Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[Words of HABIT]

Tesla Energy. Here we come.

Australia switches on Victoria Big Battery powered by Tesla Megapacks

Large energy storage systems based on lithium-ion batteries can prevent blackouts, and help store energy from intermittent resources like solar or wind.

www.cnbc.com

"Lily D’Ambrosio, Australia’s Minister for Energy, Environment and Climate Change, said in a tweet on Wednesday in Australia, “The Victorian Big Battery is here. It’s the biggest battery in the southern hemisphere (able to power more than 650,000 homes for an hour) safeguarding our energy supply through hot days, driving down electricity prices and supporting our massive renewable energy build. Victoria, you should be proud.”"


"(Tesla) said in its financial filing for that period:

“We continue to increase the production of our energy storage products to meet high levels of demand, including beginning construction of our Megafactory in Lathrop, California, but such production is also sensitive to global component constraints. For Megapack, energy storage deployments can vary meaningfully quarter to quarter depending on the timing of specific project milestones.”

The Victorian Big Battery should bring in revenue for that division now that it is switched on."

 

[jhm]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1468763923033722883

Not just on the board of a LIDAR company, she’s directly paid to criticize Tesla as an expert witness.

It seems to be that Dana Hull is starting to peice together that there are political forces working against Musk and Tesla. This sort of intrugue is a very big story for a journalist. There is so much for her to dig into. Why is it a President who claims to want to boost EV can't bring himself to utter a single word of recognition about the efforts of the number one EV maker in the world that happens to be a US company? I get the impression that Dana sees that the politics here are really off kilter here. Something strange is going on here and her investigative instincts should be driving her to try to find out. If she can lay this bare, it would be the biggest scoop of her career.

 

[Words of HABIT]

evergrande-defaults-first-time-china-081022204.html
Could be some headwinds to the general markets this morning with Evergrande now in default for first time. Continued real estate price decline in China.

 

[lascavarian]

It's not "hand-waving" to include all employee compensation. The options have intrinsic value when granted, even before the share price rises one dollar. But I do think the pay and compensation is no better at union shops even if one irrationally excludes that Tesla rewards their employees' efforts with the value they add to the company through stock options, If the compensation data is publicly available, and I doubt it is, I would like to see it but, from everything I've seen, it's a lot better working at Tesla. If it wasn't, they would unionize.

It's wrong for the government to treat companies differently based upon the decisions their employees make in their own best interest. The unions would love to get into Tesla but they can't even get enough votes to consider unionizing. The employees believe they are better off without a union. And I think it's pretty obvious the employees are correct.

The best way to pay workers if the company wishes to engender a sense of ownership in employees is simple stock grants. IMO, options are scam(ish) in the sense that they have little inherent value.

It is simple to grant stock free and clear - real equity. Options, on OTOH, are chips at a casino we call the stock market and generally slightly advantage the business. They may be worth something or nothing.

Companies use different compensation methods at different periods of their growth. So be it.

I like individual responsibility where employees can make their own decisions how they invest. HP used to allow employees to allocate a portion of their wages toward stock or not.

Employers, the same as unions, inevitably make decisions that limit the choices workers have. Choose who you work for carefully. Re-evaluate that decision regularly.

When push come to shove, the business (the owners) come first. Be an owner.

 

[SOULPEDL]

FYI, I think that's a 4680 in the video, here's how.
It's very scientific... using ppt no less. No tricks.

View attachment 742122

It's on a shiny surface is all, mirror reflection all the way down it

I'm having second thoughts on this mirror theory without a better image. The ends of the row don't jive quite so well, and hard to tell in the video.
Oh well, not ruling this out, it was a good exercise in Ratio and Proportions. Them 4680s are fat! Like 2:3 vs 1:3 (2x fatter). I have a trained eye now.

No change in investment, still >90% in TSLA Shares, (and 1 silly Jan call option ITM 850).
Nothing's for sure other than.... what a company... bright future!

 

[jhm]

It's not "hand-waving" to include all employee compensation. The options have intrinsic value when granted, even before the share price rises one dollar. But I do think the pay and compensation is no better at union shops even if one irrationally excludes that Tesla rewards their employees' efforts with the value they add to the company through stock options, If the compensation data is publicly available, and I doubt it is, I would like to see it but, from everything I've seen, it's a lot better working at Tesla. If it wasn't, they would unionize.

It's wrong for the government to treat companies differently based upon the decisions their employees make in their own best interest. The unions would love to get into Tesla but they can't even get enough votes to consider unionizing. The employees believe they are better off without a union. And I think it's pretty obvious the employees are correct.

Agree. Prevailing wage language may be more effective at actually increasing compensation than union language. Specifically, management has the authority to increase wages to bring up to prevailing and beyond, but they do not have the authority to unionize employees. Even if Tesla were paying below prevailing, Tesla could immediately boost wages to catch up. Same for any other EV maker. It would be a good win for the Administration as it could point to any increases in wages as a victory for creating better paying jobs.

 

[SOULPEDL]

evergrande-defaults-first-time-china-081022204.html
Could be some headwinds to the general markets this morning with Evergrande now in default for first time. Continued real estate price decline in China.

Agree, this is potentially a headwind for everyone if left along to wilt. But I give it the same odds as Guitar Center. Someone always seems to bail them out, lol.

Will Shi bail them out, restructure, or set an example? Suspect there's a safety net in the end, but it seems he's letting them sweat bullets trying to come up with a plan to square up the books on their own for a while.

 

[mongo]

The best way to pay workers if the company wishes to engender a sense of ownership in employees is simple stock grants. IMO, options are scam(ish) in the sense that they have little inherent value.

It is simple to grant stock free and clear - real equity. Options, on OTOH, are chips at a casino we call the stock market and generally slightly advantage the business. They may be worth something or nothing.

Companies use different compensation methods at different periods of their growth. So be it.

I like individual responsibility where employees can make their own decisions how they invest. HP used to allow employees to allocate a portion of their wages toward stock or not.

Employers, the same as unions, inevitably make decisions that limit the choices workers have. Choose who you work for carefully. Re-evaluate that decision regularly.

When push come to shove, the business (the owners) come first. Be an owner.

Employee stock options are nothing like calls/puts. For Tesla employees, they represent the ability to purchase shares at a 15% discount to the price at either grant or execution, whichever is lower. This is hands down better than just giving shares as it guarantees a positive return. It also increases potential gains as Tesla can provide more options per person than gifted shares for the same cost due to basis difference.

 

[mongo]

I'm having second thoughts on this mirror theory without a better image. The ends of the row don't jive quite so well, and hard to tell in the video.
Oh well, not ruling this out, it was a good exercise in Ratio and Proportions. Them 4680s are fat! Like 2:3 vs 1:3 (2x fatter). I have a trained eye now.

No change in investment, still >90% in TSLA Shares, (and 1 silly Jan call option ITM 850).
Nothing's for sure other than.... what a company... bright future!

They are 2170s, this is likely the Model Y module.
4680s would result in a pack 13 feet long.

 

[kanweg]

Help appreciated.

There was a post I believe less than a couple of days ago that had calculations showing how the PHEV subsidy seems to be tailor made for GM (?) PHEV battery size.

I tried to find it back using the search tool, but failed.

 

[Skryll]

It seems to be that Dana Hull is starting to peice together that there are political forces working against Musk and Tesla. This sort of intrugue is a very big story for a journalist.

Or maybe fossil fuel is figuring out that if GM and UAW are led to electrify with politics that the influence of fossil fuel dollars will wane and less subsidy for fossil fuel will flow, less consumers will be doing the weekly pilgrimage to the pump to make their donation…

…what better opportunity to put a damper on that by leveraging the dissatisfaction on the EV fanboy side about recognition and put them into an opponent camp against unions and the government in charge.

 

[SOULPEDL]

Help appreciated.

There was a post I believe less than a couple of days ago that had calculations showing how the PHEV subsidy seems to be tailor made for GM (?).

I tried to find it back using the search tool, but failed.

I tried yesterday and again just now. Maybe it was del or linked to twitter but I can't find it either.

 

[TheTalkingMule]

Gordon is literally a cartoon. EV marketshare is too small.....Lol!

 

[15Peter20]

Gordon is literally a cartoon. EV marketshare is too small.....Lol!

Is he back? Kind of missed him.

 

[Unpilot]

Gordon is literally a cartoon. EV marketshare is too small.....Lol!

Thank you for not linking to that cartoon.

That cartoon has gotten as stale as rotten eggs in the sun after a month.

 

[ggies07]

Alrighty, today is the day. I've got nothing to do a work, so I'll be on here allllll day....just waiting.

 

[Discoducky]

I'm buying calls if he's there...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1468938104446894092

 

[Buckminster]

Elon is in Starbase.

 

[SOULPEDL]

CNBC is pushing the bubble popping scare today, giving lots of examples of bursting bubbles.
Then I had this vision of <someone> as a child.

 

[Krugerrand]

As a European looking from the outside in at what's happening in the USA, I think that Tesla (and so are we) is suffering from the battle between two parties in the USA.

Of course the USA president knows very well that Tesla is leading, the man is not a fool. Nor are his advisors.
He knows Tesla is expanding like crazy and is important for the USA economy.
But in the battle between two parties he must get all the possible future votes he can get. So he is convinced he needs the unions.
The result is sending messages about EV's that are utterly incomprehensible.

As a TSLA shareholder I detest them, but to me the reason is obvious.
Just my reasoning, please do not let the above become the beginning of a discussion of politics in this thread, it is not meant for that.

I’m not so easily convinced he knows Tesla ‘facts’. He definitely knows what his advisors and staffers tell him. Where they get their information is a mystery. What their personal agendas are is a mystery.

What isn’t a mystery is his continued union job support platform that he’s stood on for decades, which goes directly back to Elon’s point about age. The people who know most about unions and have worked in unions are people in there 40’s and up. What’s the average age of a Tesla employee again? Yeah, it’s not 40+ so just on that metric it’s not a surprise unions can’t get a foot in Tesla.

Then you consider one side of the scale (union dues/bureaucracy/contract negotiations/strikes) and the other side of the scale (shares/ownership in the company/CEO that works with you side by side), only a shortsighted person says, ‘yeah, I vote union dues and stress, woot!

Yeah, I simplified that scale because going into greater depth isn’t necessary to get the point. Tesla isn’t some sweatshop where workers are treated like cattle. Therefore a union has nothing to offer the employees. Zip, zero, nadda.