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Tesla: A New Order in How Cars Are Sold: Excitement, Disappointment, Faster than Fast

Discussion in 'Tesla Motors' started by MSEV, Apr 8, 2015.

  1. MSEV

    MSEV Member

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    Given the news of the 60 being discontinued, and not so recently the P85 and P85+, previously the 40, I got to thinking.
    The difference in price between the 70 and 85 seems high, with the 70D having more per dollar (now that every model gets SupC, which makes sense).
    If/when the S100D/P100D comes out, the 85 series will be the next to go, I believe, and that may not be too long from now.
    I, personally, was in the middle of waiting for my 85 when the Ds came out, and jumped to the 85D.
    I imagine some were disappointed who had already gotten an 85 but would have liked an 85D.
    My point(s): these changes come quickly with a fast moving company like Tesla.
    New features/models/batteries/technology (D, Xs, 3s, 100kw battery, etc.) are exciting, and I imagine some folks are really excited who were thinking about getting a 60 but now will get a 70D. But some with recent deliveries of their new Model S60kw also have disappointment with the changes.
    THIS IS THE FUTURE and THE FUTURE WITH TESLA.
    Change, and fast.
    Seeing what sells and marketing to it.
    If a model doesn't sell well enough, it is discontinued.
    Maybe always as soon as a better configuration is ready, which is significantly faster than other car companies can even imagine (with ICE vehicles).
    If a new technology or feature is ready, it is unleashed. Right now.
    Be happy with what you have but realize it will be replaced, even faster than your iPad/iPhone/PC/android, etc.
    There is always a better Tesla coming out in the near future.
    And, if you have a Tesla, be thankful you have one of the best/quietest/fastest/coolest cars on the planet,
    except for the model that replaced yours.
     
  2. SabrToothSqrl

    SabrToothSqrl Active Member

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    70D vs 85D

    I have a S85, but admit I'd take a 70D

    seems to give up 100HP, and 40 miles of range from the 85D, but for a $10,000 savings.

    It's faster to 60 than my S85, and AWD, and only gives up 25 miles of EPA from my S85.

    Am I missing something, or is $10,000 at lot of $ for 100 HP and 40 more miles of range?

    The 60 --> 85 was a no brainer with the super charging making it a 8k difference vs. 10k.

    but 10k to go from 70-85... I don't know... I just don't see it as me needing it... my daily commute doesn't need it, and the super chargers are easily met with a 70kWh battery

    is the HP and battery the only difference between a 70D and 85D? for 10k?

    Ohh, and top speed... Which will land you in jail in most states... so... not really an issue for me.
     
  3. Saghost

    Saghost Active Member

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    It's all still theoretical for me, but I tend to agree - when the 60 and 85 were the choices and Superchargers were rather sparse, I figured if I bought it'd definitely be an 85. The 70D is a new ball game - especially if it keeps the ~3-5% efficiency edge that 60s have over 85s (presumed to be largely from lower weight.)

    I'm still waiting not very patiently for the X reveal, but I'm starting to think an X70 might be more likely...
    Walter
     
  4. MikeC

    MikeC Active Member

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    Gotta add on $2500 to enable autopilot with the 70D.
     
  5. Saghost

    Saghost Active Member

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    The 85D also has to spend $2500 for Autopilot, so it isn't any different...
     
  6. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    Any bets the 85 gets replaced with a 95?
     
  7. Saghost

    Saghost Active Member

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    How likely that is will depend greatly on how Tesla got to 70 kWh. In my opinion, the most likely way to get a 70 kWh pack today is for them to use 14 of the same 5.3 kWh modules that are in the 85 kWh pack. This gives the same voltage and layout as the past 60 kWh pack, but ~74 kWh of nominal capacity, and it reduces the number of configurations Tesla has to build and keep track of.

    If they got the new pack that way, I'd say it's fairly unlikely that the 85 will be replaced soon. This is my best guess right now.

    If, on the other hand, the theory I saw in another thread about using the legacy 60 kWh module design and some new 3.6 Ah cells in it is correct, then a 95 or 100 kWh pack from those cells in the 85 module design is a likely development.
     
  8. beeeerock

    beeeerock Active Member

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    Oh, I wouldn't be surprised. And I can tell you EXACTLY when that will happen... once I get a delivery date for my MS that is... because the announcement will come within hours of me accepting the key fob... :rolleyes:
     
  9. Robert.Boston

    Robert.Boston Model S VIN P01536

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    The difference between identical S70D and S85 models is only $5,000, not $10,000. Given the number of times I've used the bottom 25 miles of range on my S85, I wouldn't buy the smaller battery. But I can see why a lot of people would, especially those who live in states that actually have Superchargers.
     
  10. smartypnz

    smartypnz Member

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    Also, 70 makes minimum SC placement a little further.
     
  11. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    Just a matter of time. 100 is a nice even number so maybe they'll hit that mark.
     
  12. ArtInCT

    ArtInCT Always Learning

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    The next big thing will be the X release. We have to watch the battery sizes announced at that time. I wonder if the 70D will be the low end for the X skateboard?
    I gather that quite a few folks are not pleased with the power lift gate's movement into the Premium Interior package?
     
  13. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    Know how you feel. Waited 3.5 years for P85 and P85+ comes out a few months later. Just how Tesla works.
     
  14. Saghost

    Saghost Active Member

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    Not really - they still have a fleet of 60s to support.

    Also, minimum placement was an issue the last couple of years and the next year or maybe two, as they first completed the chains to make something useful. From here on it will become progressively less of an issue as Tesla continues to add stations among the existing ones to handle volume and give options.

    They've already started putting the software in place that will enable them to guide cars around overloaded stations.
    Walter
     
  15. Robert.Boston

    Robert.Boston Model S VIN P01536

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    The 70 replaces the 60. What replaces the 85?
    70/60 * 85 = 99->100.
     
  16. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    Okay then I revise my random speculation to 100.
     
  17. MSEV

    MSEV Member

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    No matter what you get, you might well soon be disappointed with the newer thing Tesla will come out with.
    Progressive. Fast.
    I gotta get used to it...
     
  18. RobStark

    RobStark Active Member

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  19. JRod0802

    JRod0802 Member

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    That makes sense if the 60 received a new chemistry. Relevant thread (most people think it is just more of the same cells, not new cells):
    How did they get to a 70kWh battery pack?
     
  20. MSEV

    MSEV Member

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    I'm only guessing 100.
    I would bet that there will be a newer, bigger Model S sometime, and I am wondering if not sooner rather than later.
    Tesla, in some ways, moves quickly, my original point in this thread.
     

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