Tesla backing away from "Phone Key as primary key"

[diamond.g]

i don't really know what good that would do, since it's supposed to work while the phone is in my pocket. i'm not supposed to have to get the phone out. the phone in my pocket with the screen off is likely a whole other set of variables.

i sent an email to the costa mesa SC (advised to do so by tesla executives when i tried to escalate it). they actually suggested calling, which i've tried 3 times and each time had a wait time of over 40 minutes...no thanks. we'll see what happens when they get back to me, i guess.

Well if Android looks like iOS for the BT screen it would show the connection to the car for the BT Key. Videoing it would be proof to the SC that the modules in your car are busted and not working correctly. Having a BT fob in this case would mean you would press the unlock button if it doesn't recognize you walking up, though if the BT modules are faulty your fob would have likely have the same problem.

 

[crackers8199]

Well if Android looks like iOS for the BT screen it would show the connection to the car for the BT Key. Videoing it would be proof to the SC that the modules in your car are busted and not working correctly. Having a BT fob in this case would mean you would press the unlock button if it doesn't recognize you walking up, though if the BT modules are faulty your fob would have likely have the same problem.

if i'm sitting in the car, i can see the 4 BT devices on the car. whether or not they're going to sleep and not being recognized as i walk up is another question, but like i said it doesn't seem to matter. i've had it work instantly when the car is definitely asleep, and not work when it's definitely not. there's seemingly absolutely no rhyme or reason as to when it works vs when it doesn't.

 

[crackers8199]

alright, new development tonight. as I did my nightly errands, I tried a variation of what diamond.g suggested...every time I walked out of a store, I unlocked my phone and watched the persistent notification. each time, as I got closer to the car, it changed from disconnected to connecting to connected...once I saw connected, I locked the phone and opu it back in my pocket. the car unlocked and allowed me to drive away each time...didn't fail once. a total of 6 stops, 6 re-entries...all perfect.

there must be something going on that is preventing the phone from connecting when the screen is off...even though I have optimization turned off for both Tesla and Bluetooth. I have no idea what else it could be...but I'm going to do a bit more testing with this (see if I get any failures this way), and if not at least we will have a definitive answer as to what the problem is.

how we can fix it without them fixing their app is another question entirely...but at least tonight for the first time in the month I've had the car I feel like I made some progress.

 

[dsvick]

alright, new development tonight. as I did my nightly errands, I tried a variation of what diamond.g suggested...every time I walked out of a store, I unlocked my phone and watched the persistent notification. each time, as I got closer to the car, it changed from disconnected to connecting to connected...once I saw connected, I locked the phone and opu it back in my pocket. the car unlocked and allowed me to drive away each time...didn't fail once. a total of 6 stops, 6 re-entries...all perfect.

Make sure you let Tesla know, either an email or a bug report, that way they have more info.

 

[crackers8199]

Make sure you let Tesla know, either an email or a bug report, that way they have more info.

i plan to, i want to ride out the weekend first with some additional testing to see if i can get it to fail in this manner first (to have the most possible data to give them).

i just ran to the store on lunch, and it *almost* failed on me. it didn't get back to "connecting" and then "connected" until right before i got to the car. last night it was always connecting while i was 50-75 feet away from the car...the other difference here is that this was an extremely quick trip. in and out of the store in less than 5 minutes. i'm wondering if timing might have something to do with it as well, so i'll play around with that this weekend too.

 

[timk225]

I don't think I need another reason to back up my claims of "Phone-as-a-key SUCKS!!!!", but there is one.

If I'm coming out of the store, carrying things and headed to the superior car in the parking lot, my Model 3, the phone usually unlocks the door. But sometimes it doesn't. So I will place the phone on the car roof right over the B pillar, then I have to stand there by the car for 10 seconds or so, being all like "Nah, I don't want to get in my car and go somewhere, I just thought I'd stand right here and look around for no good reason, that's all".

Usually in 10 seconds or so it'll open the door, but for the 1 in 4 times it doesn't, then I have to take everything out of my left hand, dig in my pocket for the key card, pull out the ATM card, put it back, and feel around for the OTHER card, get it out, and get the door open.

My 2011 Challenger R/T never had this problem with its key fob. My old 1971 Plymouth Valiant was equally reliable with its simple old metal key. But the new high tech bluetooth low energy and near field communication Tesla? Not so much.

 

[TT97]

People are going to lose it when Tesla finally makes available a fob and they realize they will still need to wait for the car to wake up before being able to open the door.

 

[kavyboy]

People are going to lose it when Tesla finally makes available a fob and they realize they will still need to wait for the car to wake up before being able to open the door.

Why would it work that way? Serious question. It doesn't on the S/X.

 

[BioSehnsucht]

Why would it work that way? Serious question. It doesn't on the S/X.

Because plenty of times, we experience the problem of having to wait for it to wake up, and then once it has, the phone key immediately works. This implies that at these times, it is not the phone at fault, but the car being asleep.

 

[drawfour]

Because plenty of times, we experience the problem of having to wait for it to wake up, and then once it has, the phone key immediately works. This implies that at these times, it is not the phone at fault, but the car being asleep.

But it doesn't happen that way on the S/X, and the S/X have used BLE fobs since 2016. So clearly they can make sure the part of the car that is needed to process the signals, auth the device, etc... are not sleeping or are quick to wake up...

 

[diamond.g]

But it doesn't happen that way on the S/X, and the S/X have used BLE fobs since 2016. So clearly they can make sure the part of the car that is needed to process the signals, auth the device, etc... are not sleeping or are quick to wake up...

As far as I know the S and X both unlock on approach. The 3 doesn't (anymore) so it is possible the 3 is going into deeper sleep than the other two.

 

[drawfour]

As far as I know the S and X both unlock on approach. The 3 doesn't (anymore) so it is possible the 3 is going into deeper sleep than the other two.

The S does auto-present, sure. Don't know if that's considered an unlock or not. But this is just a software decision either way. The car can keep enough systems awake so that it can detect a fob and authorize it, and then get other systems ready to wait for the handle to be pushed in.

 

[crackers8199]

Because plenty of times, we experience the problem of having to wait for it to wake up, and then once it has, the phone key immediately works. This implies that at these times, it is not the phone at fault, but the car being asleep.

i am 100% sure this is not the issue. plenty of times i have been able to unlock the door with the phone key while teslafi said the car was sleeping.

in my weekend testing so far, i still have not been able to get the phone key to fail as long as i take the phone out of my pocket while walking to the car and wake it up, allowing it to connect. the issue has to be in the way android handles the bluetooth stack when the phone is locked and/or the screen is off. when i wake the phone up and watch the notification as i walk towards the car, it has worked every single time.

 

[Falkirk]

Tesla should really bring back the unlock on approach (as an option) and that might help those of us with troubles opening, give the car time to start waking up, not wait until we're at the door. Could even geofence the option for those who don't like it on everywhere.

I'm now almost telling my kids to run ahead and try the door haha so that when I get there maybe it'll open...not! Most likely I'll need to turn off\on Bluetooth.

I am tempting to just skip the whole phone as key lately and just have my wallet handy which does work just by swiping it and then the car finds my phone by the time I want to leave so no more key card needed to drive.

 

[dsvick]

... for the 1 in 4 times it doesn't, then I have to take everything out of my left hand, dig in my pocket for the key card, pull out the ATM card, put it back, and feel around for the OTHER card, get it out, and get the door open.

Unless you have an overly thick wallet, or one of those security wallets that block signals, you should not have to remove the card from your wallet. Many people have reported it working just fine through an inch, or more, thick wallet.

 

[timk225]

I haven't carried a wallet in many years. It stays in the car with my drivers license and little else in it. And the key card does not work at any amount of range, it has to be right up against the B pillar to do anything.

 

[slipnslider]

The obvious answer is they need to improve the tech, not issue every Tesla model 3 owner 2, $500 key fobs

The issues is they can only improve ONE SIDE of the tech, because the other side is a phone which they don't manufacture or control. As long as they use phones as keys, there will be problems for this reason.

 

[timk225]

The issues is they can only improve ONE SIDE of the tech, because the other side is a phone which they don't manufacture or control. As long as they use phones as keys, there will be problems for this reason.

All the more reason for Tesla to admit that Phone-as-a-key was a colossal FAILURE, and issue me two key fobs for FREE for all the inconvenience I have had to put up with for 4 months.

 

[crackers8199]

the madness continues...my car just updated to 34.1 this afternoon, and tonight walk away lock failed for the first time in a few weeks. it's unreal how while they keep working on "improving the tech," they also keep breaking stuff as they go...

 

[Aellinsar]

Unless you have an overly thick wallet, or one of those security wallets that block signals, you should not have to remove the card from your wallet. Many people have reported it working just fine through an inch, or more, thick wallet.

I have a very slim wallet with only a few cards in it and I have to remove the keycard and put it directly against the pillar to work .