Let's try this again. Do we know for a fact that "85kWh battery is limited to ~370kW max output" (for any flavor of Model S)? If so, can you post a link to the official statement indicating that? Thanks.
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I would love to see an official statement with the effective power available to the driver, and at which speed. A bit unfortunate that information available before (416 hp (310 kW) 5,000-8,600 rpm) is not available anymore, to be able to make comparisons. True, the straightforward 0-60 number is mind-blowing, but it would be interesting to see which effective power is available at Autobahn speeds (160-200 kms/h), for example. One can easily reach 155 mph with 300bhp, but it would fantastic if 600 bhp would indeed still be available at those speeds, that's top of the range AMG/M/RS territory!
No, we don't know it for a fact. It is only an educated guess.
But you already knew that. I won't go into speculating about why you are opposing it right now and to me.
You posited in that without critique: http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/show...5-and-P85?highlight=battery+power+motor+limit
That power is *never* available.
Actually I didn't know for sure, that's why I was asking. What I noted in that thread was that my car has reported 363 before, but that's includes all kinds of things beyond the battery capability -- including firmware.
Anyway, thanks for the link to the thread. That's a pretty solid looking educated guess.
Sounds like Tesla is running higher C-rate from the existing kWh, per ra-san's comments up thread.
GSP
Johan
Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
Official 0-60 of 3.2 could mean sub 3 seconds under very optimal conditions (100% battery, cold drivevtrain, great tires). Remember many haven proven better 0-60 times than Tesla's official one.
I did a 4.1 second 0-100 kmph run in my car for example, with stock tires.
I did a 4.1 second 0-100 kmph run in my car for example, with stock tires.
Johan
Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
Weird, the blog entry below doesn't mention anything about power, just 50% torque increase, and no mention of 691 bhp, which should be something to gloat about:
http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/dual-motor-model-s-and-autopilot
http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/dual-motor-model-s-and-autopilot
Johan
Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
... or one way to look at it would be that apart from going in a straight line full throttle most of the time you're not pushing both motors 100% so perhaps the D will go in to limp mode later since most of the time neither of the motors are running as hard as the one motor in a RWD car, thus producing less heat per motor (but perhaps the same or even at bit more added up).
It all depends on where the limitation is - something that I don't think has been conclusively established so far.
The most cogent argument I saw built the case that the power limiting comes from a computer model for the temperature of the drive motor rotor - one of the few parts that can't be easily instrumented; the testing indicated that the limiter showed up the same way regardless of the actual temperature of the pack and motor at the start of the test.
If you accept that assumption, the P85D should be at least as good as the existing cars and likely far better, depending on how it is driven. With two motors being cooled, it'll be able to handle the maximum power the P85 had for a lot longer, and recover faster. OTOH, if the extra power the D has is used regularly, it might get into the same limiters at a similar rate (but the car would still be going faster because you're using more power to get there.) It would still seem like it should recover a lot faster at a given power level with two sets of motor cooling (assuming the rest of the cooling system can keep up, of course.)
It's too bad that the beautiful screen full of component temperatures I saw in a couple screen shots is apparently only available to Rangers. It would make figuring this stuff out so much easier, and might open the door to ways to improve the performance...
Walter
Johan
Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
To add to this, which I agree With fully, it would be cool if the P85D could incoorporate either indirectly measured or estimated motor temp in to the algorithm of how much power to allocate to front v.s. rear motor so that you could go hard for longer without overheating. I doubt they have done this though, as I believe not even the P85D is a track car.
If Tesla was serious about making it a track car, they could get a pretty good read on the actual rotor temperature by measuring the rate it transfers heat into the coolant - measure the coolant temperature going into the motor and coming out of the motor and the flow rate, then do a little heat transfer math. That would allow them to only limit when the car was actually pushing safety limits instead of when it possibly could be.
I have no reason to suspect that they have done this, or are even considering it.
Walter
Johan
Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
Agreed. A stripped down 2-seater P85D in carbon fiber, with beefed up cooling and track tuned suspension might be a half-decent track car. But Tesla will come out with a super car sooner or later and when they do, oh man, it will be the best ever.
Yeah, watched a clip about a super car and evidently it's in the plans. Saw an interview with Elon where he eluded to getting into racing once supply begins to match demand. If they could do a quick battery swap they would offer up stiff competition. Love to see a Tesla flying around Sebring.
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