Supercharger - Newark, CA - Gateway Boulevard (LIVE 12 Oct 2023, 22 V3 stalls)

[bmah]

Photos by Ajay Chand, posted to the Facebook group for Tesla Owners of the East Bay and used with permission. He gives the location as being behind the Aloft Hotel, with an estimated 18 stalls.

@corywright @Big Earl @homero89

Bruce.

 

[Zorg]

Right off Dumbarton bridge when driving east. Nice

 

[Watts_Up]

I wonder how Tesla decides between installing drive-in stalls (like above) instead of back-up stalls (more common) ?

- If Tesla plans to add more Magic Docks for CCS compatibility, a driving-in stall seems to be more practical solution.

 

[LastBommer]

next to Lucid... make sense.

 

[BigDaddyKevin]

next to Lucid... make sense.

don't matter, Lucid going bankrupt if Elon keep lowering the price of Teslas

 

[tivoboy]

Yay, another pull in.

 

[Mario Veras]

I wonder how Tesla decides between installing drive-in stalls (like above) instead of back-up stalls (more common) ?

- If Tesla plans to add more Magic Docks for CCS compatibility, a driving-in stall seems to be more practical solution.

With the initiative to install “Magic Docks” it makes sense to install them in this new configuration so that no matter how you drive into the space, forward or backward, you can use the charger. This will help with the cable reaching to the charging port on other vehicles without people having to take up two spaces.

 

[geordi]

It’s still going to be a hassle for people with trailers, but only by blocking the road or having enough backspace (toward the building / other parking) to get at the slot if they nose-in to the chargers.

I like some of the locations that have them in large parking lots WITHOUT giant curbs everywhere, so that people towing can be “creative” at positioning for the charger rather than having to block half the stalls.

Thankfully the number of other owners who have given grief about the charger use when towing has been very low (just one arsehole) but of course we have the truck-bros and ICEing to deal with. More options are always better.

 

[Mrbrock]

With the initiative to install “Magic Docks” it makes sense to install them in this new configuration so that no matter how you drive into the space, forward or backward, you can use the charger. This will help with the cable reaching to the charging port on other vehicles without people having to take up two spaces.

Only works if ports are front passenger or back driver side. A Lightning backing in would need the charge post on the driver side which would be the post for the spot next door for a Tesla, essentially taking up 2 spaces.

 

[Mario Veras]

Only works if ports are front passenger or back driver side. A Lightning backing in would need the charge post on the driver side which would be the post for the spot next door for a Tesla, essentially taking up 2 spaces.

Yes but with this new configuration it is possible to use all chargers whereas in the old config it is impossible to use all chargers.

Though in reality car manufacturers should’ve given this some thought and not make different cars with charging ports in different places. They should’ve standardized this. We’re not charging cellphones here.

 

[Mrbrock]

Yes but with this new configuration it is possible to use all chargers whereas in the old config it is impossible to use all chargers.

Though in reality car manufacturers should’ve given this some thought and not make different cars with charging ports in different places. They should’ve standardized this. We’re not charging cellphones here.

If there is only 1 car at the site that doesn’t have a rear driver charge port AND it takes the far left stall then teslas can fill the rest of the spots but if a non Tesla standard port takes any other stall, it will prevent a Tesla from parking in the intended stall and charging. Period. There’s no ifs and's or butts about it. They would need 2 posts for each stall (front and back) to prevent this from happening. Like at the Fremont factory charging cars after they are built.

 

[Mrbrock]

Here is the factory charger layout. V2 at the top with 2 pedestals per stall so they can be accessed from either side without affecting the other adjacent stalls. V3 at the bottom where they only did 1 pedestal per stall so all vehicles have to enter from the left. Technically there are 100 chargers (72 V2, 28V3) but only 36 of the V2 are usable so each parking space has access to the full 150kw from its cabinet.

Whether you install double the amount of posts as parking stalls or lose half the amount of stalls due to non-Tesla standard charge port layouts, the result is the same. Only half of a site is usable. One is just less frustrating to users because you will never pull into a spot and find it unusable. "V4" might help things but I still think the cables are too short to reach all ports. Placing in the center back of each stall with the longer cords should alleviate many of the problems as all ports should be within 10 feet of the front or back of the vehicle.

To bring this back to Newark, I think this is 24 stalls. There are 12 in a row at the front of the picture, then another row of 5 or so at the end and 3 back in to the left with more (4?) pedestal bases uninstalled. This will be in additional to the two Destination Chargers (and two Clipper Creek J1772) already on site.

 

[Mario Veras]

The perfect configuration would be placing the stall in the center of the line dividing the parking spaces and then have two long cables for each stall. So no matter where the port is located or how you park (front first or rear first) everyone can charge and no spaces would be wasted. Although this would require the parking spaces to be a bit wider than usual to minimize the chance of idiots hitting and breaking the stalls.

Another configuration that should work is the same as what Tesla has been doing with the stalls at the end of the parking space, but also have another space on the opposite side of the stall and each stall have two cables, one to service each side of the stall. Those with front ports will have to park facing in, and others with charging ports on the back would park their rear into the space. Of course, longer cables are needed to reach whether the port is on the right or left corner of the vehicle.

 

[usrbin]

ChargePoint has unit in center and long cables on both sides, like a gas station.

 

[Mrbrock]

ChargePoint has unit in center and long cables on both sides, like a gas station.

But those are designed to feed two stalls at L2 speeds. DCFC is a different beast. EA has two cables for redundancy.

 

[BigDaddyKevin]

Here is the factory charger layout. V2 at the top with 2 pedestals per stall so they can be accessed from either side without affecting the other adjacent stalls. V3 at the bottom where they only did 1 pedestal per stall so all vehicles have to enter from the left. Technically there are 100 chargers (72 V2, 28V3) but only 36 of the V2 are usable so each parking space has access to the full 150kw from its cabinet.
View attachment 933150
Whether you install double the amount of posts as parking stalls or lose half the amount of stalls due to non-Tesla standard charge port layouts, the result is the same. Only half of a site is usable. One is just less frustrating to users because you will never pull into a spot and find it unusable. "V4" might help things but I still think the cables are too short to reach all ports. Placing in the center back of each stall with the longer cords should alleviate many of the problems as all ports should be within 10 feet of the front or back of the vehicle.

To bring this back to Newark, I think this is 24 stalls. There are 12 in a row at the front of the picture, then another row of 5 or so at the end and 3 back in to the left with more (4?) pedestal bases uninstalled. This will be in additional to the two Destination Chargers (and two Clipper Creek J1772) already on site.
View attachment 933152

sorry what location is that picture from newark?

 

[bmah]

sorry what location is that picture from newark?

Great question. I think it’s behind the Fremont factory. Definitely not Newark.

And that, my friends, is why we try to keep Supercharger threads on topic to a single site. (hint hint).

Bruce.

 

[Mario Veras]

But those are designed to feed two stalls at L2 speeds. DCFC is a different beast. EA has two cables for redundancy.

Why couldn’t Tesla do a 350kw stall, with two cables like EA does, and share the power load when two cars are charging at the same time? I mean, the only time when a Tesla reaches a maximum load demand of 250kw is during the first couple of minutes assuming the battery is properly warmed and the state of charge is below 25%. If the stall can max out at 350kw that means in the odd case when two cars begin charging at the same time, each will receive a maximum of 175kw at the same time. Not a bad speed rate. But again, this will be odd because chances are when someone else arrives to charge, you would probably be further along and your state of charge would be higher and no longer demanding the max of 250kw. You might be at a state of charge where your car is demanding only 100kw, so that leaves about 250kw for the other car, assuming they are at low state of charge. Since Teslas don’t demand more than 250Kw anyway, there is no need to build thicker cables or more robust plugs since the individual demand will never exceed 250kw.

 

[tivoboy]

Why couldn’t Tesla do a 350kw stall, with two cables like EA does, and share the power load when two cars are charging at the same time? I mean, the only time when a Tesla reaches a maximum load demand of 250kw is during the first couple of minutes assuming the battery is properly warmed and the state of charge is below 25%. If the stall can max out at 350kw that means in the odd case when two cars begin charging at the same time, each will receive a maximum of 175kw at the same time. Not a bad speed rate. But again, this will be odd because chances are when someone else arrives to charge, you would probably be further along and your state of charge would be higher and no longer demanding the max of 250kw. You might be at a state of charge where your car is demanding only 100kw, so that leaves about 250kw for the other car, assuming they are at low state of charge. Since Teslas don’t demand more than 250Kw anyway, there is no need to build thicker cables or more robust plugs since the individual demand will never exceed 250kw.

It’s really move than the first couple minutes based on the SOC, temp and availability of power. If I arrive ~ <10%, I can get ~ 250 kWh (over 1050 mph) for at least 5-7 (normally it will start to taper this high charge rate just under <30% SOC, and certainly around 10 minutes at 200 kWh plus for an additional period. More cars coming from Tesla will actually do much better than this for a longer duration into the lower SOC area.

I know we’re sort of splitting hairs here, but if two cars arrive at similar SOC, splitting a 350 kWh feed (or even a 250 kWh feed would either cut this close to half the rate of charge at low SOC (which is really the only place it can occur) or one of the two being severely disadvantaged.

 

[Mario Veras]

It’s really move than the first couple minutes based on the SOC, temp and availability of power. If I arrive ~ <10%, I can get ~ 250 kWh (over 1050 mph) for at least 5-7 (normally it will start to taper this high charge rate just under <30% SOC, and certainly around 10 minutes at 200 kWh plus for an additional period. More cars coming from Tesla will actually do much better than this for a longer duration into the lower SOC area.

I know we’re sort of splitting hairs here, but if two cars arrive at similar SOC, splitting a 350 kWh feed (or even a 250 kWh feed would either cut this close to half the rate of charge at low SOC (which is really the only place it can occur) or one of the two being severely disadvantaged.

Yes I understand the charging rate will be deeply cut when sharing the load. I just think it is a rare thing to happen. Many people arrive with 30% or 40% SOC. People arrive at different times as well so what are the chances of two cars arriving at the same time with the same or similar SOC and try to share the same stall. I just think it’s not a big concern.