This shows clearly who the trolls are. Only a troll would blame autopilot. As I wrote earlier, autopilot is NOT self driving. The 2017 Mercedes has a similar system to Tesla, although according to reviews, the Mercedes system is not as good. Both are driving aids. If someone suddenly appears in front, blocking the road, the driver has to try to avoid the collision. In a few years, when self driving cars become available, people can blame the system if it fails to avoid an avoidable accident. Unfortunately, things happen on the road that will sometimes result in an accident and a fatality, no matter what. That is why driving is so dangerous.
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FredTMC
Model S VIN #4925
Yea. Clearly Autopilot did NOT cause this unfortunate accident. In this case, It didn't help prevent it either. Many times AP DOES help but not this time.
Sorry but anything on that would be complete speculation. All it does is give fake financial sites and some of the lazy real ones quotes to attack TSLA. So unless you want a self-fulfilling prophecy what is the point? The NHTSA will do whatever it decides is best. A recall for A/P is just ridiculous, but stranger things have happened.
Or the fact that the European Union requires guardrails under those trailers that stop cars before their windshields can crash into the trailers.
flankspeed8
Member
It had been pointed out several times in this thread that this accident happened in May in response to your post saying that it happened last night. A search of the news that Curt posted offered the name and location of the deceased which points to his Youtube channel that has had no posts in the last two months. It was pretty evident early on that this was the same Joshua Brown, age 40 from Ohio.
Don't let one ignore discourage you. I thought it was a legit post asking for a different perspective versus one offered by a so-called expert in that Bloomberg interview.
Also, please understand even being a messenger of a counterpoint, however well intentioned, will not be received well here due to a lot of bad news that TSLA and Tesla has had recently. The timing of this on is especially hard to swallow given we were all anticipating the salve of the Q2 Delivery announcement to help heal the financial wounds most of us have been succumbed to.
I totally understand. I bought TSLA around $35 and sold it to finance an entire month vacation to Europe. Recently bought back in because I still love this company. I have little doubt in the long term but as a short term thread, I figured the Bloomberg perspective would be appreciated
I totally understand. I bought TSLA around $35 and sold it to finance an entire month vacation to Europe. Recently bought back in because I still love this company. I have little doubt in the long term but as a short term thread, I figured the Bloomberg perspective would be appreciated
What made a few warning lights go on was your mentioning the word that rhymes with "pee call". The bots pick these things up and sometimes it has an effect upon stock price. That's probably not true in this event since the story is in the media right now, but it's the reason why some members spell that hot stuff you roast marshmallows over as "f*re."
You bringing it to our attention is appreciated. The article itself, not so much. I find the NHTSA's timing to be interesting.I totally understand. I bought TSLA around $35 and sold it to finance an entire month vacation to Europe. Recently bought back in because I still love this company. I have little doubt in the long term but as a short term thread, I figured the Bloomberg perspective would be appreciated
The "Center for Auto Safety" appears to be legitimate, if a bit rabid. It was founded by Ralph Nader a long time ago, I think because of the Ford Pinto problems. My first thought was that it was one of those fake "centers" or "institutes" with a nice sounding name that is really a front for people with a monetary agenda.
Maybe because, as a lobbying and advocacy group, they get donations and notoriety?
We simply don't have enough information about the circumstances of the accident. Tesla might, along with a few others. To discuss recall without enough information is just trolling.
Obituary of former Navy Seal Joshua Brown: Joshua D. Brown's Obituary on Murrysville Star
From today’s New York Times article:
In Iraq in 2006, he said, Mr. Brown played a crucial role in preparing captured explosive projectiles for shipment to the United States to support efforts to improve the armor on military vehicles.
“He did it by being very aggressive,” Mr. Hammer said, noting that Mr. Brown helped to collect the projectiles after raids on bomb-making shops and would X-ray them to determine their contents.
Brown’s YouTube channel in which his overriding interest appears to be Tesla autopilot: Joshua Brown
From today’s New York Times article:
In Iraq in 2006, he said, Mr. Brown played a crucial role in preparing captured explosive projectiles for shipment to the United States to support efforts to improve the armor on military vehicles.
“He did it by being very aggressive,” Mr. Hammer said, noting that Mr. Brown helped to collect the projectiles after raids on bomb-making shops and would X-ray them to determine their contents.
Brown’s YouTube channel in which his overriding interest appears to be Tesla autopilot: Joshua Brown
jhm
Well-Known Member
From On Evagrius, the Desert Fathers, and the seven deadly sins: An afternoon with William Harmless
The ignore list works well too.
Edit. This was not in response to Joshua Brown's passing.
Rest in peace, Joshua. Blessings and peace for all who knew you and loved you.
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Sorry. Tried to ignore you by blocking you on my cell...unfortunately didn't take. Thank you for yet another pedantic, insensitive, trolling response to a dead former Navy Seal. As a former naval officer I'm exceedingly interested in your anecdotal perspective from a low speed mishap with a bicyclist....that is oh so close to a high speed, fatal crash between a semi and a Tesla. I'm surprised your incident wasn't sited in the report on the accident. Your citing of a drivers handbook is just another data point to better understand the one and two dimensional viewpoints you bring to this thread. I will ask you to just please stop, but like a tree falling in the woods, I won't know if you ever make another sound. Don't go away mad, just go away.
My bet is charges are pending against the Truck driver. Tesla probably wouldn't have commented if Tesla's lawyers felt there was even a small chance Auto Pilot didn't function as intended, or that the accident wouldn't have happened if AutoPilot wasn't active.
This incident sounds almost identical to the trailer hitch incident. Any gasoline vehicle in the same situation would have been completely crushed and probably exploded.
1) The NY Times claim that the US is investigating Tesla is wrong.
2) There is no investigation by the NHTSA. The NHTSA is collecting all available data, probably due to a request from Tesla. Tesla proactively contacted the NHTSA.
3) I have not seen any proof that charges are pending against Tesla.
4) There is no scenario that ends in Tesla recalling all Tesla with autopilot. Worst case scenario, Tesla might need to disable autopilot until the matter is resolved.
5) The accident and death most likely would have happened even if AutoPilot wasn't active.
This incident sounds almost identical to the trailer hitch incident. Any gasoline vehicle in the same situation would have been completely crushed and probably exploded.
1) The NY Times claim that the US is investigating Tesla is wrong.
2) There is no investigation by the NHTSA. The NHTSA is collecting all available data, probably due to a request from Tesla. Tesla proactively contacted the NHTSA.
3) I have not seen any proof that charges are pending against Tesla.
4) There is no scenario that ends in Tesla recalling all Tesla with autopilot. Worst case scenario, Tesla might need to disable autopilot until the matter is resolved.
5) The accident and death most likely would have happened even if AutoPilot wasn't active.
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Today's Associated Press article on Brown accident: Tesla driver killed in crash while using car's 'Autopilot'
Excerpts:
Frank Baressi, 62, the driver of the truck and owner of Okemah Express LLC, said the Tesla driver was "playing Harry Potter on the TV screen" at the time of the crash and driving so quickly that "he went so fast through my trailer I didn't see him."
"It was still playing when he died and snapped a telephone pole a quarter mile down the road," Baressi told The Associated Press in an interview from his home in Palm Harbor, Florida. He acknowledged he couldn't see the movie, only heard it.
Tesla Motors Inc. said it is not possible to watch videos on the Model S touch screen. There was no reference to the movie in initial police reports.
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Brown was an enthusiastic booster of his 2015 Tesla Model S and in April credited its sophisticated Autopilot system for avoiding a crash when a commercial truck swerved into his lane on an interstate. He published a video of the incident online. "Hands down the best car I have ever owned and use it to its full extent," Brown wrote.
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NHTSA's Office of Defects is handling the investigation. The opening of the preliminary evaluation shouldn't be construed as a finding that the government believes the Model S is defective, NHTSA said in a statement.
Excerpts:
Frank Baressi, 62, the driver of the truck and owner of Okemah Express LLC, said the Tesla driver was "playing Harry Potter on the TV screen" at the time of the crash and driving so quickly that "he went so fast through my trailer I didn't see him."
"It was still playing when he died and snapped a telephone pole a quarter mile down the road," Baressi told The Associated Press in an interview from his home in Palm Harbor, Florida. He acknowledged he couldn't see the movie, only heard it.
Tesla Motors Inc. said it is not possible to watch videos on the Model S touch screen. There was no reference to the movie in initial police reports.
…
Brown was an enthusiastic booster of his 2015 Tesla Model S and in April credited its sophisticated Autopilot system for avoiding a crash when a commercial truck swerved into his lane on an interstate. He published a video of the incident online. "Hands down the best car I have ever owned and use it to its full extent," Brown wrote.
…
NHTSA's Office of Defects is handling the investigation. The opening of the preliminary evaluation shouldn't be construed as a finding that the government believes the Model S is defective, NHTSA said in a statement.
One can start a digital sleuthing here: Electronic Court & Records Access » Levy County Clerk of Court
More details known about the accident would lead to a better search, especially the defendant (i.e., truck driver).
Edit 1: Thanks to Curt Renz's post above, the truck driver's name is Frank Baressi. I did a quick search and no charges are filed yet and made of record in Levy County's court system.
On the brighter side, over at the June Model X deliveries thread, a few owners were surprised by their delivery specialists and given a chance to pick up their vehicles today, earlier than expected. I saw no reports today of people who planned to pick up but the vehicle wasn't ready. Looks like a good end to the quarter, from a delivery standpoint.
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Stretch2727
Engineer and Car Nut
On the time he would have had to react assuming the truck was going 30MPH across the road after the left turn.
30 MPH = 44 feet per second.
Typical 2 Lane Highway Width = 24 feet
Length of typical tractor trailer = 65 feet.
24 + 30 = 54 feet = 54 ft (assuming the front of the cab was about 30 feet past the right highway lane for him to hit the open center of the truck).
54 Feet traveled/44 Feet/Sec = 1.13 Seconds.
I am not including the wide center area between the divided highway and assuming reaction time only as the truck entered the oncoming highway lanes.
Over 1 second is plenty of time for him to at least hit the brakes.
Even if the truck was going 60 MPH (highly unlikely after a left turn) this is 0.5 sec.
That he did not hit the brake seems to indicate he either was blinded by the sun or not paying attention. He was traveling east at 3PM in the afternoon which means the sun would be behind him.
30 MPH = 44 feet per second.
Typical 2 Lane Highway Width = 24 feet
Length of typical tractor trailer = 65 feet.
24 + 30 = 54 feet = 54 ft (assuming the front of the cab was about 30 feet past the right highway lane for him to hit the open center of the truck).
54 Feet traveled/44 Feet/Sec = 1.13 Seconds.
I am not including the wide center area between the divided highway and assuming reaction time only as the truck entered the oncoming highway lanes.
Over 1 second is plenty of time for him to at least hit the brakes.
Even if the truck was going 60 MPH (highly unlikely after a left turn) this is 0.5 sec.
That he did not hit the brake seems to indicate he either was blinded by the sun or not paying attention. He was traveling east at 3PM in the afternoon which means the sun would be behind him.
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