Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[Prunesquallor]

U.S. Democrats' plan boosts EV tax credit eligibility to pricier trucks, SUVs

Democrats in the U.S. House of Representatives released an updated social spending and climate measure on Wednesday that expands a proposed $12,500 tax credit to pricier zero-emission vehicles, while lowering income limits for eligible buyers.

www.reuters.com

WASHINGTON, Nov 3 (Reuters) - U.S. House Democrats released a revised bill on Wednesday here that expands a proposed tax credit of up to $12,500 for electric vehicles to slightly pricier vehicles, while lowering income limits for eligible buyers.

The bill revises pricing for vehicles eligible for the credit: vans, sport utility vehicles and trucks up to $80,000 are eligible, while sedans remain at $55,000 as they were under the prior version.

The earlier version capped credits at $64,000 for vans, $69,000 for SUVs and $74,000 for pickup trucks.

The new proposal limits the full EV tax credit for individual taxpayers reporting adjusted gross incomes of $250,000 or $500,000 for joint filers, down from $400,000 for individual filers and $800,000 for joint filers.

edit: doesn't seem to help Model Y (already under the cap) or Model X (still over the cap)

 

[RobDickinson]

I see nothing good here, unless MY is considered an SUV.

Afik it is considered a SUV

 

[Curt Renz]

Ted-Ed - Oct 26:

 

[Artful Dodger]

Non-Mod post:
I have here in my office the most recent (June 2021) official documentation from S&P DJ Indices:

• U.S. Indices - Methodology
• Equity Indices Policies & Practices
• Index Mathematics

and I cannot find in any of their combined 180 pages any such rule. And, while Lack of Evidence ≠ Evidence of Lack (ie, I may have missed it), there is direct evidence to the contrary. The Rules state that, inter alia, an Index may be a Market Capitalization Index (MCI) or a Capped Market Capitalization Index (CMCI). They further define a CMCI as an index that indeed DOES have such a limit. They specifically define the S&P 500 as an MCI, not as a CMI.

Summary: I believe no such 10% rule exists for the S&P 500. As always, happy to be shown otherwise.

Ah yes, S&P DJI has (at least) two types of indices: "Capitalization Weighted Indices" and "Capped Market Capitalization Indices". The restriction I was reading about applies to the "S&P 500 Equal Weight Index", which is in fact a different index than the "S&P 500 Index". Thanks for the correction.

More details for the curious investor in the source document, here: (mere tip of the iceburg in a sea of PDFs)

S&P Dow Jones Indices Index Mathematics Methodology​

https://www.spglobal.com › spdji › methodologies

Cheers!

P.S. Even more SEC news for the curious about S&P DJI (a joint venture of News Corp), here: (May 17, 2021)

SEC Charges S&P Dow Jones Indices for Failures Relating to Volatility-Related Index https://www.sec.gov › news › press-release​

 

[Cattledog]

Amazing new ATH! Looking forward to a close at $1234.56

Bigger, that's right it bigger, 12,345,678.90

 

[mejojo]

That’s what worries me too. If he dumps….

That would be a self-defeating action. Not gonna happen.

 

[JimS]

1200 is my trigger to feel wealthy enough to buy a Model S, (Blue with white interior, stealth wrap). No, I won’t trade in my Model 3, I love it too much. No, I won’t sell any of my TSLA, 1200 is still much lower than it’s true value!

Wow, we were still in the 800's when I wrote that post, barely over 2 weeks ago. There is no way I envisioned the stock price getting to 1200 in that short of time. So I think I'll move my trigger to 1400.

Then again, some of you may have thought that if I buy a Model S, especially a blue one with white interior and a stealth wrap, others would want to buy a Model S, thus increasing demand, production and/or margins, and consequently share price. If any of you bought stock in reliance upon my post, I might be obligated to place that order. None of you did that, did you?

 

[Singuy]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1456074542447726601

 

[Artful Dodger]

That’s what worries me too. If he dumps….

An even bigger deal if he doesn't let his broker lend out his ~8m shares to shortzes. That's what institutional investors like S&P Index funds do for extra income, but effectively it returns their shares to the float.

I think @DaveT should ask Uncle Leo in their next interview.

Cheers!

 

[Discoducky]

An even bigger deal if he doesn't let his broker lend out his ~8m shares to shortzes. That's what institutional investors like S&P Index funds do for extra income, but effectively it returns their shares to the float.

I think @DaveT should ask Uncle Leo in their next interview.

Cheers!

Makes you wonder if he knows that is an option?

 

[Tyler34]

An even bigger deal if he doesn't let his broker lend out his ~8m shares to shortzes. That's what institutional investors like S&P Index funds do for extra income, but effectively it returns their shares to the float.

I think @DaveT should ask Uncle Leo in their next interview.

Cheers!

What's even better is to lend them out, and then during a squeeze, ask for them back. Hmm

 

[MP3Mike]

An even bigger deal if he doesn't let his broker lend out his ~8m shares to shortzes. That's what institutional investors like S&P Index funds do for extra income, but effectively it returns their shares to the float.

I think @DaveT should ask Uncle Leo in their next interview.

He mentioned that he lost most of his shares in the past due to margin calls. And if you are using margin you are making your shares available to your brokerage to be lent out. (At no gain to yourself, other than the margin.) So I suspect it is highly likely he is still using margin. (Hopefully a more sustainable amount so that he doesn't get margin calls that force him to sell his shares.)

 

[Accident]

U.S. Democrats' plan boosts EV tax credit eligibility to pricier trucks, SUVs

Democrats in the U.S. House of Representatives released an updated social spending and climate measure on Wednesday that expands a proposed $12,500 tax credit to pricier zero-emission vehicles, while lowering income limits for eligible buyers.

www.reuters.com

WASHINGTON, Nov 3 (Reuters) - U.S. House Democrats released a revised bill on Wednesday here that expands a proposed tax credit of up to $12,500 for electric vehicles to slightly pricier vehicles, while lowering income limits for eligible buyers.

The bill revises pricing for vehicles eligible for the credit: vans, sport utility vehicles and trucks up to $80,000 are eligible, while sedans remain at $55,000 as they were under the prior version.

The earlier version capped credits at $64,000 for vans, $69,000 for SUVs and $74,000 for pickup trucks.

The new proposal limits the full EV tax credit for individual taxpayers reporting adjusted gross incomes of $250,000 or $500,000 for joint filers, down from $400,000 for individual filers and $800,000 for joint filers.

edit: doesn't seem to help Model Y (already under the cap) or Model X (still over the cap)

I don’t understand the reason to keep a much lower limit for sedans.

This would make the MYP cheaper than a more efficient M3P. For non-Tesla EVs it means the Rivian R1T, Cadillac Lyric, and Audi etron get the full credit, but sedans like the Polestar 2 or BMW i4 get excluded. It makes no sense to me.

 

[AudubonB]

I first labeled our new large shareholder as someone to watch with a cautious eye (my exact words were far stronger), and little has caused me to change my opinion.
That never-failing arbiter of Truth, the internet, pegged him as having a net worth of some $3 billion at the time he burst on the TSLA screen. That his company is worth $11 billion means little - first, what fraction is his and second, how much of its assets has he access to?
Unless he has utterly perfectly played the derivatives casino - and has he not admitted he messed up there? - then I strongly suspect he has indebted himself greatly.

 

[redan]

Giga Shanghai quickly removing financing incentives as demand is too strong:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1456110534340722692

 

[SwTslaGrl]

Should Diess find himself back on the CEO job market, I wonder if Musk would have any interest in bringing him on.

Perhaps Diess could run a Diffusion Line for Tesla; -Low price and high volume, bring your own iPad as center screen

 

[Cult Member]

Brisk buying interest in the After-hrs session: (over 1.5M chairs traded)

View attachment 729068

TSLA After-Hours Quotes​

Data last updated Nov 03, 2021 08:00 PM ET.
This page will resume updating on Nov 04, 2021 04:00 PM ET.

Consolidated Last Sale	$1,217.49 +3.63 (+0.30%)
After-Hours Volume	1,512,002
After-Hours High	$1,218.99 (07:46:37 PM)
After-Hours Low	$667.8173 (05:09:13 PM)

We do have an uncommon situation this week that is always confusing me: due to the one week difference in daylight saving time adjustment, we Europeans see one hour more trading after the closing bell in US. Interesting to watch Tradegate (Berlin) at this time.

 

[StealthP3D]

No wonder BMW et al are doing all they can to slow down/ block Gruneheide / Berlin Giga 4

IQ quiz for the top brains here: what is the best way to counteract this in other words, what is EMSK (Elon) doing about it?

It looks to me that Musk is telling the German auto industry that slowing down Tesla from producing cars in Germany is counter-productive because Tesla will simply divert cars from the Chinese market and import them to Germany. So, not only are the cars not BMWs, they are not even German made. Tesla will continue to do this until they have permits to produce in Germany.

 

[Tes La Ferrari]

That roadster is itching for me too.

In todays edition of “First world problems”; I too have contemplated a roadster; but I pause for two reasons: 1) because I think about what $50k in TSLA will do in the meantime and 2) I’m attached to my TMC username.

When delivery dates get closer I too will likely experience roadster FOMO.

 

[Surfer of Life]

He mentioned that he lost most of his shares in the past due to margin calls. And if you are using margin you are making your shares available to your brokerage to be lent out. (At no gain to yourself, other than the margin.) So I suspect it is highly likely he is still using margin. (Hopefully a more sustainable amount so that he doesn't get margin calls that force him to sell his sharesthan

Do you actually have to have less than 100% equity percentage before the broker can lend your shares, or does your broker get free reign over your shares regardless for being in a margin account?