Russia/Ukraine conflict

[iPlug]

Interesting . To be more accurate, CNN says “will likely send Ukraine long-range ATACMS, or Army Tactical Missile Systems, for the first time as part of the new aid package, three of the sources said.” Was on Ukraine’s wish list:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1782835293218845116

 

[iPlug]

Off to Biden’s desk:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1782840793301975078

 

[DanCar]

Off to Biden’s desk:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1782840793301975078

That doesn't appear accurate, although it could become accurate soon. What was passed, was a procedural hurdle, limiting debate. Debate has been limited to 30 hours although could end sooner.

Senate tees up Ukraine, Israel aid bill for final passage

The Senate on Tuesday advanced the House-passed supplemental funding package to provide long-awaited aid to Ukraine, Israel and other allies, teeing up the legislation for final passage. Senators v…

thehill.com

Quote:
The Senate on Tuesday advanced the House-passed supplemental funding package to provide long-awaited aid to Ukraine, Israel and other allies, teeing up the legislation for final passage.

Senators voted 80-19 to limit debate on the $95 billion foreign aid package, which includes $61 billion for Ukraine, ...

A final vote could take place as early as Tuesday night if both parties yield back enough of the 30 hours required between cloture and final passage. If no time is yielded back, a final passage vote would be set for Wednesday night.

 

[Crutonius]

Well we have to wait for Rand Paul to obstruct as much as he can. He pretty much obstructs everything.

 

[iPlug]

That doesn't appear accurate, although it could become accurate soon. What was passed, was a procedural hurdle, limiting debate. Debate has been limited to 30 hours although could end sooner.

Senate tees up Ukraine, Israel aid bill for final passage

The Senate on Tuesday advanced the House-passed supplemental funding package to provide long-awaited aid to Ukraine, Israel and other allies, teeing up the legislation for final passage. Senators v…

thehill.com

Quote:
The Senate on Tuesday advanced the House-passed supplemental funding package to provide long-awaited aid to Ukraine, Israel and other allies, teeing up the legislation for final passage.

Senators voted 80-19 to limit debate on the $95 billion foreign aid package, which includes $61 billion for Ukraine, ...

A final vote could take place as early as Tuesday night if both parties yield back enough of the 30 hours required between cloture and final passage. If no time is yielded back, a final passage vote would be set for Wednesday night.

Good catch. Should have double checked on my end. Looks like they jumped the gun.

 

[wdolson]

The US and the Military Industrial Complex is gaining huge amounts of information from the war in Ukraine.

In Ukraine, New American Technology Won the Day. Until It Was Overwhelmed.

This reminds me of the US Civil War. A lot of European observers showed up to watch the war unfold. They took their lessons home and developed new tech based on what they learned. A lot of that tech was introduced to European battlefields in the First World War.

The Spanish Civil War was a training ground for WW II in a similar fashion. Germany used it as a testing ground to fine tune their equipment.

I hope history doesn't repeat and this isn't a training ground for the next global conflict. There was 50 years between the US Civil War and WW I, so it could be a while. This war is the dawn of the drones though. The next major war will feature drones heavily, but there will also be much better counter measures too.

That doesn't appear accurate, although it could become accurate soon. What was passed, was a procedural hurdle, limiting debate. Debate has been limited to 30 hours although could end sooner.

Senate tees up Ukraine, Israel aid bill for final passage

The Senate on Tuesday advanced the House-passed supplemental funding package to provide long-awaited aid to Ukraine, Israel and other allies, teeing up the legislation for final passage. Senators v…

thehill.com

Quote:
The Senate on Tuesday advanced the House-passed supplemental funding package to provide long-awaited aid to Ukraine, Israel and other allies, teeing up the legislation for final passage.

Senators voted 80-19 to limit debate on the $95 billion foreign aid package, which includes $61 billion for Ukraine, ...

A final vote could take place as early as Tuesday night if both parties yield back enough of the 30 hours required between cloture and final passage. If no time is yielded back, a final passage vote would be set for Wednesday night.

Once cloture is broken (the 60 vote margin) then the final vote is just a simple majority. With 80 voting to end cloture, that virtually guarantees that it will pass quickly once the final vote is held.

It looks like nothing nefarious was slipped into the bill which is good news all around.

 

[BitJam]

Everyone please stop posting about the US 'border crisis'. It is no longer linked to the Russia-Ukraine war now that the vote is behind us, and inevitably leads to political bickering, which we do not want in this thread.

This forum has been a platform for spreading these right-wing lies for months. The lies aren't deleted and AFAIK the liars aren't banned while we get chastised for or forbidden from trying to correct them. Allowing the lies to spread and forbidding rebuttal is a terrible look. It makes it seem like the mods are zealously perusing a right-wing agenda while trying to appear even-handed.

 

[DanCar]

Final passage of Ukraine aid in U.S. Senate. Similar articles:

1. https://www.politico.com/live-updates/2024/04/23/congress/congress-passes-ukraine-israel-aid-taiwan-senate-00154006
2. https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/23/politics/senate-vote-foreign-aid/index.html
3. Senate approves $95B aid package for Ukraine and Israel, TikTok divestment, awaits Biden's signature
4. Senate passes Ukraine, Israel funding after months-long stalemate
5. Senate passes $95 foreign aid bill, as DoD eyes next Ukraine weapons package - Breaking Defense
6. Congress sends Ukraine, Israel, Taiwan aid package to president’s desk

Biden says he will sign the bill into law as soon as it reaches his desk tomorrow and weapons will start to reach Ukraine this week:

Senate passes Ukraine aid, Israel funding and TikTok crackdown, sending bill to Biden's desk

The package of foreign aid and a TikTok divest-or-ban provision is expected to be signed into law by President Joe Biden in the coming days.

www.nbcnews.com

 

[wdolson]

Final passage of Ukraine aid in U.S. Senate. Similar articles:

1. https://www.politico.com/live-updates/2024/04/23/congress/congress-passes-ukraine-israel-aid-taiwan-senate-00154006
2. https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/23/politics/senate-vote-foreign-aid/index.html
3. Senate approves $95B aid package for Ukraine and Israel, TikTok divestment, awaits Biden's signature
4. Senate passes Ukraine, Israel funding after months-long stalemate
5. Senate passes $95 foreign aid bill, as DoD eyes next Ukraine weapons package - Breaking Defense
6. Congress sends Ukraine, Israel, Taiwan aid package to president’s desk

Biden says he will sign the bill into law as soon as it reaches his desk tomorrow and weapons will start to reach Ukraine this week:

Senate passes Ukraine aid, Israel funding and TikTok crackdown, sending bill to Biden's desk

The package of foreign aid and a TikTok divest-or-ban provision is expected to be signed into law by President Joe Biden in the coming days.

www.nbcnews.com

Biden is a master at getting what he wants from Congress. Last year Biden laid out a $104 billion aid package for Ukraine, Taiwan, Israel, as well as refugees, He got $95 billion of it and he was willing to compromise on the border bill to get it, but in the end the border bill died along the way. That's a pretty big win politically, as well as a major boost for the people who need the aid.

It took longer than I would have liked, and I was very skeptical this would happen, but it is headed for Biden's desk. I believe it now!

In two years of war the US has sent about $41 billion. This is $60 billion for about one year. That's a big increase.

 

[iPlug]

Back at it, celebrating house/senate package passage, perhaps:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1782980724754452621

 

[AudubonB]

This forum has been a platform for spreading these right-wing lies for months. The lies aren't deleted and AFAIK the liars aren't banned while we get chastised for or forbidden from trying to correct them. Allowing the lies to spread and forbidding rebuttal is a terrible look. It makes it seem like the mods are zealously perusing a right-wing agenda while trying to appear even-handed.

Thank you.
I just witnessed for the first time ever our entire extended family, at dinner, simultaneously choke and guffaw.
You’re not wholly to blame: I’ll take 50% of that by being the one to recite to them your comment.

 

[Skipdd]

Very interesting perspective on why the Biden administration shifted course on long range ATACMS.

. Major Yuri Shvets, KGB defector:
The United States finally concluded that Russia must suffer a devastating defeat in Ukraine.
1,000+ long-range ATACMS (300km+) allocated for Ukraine are in Europe for over a month already.
Video: Oct 2023 ATACMS strikes on Russian airfield.”

https://twitter.com/x/status/1782944547443716524

 

[SwedishAdvocate]

And the Russian Dictator's economy is ~30% bigger than the economy of Spain... No offense to any Spanish readers of course.

Some more on this. A 4-part thread on X. Have only read the first post. But...

"
...] As reported by @JeffSonnenfeld and his team at Yale: “The IMF Russia Desk economists have “basically zero visibility” into what is actually going on in the Russian economy. [...]

Putin now refuses to disclose major economic indicators ranging from foreign trade data, monthly output data on oil and gas, capital inflows and outflows, financial statements of major companies, central bank monetary base data, foreign direct investment data, domestic value added by industry, and lending and loan origination data. Even Rosaviatsiya, Russia’s federal air transport agency, has stopped publishing data on air passenger volumes. Yet these are the major high-frequency flow statistics that go into the construction of an economy-wide GDP forecast for any nation–from the U.S. to China.

Thus, the IMF simply does not have the data needed to independently calculate Russia’s GDP by any accepted method–whether it’s by expenditures, production, or incomes. They are flying blind, with the Russian institutions offering zero visibility.” [My u.] [...
"

twitter.com/Beefeater_Fella/status/1783131754464731231

https://twitter.com/x/status/1783131754464731231

 

[DanCar]

Article has some behind the scenes politics for getting the bill approved. Mostly about giving the speaker of the house a clear picture of the security situation and trying to be friendly.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/24/politics/white-house-ukraine-funding-push/index.html

 

[iPlug]

Done:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1783149174889894096

 

[DanCar]

Biden Administration Announces Significant New Security Assistance for Ukraine

DOD announced significant new security assistance to urgently meet Ukraine's critical security and defense needs.

www.defense.gov

Estimated value of $1 billion in arms being sent to Ukraine:

1. Air defense missiles: RIM-7 and AIM-9M
2. Stinger anti-aircraft missiles
3. Additional ammunition for High Mobility Artillery Rocket Systems (HIMARS)
4. 155mm artillery rounds, including High Explosive and Dual Purpose Improved Conventional Munitions rounds
5. 105mm artillery rounds
6. 60mm mortar rounds
7. Bradley Infantry Fighting Vehicles
8. Mine Resistant Ambush Protected Vehicles (MRAPs)
9. High Mobility Multipurpose Wheeled Vehicles (HMMWVs)
10. Tactical vehicles to tow and haul equipment
11. Tube-Launched, Optically-Tracked, Wire-Guided (TOW) missiles
12. Javelin and AT-4 anti-armor systems
13. Precision aerial munitions
14. Anti-armor mines
15. Demolitions munitions for obstacle clearing
16. Night vision devices
17. ...

Interesting that ATACMS aren't on the list unless they are under the HIMARS item.

 

[DanCar]

ATACMS already being used in Ukraine according to anonymous U.S. officials and national security council official. Used to attack Crimea and Russian helicopters. Similar articles:

1. Ukraine uses long-range ATACMS against Russia for the first time
2. Ukraine uses long-range missiles secretly provided by US to hit Russian-held areas, officials say
3. https://www.reuters.com/world/us/us-quietly-shipped-long-range-atacms-missiles-ukraine-2024-04-24/
4. https://www.politico.com/news/2024/04/24/us-long-range-missiles-ukraine-00154110
5. https://www.nytimes.com/2024/04/24/us/us-ukraine-russia-missiles.html
6. Ukraine uses long-range ATACMS against Russia for the first time

 

[Webeevdrivers]

Biden Administration Announces Significant New Security Assistance for Ukraine

DOD announced significant new security assistance to urgently meet Ukraine's critical security and defense needs.

www.defense.gov

Estimated value of $1 billion in arms being sent to Ukraine:

1. Air defense missiles: RIM-7 and AIM-9M
2. Stinger anti-aircraft missiles
3. Additional ammunition for High Mobility Artillery Rocket Systems (HIMARS)
4. 155mm artillery rounds, including High Explosive and Dual Purpose Improved Conventional Munitions rounds
5. 105mm artillery rounds
6. 60mm mortar rounds
7. Bradley Infantry Fighting Vehicles
8. Mine Resistant Ambush Protected Vehicles (MRAPs)
9. High Mobility Multipurpose Wheeled Vehicles (HMMWVs)
10. Tactical vehicles to tow and haul equipment
11. Tube-Launched, Optically-Tracked, Wire-Guided (TOW) missiles
12. Javelin and AT-4 anti-armor systems
13. Precision aerial munitions
14. Anti-armor mines
15. Demolitions munitions for obstacle clearing
16. Night vision devices
17. ...

Interesting that ATACMS aren't on the list unless they are under the HIMARS item.

Help out an uninformed non American. So the bill only has 1 billion of military aid for Ukraine?

 

[jerry33]

Help out an uninformed non American. So the bill only has 1 billion of military aid for Ukraine?

I believe that is what each billion consists of. The amount was something like $90B. Correction $60B not 90.

 

[SmokyPeat]

About $60B is designated for Ukraine from the aid bill. A good chunk of that will go toward restocking depleted US military stockpiles, though. The $1B in weapons to Ukraine is just the first installment.