Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[wipster]

TSLA investors may be interested in this petition...

This petition is submitted on behalf of retail stockholders who are actively seeking answers and corrective measures regarding the unfair and tyrannical actions that are being seen within the United States stock markets. For far too long, multiple startup companies and veteran companies alike have had their stock price manipulated through the exploitation of certain loopholes in regulations surrounding the practices of naked short-selling, FTDs, phantom shares, and dark pool abuses. While these issues may not seem important to you all, we the army of retail shareholders represented by this petition, are beyond frustrated by the destruction of our investment value due to these manipulative practices at the hands of wall street insiders.

We the retail investors understand that there is an inherent risk with any investments we make. Losing money is a common occurrence in the stock market. However, the exploitation of the naked short-selling regulations undermines the integrity of the US stock markets and jeopardizes investors' trust in market fairness. After the financial crisis in 2008, naked shorting became illegal. The SEC is charged with the responsibility of keeping markets fair for all and delivering oversight of its own policies and regulations.

Sign the Petition

Stop Illegal Naked Shorting

www.change.org

Signed!

 

[lafrisbee]

Now a non-humorous post more on the Investor level...
Me and ELON both remember the debacle at Fremont concerning making the "Automated Dreadnought". I feel as though him not mentioning it during investor day has those "Investors" that know Tesla as well as we do thinking he is trying to hide from his failure of doing so.
He should have prefaced the automation future of Tesla by recognising the previous failure. By doing that it would have made the plan more believable.
Sort of a, "We were naive when we tried it at GigaFremont with the limited brain trust we had, and it was premature. Now technology has advanced at lightspeed over the last 10(?) years, and with our acquired knowledge and companies (that manufacturing company he bought a couple of years back) we have advanced to the point where we have confidence in becoming automated."
That is what I was waiting to hear when he was on the subject of the "next" big thing. I did not. Did I miss it?

And near full automation has always been science fiction at the level Telsa feels it can do. At least that is the view of the common intelligent person. It is pie in the sky. And for decades it has not been doable. Don't expect Investors to go, "Elon said it so it is going to happen."
He tried it once. Why is he trying again.

 

[traxila]

The land around the factory just became much more valuable. No reason to not buy the largest contiguous piece available.

So EM and Tesla are engaging in real estate speculation without having concrete plans for the land?

Maybe. Not convinced.

Still believe the plan is the largest car factory ever built producing 5 million plus vehicles per annum.

 

[NicoV]

It’s now possible to use a Chargemap account to pay for your non-Tesla supercharging sessions. Chargemap claims to charge the Tesla-price without needing a subscription, but it’s not clear to me if that means the Tesla-subscription price or the more expensive non-subscription price:

Tesla Superchargers x Chargemap Pass

New: benefit from a simple, direct charging experience on the Tesla Supercharger network with your Chargemap Pass.

chargemap.com

 

[MP3Mike]

It’s now possible to use a Chargemap account to pay for your non-Tesla supercharging sessions.

From the looks that is just in France right now, and you are still using the Tesla app, it is just that you setup Chargemap as your payment method/credit card in the Tesla app:

So no different than just selecting a different credit card in the Tesla app.

Chargemap claims to charge the Tesla-price without needing a subscription, but it’s not clear to me if that means the Tesla-subscription price or the more expensive non-subscription price:

You are still using the Tesla app to start/pay for charging, so I assume the same rate depending on if you pay for the Tesla monthly subscription or not.

 

[wipster]

I like the "Construction start in 3 months" part the best! But darn now we all gotta find time to watch a whole new series of factory construction videos.

It's a good thing Elon didn't say that...

 

[lafrisbee]

I had that question, too. Seems to go against Tesla DNA if big efficiency losses occur in the charging phase. But this blurb makes the case that at Level 2 AC charging rates, the inductive losses are comparable to plug-in.

Wired vs wireless charging efficiency for EVs: A comparison

Wired vs Wireless Charging Efficiency for EVs: A Comparison

witricity.com

I loved the article. And just to add my vote to wireless charging, too many people have the opinion that charging at home will be a headache, or they are afraid/concerned about having to deal with scary electricity. If wireless charging is in an EV it would have an incremental sales advantage.
THe commercial,: On the screen will be the Display screen in the car showing energy usage as the car pulls into the garage, as the driver gets out the usage displayed will go to zero. Once the car door shuts the screen will come back on and show the vehicle's rate of charge. "And this is how the car is charged."

 

[Creekstalker]

I'd much rather we get that robot snake thing...or I just keep plugging in manually. Wireless charging is very helpful with cell phones as we are constantly picking them up and using them. For cars I don't get it.

You know how Tesla seems to be a step or two ahead of everybody else? Wireless charging is meant to allow my Tesla to be able to recharge on its own so it can get back out there and make money for me by ridesharing while I'm asleep.

 

[Artful Dodger]

Apparently much of the size and complexity of a paint shop is the need to store the BIW between coats so that they can dry. The complexity is driven by the large size and complex shape, while the size is due to most of the BIW volume being air.

Hence the "Investor Day" thumbnail? Is those the Paintshop's drying racks?

Cheers!

 

[lafrisbee]

So EM and Tesla are engaging in real estate speculation without having concrete plans for the land?

Maybe. Not convinced.

Still believe the plan is the largest car factory ever built producing 5 million plus vehicles per annum.

I think Tesla has learned from Shanghai and Austin about not buying enough land before it is disclosed about the Giga real estate they purchased. I don't need to go into the MULTIPLE land acquisitions at much higher valuations after Tesla plunked down their Gigafactories. And yes, the land in Shanghai isn't owned by Tesla but be serious before debating.

 

[JRP3]

I had that question, too. Seems to go against Tesla DNA if big efficiency losses occur in the charging phase. But this blurb makes the case that at Level 2 AC charging rates, the inductive losses are comparable to plug-in.

Wired vs wireless charging efficiency for EVs: A comparison

Wired vs Wireless Charging Efficiency for EVs: A Comparison

witricity.com

I have to call BS on this part:

Last but not least … every time you park and charge wirelessly, you’re more likely to be operating in the 20-80% state of charge (SOC) range that the battery likes – and is the most efficient. With plug-in charging, it’s less likely that the 20-80% SOC range will be maintained since drivers tend to forget to plug-in, or don’t bother when they know they have enough battery left for their next journey. In fact, many people plug in once a week, drive all week, and then plug in on the weekend. Not only is this less efficient but it’s harder on the battery.

If I set my charging to 80% and charge once a week when it gets near 20% it's actually better than charging daily to 80% since most of the time the pack will be sitting at a lower voltage with my usage pattern. That is not less efficient and it's actually easier on the battery, not harder.

 

[Nocturnal]

Let's just hope that in building the Monterey factory Tesla learned from the debacles in the past where rain destroyed the foundations and environmental rules forced them to bulldoze Berlin. /s

You know how Tesla seems to be a step or two ahead of everybody else? Wireless charging is meant to allow my Tesla to be able to recharge on its own so it can get back out there and make money for me by ridesharing while I'm asleep.

It sounds great in theory, I just need to see the numbers on losses etc. I'm sure Tesla won't do it if it doesn't make sense.

 

[Electroman]

V2H makes no sense when batteries get cheap. You will just buy a cheap high-capacity PowerWall.

but but but... when a Tesla is stranded on the side of the road with no charge, who is going to get it going? A powerwall cannot drive itself, but a Ford Lightening with V2G can drive down and save the day. The primary job of Lightening is to save stranded Teslas on the road..

 

[Stretch2727]

Now a non-humorous post more on the Investor level...
Me and ELON both remember the debacle at Fremont concerning making the "Automated Dreadnought". I feel as though him not mentioning it during investor day has those "Investors" that know Tesla as well as we do thinking he is trying to hide from his failure of doing so.
He should have prefaced the automation future of Tesla by recognising the previous failure. By doing that it would have made the plan more believable.
Sort of a, "We were naive when we tried it at GigaFremont with the limited brain trust we had, and it was premature. Now technology has advanced at lightspeed over the last 10(?) years, and with our acquired knowledge and companies (that manufacturing company he bought a couple of years back) we have advanced to the point where we have confidence in becoming automated."
That is what I was waiting to hear when he was on the subject of the "next" big thing. I did not. Did I miss it?

And near full automation has always been science fiction at the level Telsa feels it can do. At least that is the view of the common intelligent person. It is pie in the sky. And for decades it has not been doable. Don't expect Investors to go, "Elon said it so it is going to happen."
He tried it once. Why is he trying again.

Actually I used to cringe when Elon would talk about the "Alien Dreadnought", especially when he talked about making it really dense like a circuit board. Factories need to be flexible and sometimes this means some space to reallocate equipment and product flows.

I think the approach is different now in that they are taking concurrent engineering to a whole new level. Many companies will say they do this but most of the time it is the design engineers reviewing the designs with he manufacturing engineers for some minor tweaks, i.e. changing a fastener, adding a locator etc. They are seriously designing the manufacturing process and equipment along with the product. Also I think manufacturing/supply chain is being given equal or higher priority to drive costs out out of the design. In most companies design engineers will design a product and use what they perceive as the "customer needs" to override the manufacturing engineers. Kind of like just shut up and build it as we know what the customer wants. I have been there, trust me.

 

[MP3Mike]

A powerwall cannot drive itself, but a Ford Lightening with V2G can drive down and save the day.

Just to be pedantic, the Ford Lightning does not have/support V2G. (It has V2L and V2H, when optioned with the extra features/equipment.)

 

[lafrisbee]

I have to call BS on this part:


If I set my charging to 80% and charge once a week when it gets near 20% it's actually better than charging daily to 80% since most of the time the pack will be sitting at a lower voltage with my usage pattern. That is not less efficient and it's actually easier on the battery, not harder.

Ok, Now expand your view just a tinsy winsy little bit, and accept that Tesla would create some software in there that is smarter than you about managing the battery for needed charge vs longevity. And would even let you go in and tinker with it if you feel the need.

 

[Nocturnal]

but but but... when a Tesla is stranded on the side of the road with no charge, who is going to get it going? A powerwall cannot drive itself, but a Ford Lightening with V2G can drive down and save the day. The primary job of Lightening is to save stranded Teslas on the road..

The CT will have 240v outlets in the bed so that will work in a pinch. Just need a little bit of juice to make it to a charger. (I'm still in the V2H/V2G camp though)

 

[Prunesquallor]

TSLA investors may be interested in this petition...

This petition is submitted on behalf of retail stockholders who are actively seeking answers and corrective measures regarding the unfair and tyrannical actions that are being seen within the United States stock markets. For far too long, multiple startup companies and veteran companies alike have had their stock price manipulated through the exploitation of certain loopholes in regulations surrounding the practices of naked short-selling, FTDs, phantom shares, and dark pool abuses. While these issues may not seem important to you all, we the army of retail shareholders represented by this petition, are beyond frustrated by the destruction of our investment value due to these manipulative practices at the hands of wall street insiders.

We the retail investors understand that there is an inherent risk with any investments we make. Losing money is a common occurrence in the stock market. However, the exploitation of the naked short-selling regulations undermines the integrity of the US stock markets and jeopardizes investors' trust in market fairness. After the financial crisis in 2008, naked shorting became illegal. The SEC is charged with the responsibility of keeping markets fair for all and delivering oversight of its own policies and regulations.

Sign the Petition

Stop Illegal Naked Shorting

www.change.org

Signed and tweeted

 

[Artful Dodger]

Frankly I think that if analysts are so bad at their jobs that they can't connect what was presented last night to the trillions of dollars of profits it implies, then they should find another career where they can do less harm to society with their bad decisions.

Lol, you think analysts get paid to do less harm to society with their decisions?

Cheers!

 

[Prunesquallor]

Unless there is a clear reason to buy twice the land (water rights maybe?) that does not translate into planning a factory larger than anything you already have, I disagree.

Give me something and I will change my mind.

A community for the workers, complete with solar roof, Powerwalls and heat pumps.