Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[sparcs]

25% is higher than I thought, although that is number of parts I assume rather than value? Eg a single USA part is the battery, which I would guess is worth more than all the Mexican supplied parts combined.

The bigger risk is to the overall US economy. It could be worse than 5%:

"The statement warned further that if Mexico did not act as Trump demanded, tariffs would go up to 10% by July, 15% by August, 20% by September and reach a permanent level of 25% by October."

 

[InDaClub]

Chevron executive is secretly pushing anti-electric car effort in Arizona

A California lobbyist for Chevron Corp. is urging retirees of the oil company in Arizona to oppose electric-car policies here, saying the vehicles are too expensive for most people and should not be promoted.

A handful of people who either retired from Chevron or from Unocal, which Chevron acquired in 2005, have used the form letter to urge Arizona Corporation Commissioners not to require electric companies here to build electric-car charging stations.

Form letters are commonly used to lobby commissioners, but the secretive nature of this campaign has drawn criticism, including from a retiree who alerted commissioners to the lobbyist's effort.

The letters discourage electric-car infrastructure.

"Let the electric vehicle industry finance the construction of the infrastructure from which it will benefit, rather than burdening most Arizona ratepayers with the costs of supporting the electric vehicle market," wrote Sel Larsen, the president of the Arizona retirees group.

 

[Thekiwi]

Full Mexico tariff will potentially reach 25%:

“To address the emergency at the Southern Border, I am invoking the authorities granted to me by the International Emergency Economic Powers Act. Accordingly, starting on June 10, 2019, the United States will impose a 5 percent Tariff on all goods imported from Mexico. If the illegal migration crisis is alleviated through effective actions taken by Mexico, to be determined in our sole discretion and judgment, the Tariffs will be removed. If the crisis persists, however, the Tariffs will be raised to 10 percent on July 1, 2019. Similarly, if Mexico still has not taken action to dramatically reduce or eliminate the number of illegal aliens crossing its territory into the United States, Tariffs will be increased to 15 percent on August 1, 2019, to 20 percent on September 1, 2019, and to 25 percent on October 1, 2019. Tariffs will permanently remain at the 25 percent level unless and until Mexico substantially stops the illegal inflow of aliens coming through its territory. Workers who come to our country through the legal admissions process, including those working on farms, ranches, and in other businesses, will be allowed easy passage.”

 

[neroden]

That’s not the point. Point is that you believe that they could control each other’s actions. The problem with conspiracy theory is, that it can’t work if participants don’t work together and it requires that no one of the participants betray the others.

This is Prisoner's dilemma - Wikipedia

for participating banks it is best to betray the others, because it offers best expected value.

You believe more on investment banks than I, since you believe, that they would not betray others to gain more money for themselves.

In this setting prisoners dilemma is, that the one bank who betrays the others (i.e. buys cheap) gets all the money.

So there is no rationale not to betray

Oh, you don't understand how this works. The banks sell the stock with their clients' money while buying with their own money. Or vice versa.

 

[lascavarian]

If you missed AutoLine today, there is some Tesla content. Also some mention of rare earth issues.

 

[neroden]

Autonomy day was a geek only event that did nothing to move the stock price, which I think was the intent as a prelude to the cap raise. They would have been better to just keep working on it in silence and blow us away when they release it because really the analysts only used it as negative spin on Tesla and not as a positive.

that being said...since i like Geek stuff...i really enjoyed watching it and would have been bummed to not see it.

IMO, the problem with "autonomy day" is that there were several really good geeky presentations by the autopilot team, followed by Elon making lunatic, unsupportable claims about robotaxis next year, and the team trying not to wince. That latter bit *did not help*. If Musk had just said "So you see we are ahead of everyone else. Thanks for coming!" it would probably have been great.

 

[neroden]

OT

she’s in apt complex as well. no garage. parking lot or street parking. she’s inquiring with complex to see if they’ll add something.

Putting a charger, or a few chargers, on the wall of the building next to the parking lot works.

In California, the apratment owner would actually be *required* to let her install that.
But anywhere else, it is a matter of sweet-talking the apartment owner -- telling them that it's an amenity, it'll attract higher-paying customers, and no, it really doesn't use much electricity (have the numbers ready).

 

[Mars ☰mperor]

T☰SLA Mania on Twitter


Model 3 pricing in China is 328,000

No standard Autopilot included though.

 

[neroden]

Out of ignorance I ask, is this routine? Do Ford or GM have multiple lawsuits pending over bill payments like this? Or is this actually newsworthy?

This is routine. Tesla decided the supplier was no good, terminated the contract (it's right there in the lawsuit!) and this is an argument over payment to the discontinued/jilted supplier. Tesla is probably going to argue that the supplier didn't perform to spec.

 

[LJS22]

So $47000 for China? Well not sure that’s going to boost any numbers

 

[Thekiwi]

T☰SLA Mania on Twitter


Model 3 pricing in China is 328,000

No standard Autopilot included though.

$47.5K USD.

Is that after a sales tax has been added?

 

[Nathan]

Neroden: "OK, so your friend is insane to start with. Living in Manhattan and owning a car is crazy to start with, but doing so without a private parking space is even crazier. He was a lost cause."

I own a model 3, live in Brooklyn (not so different than Manhattan) and park on the street. I have run into several other model 3 owners who do the same. No problems on my end so far. He should have had his friend talk to me.

I charge either at a supercharger in Brooklyn that is 5 minutes from where I live or when i drive in to work and park in garage in Manhattan. It's all quite convenient actually.

 

[Carl Raymond]

Nah, it still won't have an immediate effect.

*When the cash from the pre-orders shows up on the balance sheet in the Q2 10-K*, that might have an effect.

Financially yes. But psychologically an order count in the hundreds of thousands will shut down the cries of “no demand”. The stock is so wound down it’s like a coiled spring, waiting for something to pull the hair trigger. If China gets Tesla fever... that would be something.

 

[Mars ☰mperor]

$47.5K USD.

Is that after a sales tax has been added?

Yes, VAT included.

But there seems to be another 10% purchase tax (like most cars in China, except for some eligible new energy vehicles), no mention of cutting that 10% for Giga Shanghai Model 3 right now.

 

[Curt Renz]

I've placed some potential macro-market moving news in the political thread: Market politics

 

[TMThree]

misinformation affects perception of tesla and affects the stock price. we need more videos like this one

that video makes me want to buy more shares of tsla to support the company

 

[Mars ☰mperor]

So $47000 for China? Well not sure that’s going to boost any numbers

Well the pricing is a little disappointing, no idea if there will be any subsidy.
Most people on China social network are not happy.

At least no Osborne for imported SRP right now.

 

[Thekiwi]

Reuters:

Tesla prices China-made Model 3 at 328,000 yuan as China plan accelerates
BEIJING (Reuters) - U.S. electric vehicle (EV) maker Tesla Inc said on Friday it would price its China-made Model 3 vehicles from 328,000 yuan ($47,529), as it pushes production and sales in the world's largest new-energy vehicle market.

The carmaker has been building a factory in China since January where it will start producing Model 3 cars. Pre-orders for the vehicles will also start on Friday, the company said on its website.

The standard range plus Model 3 is 49,000 yuan cheaper than China's current cheapest version, also standard range plus, even though it remains unclear whether the carmaker will receive China's subsidies for new energy vehicles.

The starting prices for five different versions of China-made Model 3s range from 328,000 to 522,000 yuan. Customers can expect to receive the car in 6-10 months, the company said.

The higher-end version of the Model 3 will still be imported from the United States.

Investors are focused on whether the gross profit margin on the Model 3 will remain around 20 percent in China.

CRUCIAL PRODUCTION

Doubts about the Model 3's production rate and sales performance have hit Tesla's share price in recent months.

Producing cars locally is likely to help Tesla minimize the impact of the U.S.-China trade war, which has forced the EV maker to adjust prices of its U.S.-made cars in China.

Keeping prices in check will also help Tesla fend off competition from a swathe of domestic EV startups such as Nio Inc, Weltmeister and XPeng Motors, as well as established carmakers including Volkswagen and General Motors.

Tesla's so-called Gigafactory is China's first wholly foreign-owned car plant and is seen as a reflection of the country's broader shift to open up its car market.

Pictures of the Shanghai plant posted on Tesla's social-media account showed construction of its main section was nearly done. The company also held a recruitment event this week for car manufacturing and logistics workers.

Tesla forecast its delivery in 2019 would reach 360,000 to 400,000 vehicles and said it may produce as many as 500,000 vehicles if its China factory reaches volume production in the fourth quarter.

(Reporting by Yilei Sun and Brenda Goh; Editing by Stephen Coates)

 

[azaz]

very disappointing china pricing

 

[qunqun]

The price doesn't make sense, it's more expensive than current SR+ 377000(ap+fsd) included, what the point for china factory?