jhm
Well-Known Member
Tesla is selling cars to Hertz at full price. What would you have Tesla do to keep Hertz from buying its cars?
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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
- Start date
Two observations about how the Hertz news is shaping up.
#1. I would like to look past the modestly disappointing news regarding Hertz Sweden (HS) and suggest that the magnanimous hope is that HS still follows Parent Company’s lead and makes a similar arrangement with Volvo, to the tune of making a Polestar deal. I do admit there is something of an existential problem for Volvo, in that its quasi-monopolistic position in the Swedish car market becomes ever more problematic for its ICE vehicles, but that problem exists with or without the intervention of HS.
Such a move by HS does, obviously, not directly benefit Tesla but it absolutely jibes with Mr Musk’s overall goal of an EV revolution.
#2. This is a self-centered, very much Edge Case, but nonetheless important in a specific situation. To me, the Uber tie-up is a disappointment because of its effect of taking off the market one-half of Hertz’s vehicles to “individual” customers, as follows:
May the above not become the case. But I do not have my hopes up.
#1. I would like to look past the modestly disappointing news regarding Hertz Sweden (HS) and suggest that the magnanimous hope is that HS still follows Parent Company’s lead and makes a similar arrangement with Volvo, to the tune of making a Polestar deal. I do admit there is something of an existential problem for Volvo, in that its quasi-monopolistic position in the Swedish car market becomes ever more problematic for its ICE vehicles, but that problem exists with or without the intervention of HS.
Such a move by HS does, obviously, not directly benefit Tesla but it absolutely jibes with Mr Musk’s overall goal of an EV revolution.
#2. This is a self-centered, very much Edge Case, but nonetheless important in a specific situation. To me, the Uber tie-up is a disappointment because of its effect of taking off the market one-half of Hertz’s vehicles to “individual” customers, as follows:
- Tourism is one of three relatively co-equal sectors of Alaska’s economy, along with oil and fishing. The latter two are location-specific; tourism is the one industry that pervades effectively the entire state.
- The car rental business is immensely vital to tourism; if any proof were needed it was demonstrated in the 2021 season when many, many visitors had to cancel their already-planned trips once they found there simply were not any cars for them to rent - a function of the Hertzes and Avises, etc., having pulled their fleet in 2020. I did not keep careful note of how many of our own reservations had to cancel but it was a sizable fraction.
- The unavailability of rental cars exacerbated the already-extant move of tourists making use of the cruise-ship dominated group tours - by bus - which understandably also shunt their clients solely to their own hotels and other facilities, to the exclusion of individually-owned competitive possibilities, like ours. I did say this was self-centered, but the argument remains valid - not only do all such profits flow instantly out of Alaska, but even most of these operators’ employees are out-of-state, seasonal workers, so the economic Multiplier Effect to the Alaskan economy is minuscule.
- Uber is NOT a viable option as the Alaskan tourist typically rents a car not for driving/being driven around Anchorage, but for a 500-2000 mile, 7-20 day trip.
- Initially, I had high hopes for the Tesla-Hertz tie-up because I thought that Hertz’s large presence in Alaska just might also then provide the so-badly needed impetus for Tesla and others finally to provide Alaska with a Supercharger (etc) network. This goal may not yet be extinguished, but once again, the halved number of traditional Hertz Teslas perforce suggests that many fewer may be made available to the Alaskan fleet - once again, we are shunted aside.
Artful Dodger
"Neko no me"
You have it exactly backwards. Anti-trust laws are to prevent or lower barriers to entry. Tesla has not yet entered the rental or ride-hailing markets. There is no way whatsoever that antitrust laws could be used to prevent them from entering that market.
Consumer protection laws are to protect the consumer (usually by ensuring competitive markets), not to protect incumbents. In this market, Hertz and Uber are the inumbents.
Greetings from "the other thread" - do you mind if we make it $1298? Asking for a friend.
Indeed, so far CNBC has only uploaded the tax portion of this morning's Ron Baron interview. I recorded the interview, and it is extremely pro-Tesla and pro-Elon. Since Tesla does not pay for advertising on CNBC and its competitors do, this slight is unsurprising.Nothing on Youtube from CNBC yet on Ron's segment on Tesla
Billionaire investor Baron on Democrats' tax plan: I don't like the proposal | CNBC.com
Guess it's too soon?
Cheers!
Is this still true? I thought the Tesla Model 3 SR+ ordering page recently reduced the range slightly, so I assumed all new orders were getting LFP.
I haven't followed if the range of the Model SR+ was updated on the order page but it's likely it was so that Tesla could start selling the CATL based SR as the regular one for NEW orders.
But......it doesn't change what I'm saying about existing orders that have already been placed, which is already substantial. That's the key part of what I'm pointing out. All of the orders that have already been placed have to be fulfilled as the non-CATL battery SR.
Rotte
Member
GM can 'absolutely' catch Tesla in EV sales by 2025, says CEO Mary Barra
GM CEO Mary Barra told CNBC the automaker can "absolutely" catch Tesla in U.S. EV sales by 2025 with its planned electric vehicles, including a Hummer pickup.
www.cnbc.com
You are a dyed-in-the-wool Terry Pratchett fan. And if by lamentable misfortune you’ve not read his books, run, do not walk, to your nearest bookstore, library, or even to Amazon.
From Monstrous Regiment:
The enemy wasn’t men, or women, or the old, or even the dead. It was just bleedin’ stupid people who came in all varieties. And no one had the right to be stupid.
jhm
Well-Known Member
Great post! I didn't know this is something you did.
I'm wondering if corporate buyers of travel services can score ESG points if they have a policy of renting EVs wherever possible. Moreover, if Hertz had PPAs with wind and solar generators to cover the power needed to keep the fleet charged, this could add even more ESG points to the package. After that, a next step could be to add Tesla Semi to their auto hauler fleets. Essentially they could build a whole net zero carbon ecosystem around the Tesla package for maximum ESG points.
So, maybe I am the one confused here.
But it seems to me you are reading it backwards: Hertz will give dollars to Tesla, not the other way around.
Sorry to say, Tesla never gave me a dollar that had not been lent out in the first place even though I have bought their cars. All of my precioussss comes from holding TSLA stock, and a little bit from derivatives. Very little. Still hodl'n tsla btw.
Oh, I now see @EVMeister and MANY others already made my point.
Pezpunk
Active Member
GM can 'absolutely' catch Tesla in EV sales by 2025, says CEO Mary Barra
GM CEO Mary Barra told CNBC the automaker can "absolutely" catch Tesla in U.S. EV sales by 2025 with its planned electric vehicles, including a Hummer pickup.
"After years of Tesla dominating sales of EVs in the U.S., its market share is waning."
"waning" is such a weird word to use for the term "increasing by about 60% per year".
BitJam
Active Member
He had a private meeting in addition to the public cheer-leading one? I didn't know about that. I'm not surprised. The problem is Diess has already been hamstrung by his board who asked for an alternative way of solving the problems without firing a bunch of people. I think his heart's in the right place but a 3-day meeting with the top 200 managers is not going to solve anything even if Elon is cheering them on. That massive meeting is exactly the kind of thing Elon would never do. It appears Diess can't buck the corporate culture at VW so VW is doomed with the rest of them. If Diess actually followed Elon's advice then he (Diess) would be fired. He certainly wouldn't have had a 3-day meeting with 200 people.
GM can 'absolutely' catch Tesla in EV sales by 2025, says CEO Mary Barra
GM CEO Mary Barra told CNBC the automaker can "absolutely" catch Tesla in U.S. EV sales by 2025 with its planned electric vehicles, including a Hummer pickup.
Attachments
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large numbers.
TheTalkingMule
Distributed Energy Enthusiast
I'm of the opinion that's exactly what he's trying to do. Worst case he's truly in charge of VW, best case he becomes head of Automotive at Tesla.
I think we can all agree Elon's work on cars is mostly done and it's time to move his focus to Energy and SpaceX. He can poke his head back in to make sure the doublings of capacity at various GF's moves optimally.
ZachF
Active Member
GM's revenue this quarter ($26.8b) is now less than double Tesla's ($13.7b) and if you take out the money GM received from LG ($700m) for the Bolt recall, profit was about the same...
In 2016 GM's revenue was 20x Teslas.
2023 Tesla will beat Ford and GM in revenue.
ZachF
Active Member
GM can 'absolutely' catch Tesla in EV sales by 2025, says CEO Mary Barra
GM CEO Mary Barra told CNBC the automaker can "absolutely" catch Tesla in U.S. EV sales by 2025 with its planned electric vehicles, including a Hummer pickup.
In 2023, Tesla will overtake GM in total revenue, nevermind EV sales.
By ~2025 Tesla will have as much revenue as Ford and GM combined.
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