I agree that my last one, and M3P was flawless, never had issues, rarely had phantom braking.
Still, nothing personal, but ... That list is practically a perfect summation of the worst mainstream vehicle makers. If you remove Mazda and replace it with Fiat, it would be perfect. Not really a good set of yardsticks for a Tesla.

I don’t know Mazda was sweet CX9 fully loaded. Audi was great on acceleration and driving at high speeds but Tesla beats that hands down. Must add I traded Audi for Ram truck and that is prefect fit for my needs minus the gas part. And that is why I wait for Cybertruck to be my prefect car for a long long time. Once We went Tesla I sold my gas car and not going back to ICE world ever again.
PS
I avoided as much as I could luxury brands bc I don’t like idea of paying premium for status image.

 

[DCGOO]

I'll take a stab at this. For one, Tesla customer service is severely lacking. From not answering phone calls to the salesroom (even after leaving a message), to poor customer service at their service centers, the customer experience is severely lacking. The phantom braking issue seems to be the main complaint on this forum, but there are quality control issues such as misaligned panels, missing parts, etc.

I understand that Tesla is still "new" and it's using cutting edge technology. But customer service is not technology. It's just that - service. Answering the phones is basic customer service. Returning phone calls is basic customer service. I won't even get into the coddling that customers experience at some of the higher end brands can provide.

So let's not be rah rah rah, and apologists for Tesla just because it's the cool and new thing with cutting edge tech. Tesla needs to step it up and provide much better customer service and fix their quality control issues. The phantom braking issue needs to be fixed yesterday. When even cheap Japanese cars like Subaru can get it right, there's no excuse for Tesla to continually fumble this.

I would submit that talking with customers on the phone is not a very productive use of their time. Tesla is overrun with so much business, they have resorted to removing as many inefficiencies as possible. This includes huge time suck of speaking with customers on the telephone.

They want you to use the Tesla app on your smartphone. They go out of their way to make that experience as convenient as possible. I was out to dinner last weekend, Saturday I think. My wife mentioned a Passive Restraint System alarm she had been getting in her Model 3. I opened a service ticket described the problem, and scheduled a mobile service visit for a couple days out. The next day I got a message in the app, confirming the appointment for the next day. The tech showed up in my driveway during the allocated arrival window, and replaced a broken wiring harness in the driver's seat. This was the first service of any kind on our Model 3 in three years.

I did all this without speaking to a soul on the phone, on a Saturday night while out to dinner. Tesla performed the repair in my own driveway (we live 20 minutes from the local Service Center). I was present for the appointment, but I did not have to be. As long as the car was accessible in my driveway, my presence was not required.

That is how it is supposed to work. If folks continue to demand to call in to talk, or drive in for service, they are going to be highly frustrated. I would suggest they buy something else if they want traditional sales and service. It is not gonna happen with Tesla. Personally, I think it is a huge improvement over the old way.

I have owned three Teslas, and have two on order. AFAIK, I do not have a sales rep, at least I sure don't know who that is, nor do I care.

 

[sleepydoc]

I would submit that talking with customers on the phone is not a very productive use of their time. Tesla is overrun with so much business, they have resorted to removing as many inefficiencies as possible. This includes huge time suck of speaking with customers on the telephone.

They want you to use the Tesla app on your smartphone. They go out of their way to make that experience as convenient as possible. I was out to dinner last weekend, Saturday I think. My wife mentioned a Passive Restraint System alarm she had been getting in her Model 3. I opened a service ticket described the problem, and scheduled a mobile service visit for a couple days out. The next day I got a message in the app, confirming the appointment for the next day. The tech showed up in my driveway during the allocated arrival window, and replaced a broken wiring harness in the driver's seat. This was the first service of any kind on our Model 3 in three years.

I did all this without speaking to a soul on the phone, on a Saturday night while out to dinner. Tesla performed the repair in my own driveway (we live 20 minutes from the local Service Center). I was present for the appointment, but I did not have to be. As long as the car was accessible in my driveway, my presence was not required.

That is how it is supposed to work. If folks continue to demand to call in to talk, or drive in for service, they are going to be highly frustrated. I would suggest they buy something else if they want traditional sales and service. It is not gonna happen with Tesla. Personally, I think it is a huge improvement over the old way.

I have owned three Teslas, and have two on order. AFAIK, I do not have a sales rep, at least I sure don't know who that is, nor do I care.

I had an appointment last week to have my heat pump replaced - booked it online, sent a screen shot of the error message, and confirmed the loaner car. It was very slick and worked perfectly for me. Still, I can see times where sending text messages would be cumbersome and actually talking to someone on the phone would be far more productive and efficient. Both methods have their place and that's part of people's complaint. Just like the times when you actually need to talk to a person at the bank and all you get is an endless phone tree.

 

[sleepydoc]

You can’t claim fault with Tesla if that is just your personal dislike. Fault would be when bunch of people would get in to the accident bc of Tesla phantom brake for example. When faults happen they are recalled either Voluntarily by Tesla or forced by NHTSA. As I said I might not rave about suspension but I know why it is what it is. Stuff like HUD, lights in mirrors, cross traffic alerts, CarPlay’s or any other thing I can live without just fine and so far had no need nor missed in Tesla. I can tell about two faults I had. Year 2 HVAC actuator broke fixed by warranty claim, year 3 rear seat belt sensor went bad (used by my kids all the time) fixed by warranty. And that is about it. Zero expenses on maintenance or gas and I get 400kW of free charging during 12-6am a month. We drove our little M3 all over in past 3 years. GA-Florida, Ga-NJ multiple times again zero problems. Did I experience minor slow downs? You bet I did. Was it dangerous? Hell no. In most cases I knew what caused minor freak out. Also it has improved dramatically in past 3 years. I know one spot on Florida Interstate where car slows down a lot and wants me to get off the interstate and get right on it so it must be GPS mapping mistake or something. That is about it I can say or complain.

...and proving my point again.